329 replies to this topic

[willrusso]

Jones133, on Jan 3 2006, 10:03 AM, said:

......I live in Caraleigh Mills which was built in 1892......

Wow, hello neighbor.  I live around the corner from you in that newish apartment complex at Lake Wheeler and the Beltline.  I drive down Maywood Ave every day en route to work.  I've always wanted to see what the inside of Caraleigh Mills looks like.

Edited by willrusso, 04 January 2006 - 12:22 AM.

[pack-man]

I heard there is an indoor pool there.

[Jones133]

willrusso, on Jan 4 2006, 01:21 AM, said:

Wow, hello neighbor.  I live around the corner from you in that newish apartment complex at Lake Wheeler and the Beltline.  I drive down Maywood Ave every day en route to work.  I've always wanted to see what the inside of Caraleigh Mills looks like.

You just missed the annual open house/christmas party. If you know a realtor you can always ask for the key codes for the 5 units still for sale...the main gate is still open in the daytime. Also checking out the units via MLS yieds some decent pictures, one resale of a couple that moved to Hawaii is really nice.

Edited by Jones133, 04 January 2006 - 03:21 PM.

[Jones133]

To anyone interested in this sort of thing....the Fayetteville St project has exposed a portion of the old street car  tracks at Fayetteville and Morgan.....it is pretty cool with it being part of the interchange, one track starts off down Fayetteville and the other continues east on Morgan, I could see four separate rails about 10 foot sections of each. Maybe a cool photo-op.

[pack-man]

I mentioned this same thing earlier in the thread when they were tearing up Hillsborough St.  It is pretty cool to think that street cars were running up and down these streets.  It would be pretty cool if they still had them.  

I think they should get them back!

[MireLanski]

Yesterday, I had to go price a custom subwoofer enclosure for my car.  After that I had a few hours to play with before I took my MCP exam.  I decided to venture DT.  And stumbled upon a jewel.  I had to run through my knowledge of history when I pulled in front of a all yellow two story house on West Hargett that said Joel Lane's House.

I quickly realized that Joel Lane was the owner of the 1000 acres that was purchased to become Raleigh.  So one can assume that the house is old.  But...then I thought...wow...this was the only house in the county at the time.  There was no county.  In fact, there was nothing for miles of this plantation house.  So Raleigh came about in 1792 from a purchase of a land that occured in this house.  The house is older than 200 years.  It is said to have been built around 1760-75.  

I and the girlfriend toured the house.  The parlor is is believed to have been the birthplace of 1000 issued deeds in the county.  The bedroom in the public space on the 1st floor was believed to be a tavern which Gov. Tyron. and is wife Meridith Wake where rumored to board.  Yes, that is Wake as in Wake County.  Thank god for her.  Our county was very close to being named after a current Boylan Condo project, Bloomsbury.  

So the house faces South on Hargett which also faces the Bloomsbury project.  The house originally was closer to Boylan.  About 300 feet from it's current location.  And it faced DT.  But that was many many many, you get the idea, many years ago.  

The condition of the house is incredible.  This is my first visit to a 200 + year old house with this kind of importance and history.  

The average height for a man 2 centuries ago was about 5'6 (I think that was considered tall, exception, Abraham Lincoln).  Given that the first floor's ceiling is 14 feet tall.  Upstairs it is more like 6'8.  Which was actually raised to that height.  Yes, when you are barely 5'6 you don't need but a few more inches of head clearance.  I guess this gave his children the impression that he was tall( humor).  I am 6'6 so I would of just been a freak to his 12 children.  I viewed their upstairs bedroom.  Which was no larger than your average bedroom.  I'd say about 14 X 16.  Most of the furniture was from the period andmanufactured in NC.  But, it was not the original furniture.  But, Joel Lanes desk still remained.  The structural integrity of everything including the desk is the likes that I have never seen.  No extensive interior restoration has been done and the home literally looks worthy of residence.  

From the homes original egg shaped door knob and lock to the L-shaped hinges with the original leather washers, this slave built home deserves attention.  Besides, your tour guide goes all out by dressing in garbs from that time.  He is a real knowledgeable curator.  

Admission was $1 for students and $4 for adults.  Well worth the time!!!!

Edited by MireLanski, 12 March 2006 - 01:11 PM.

[bdp]

awww how nice.  thanks for posting this.

[Jones133]

MireLanski, on Mar 12 2006, 12:38 PM, said:

I quickly realized that Joel Lane was the owner of the 1000 acres that was purchased to become Raleigh.  So one can assume that the house is old.  But...then I thought...wow...this was the only house in the county at the time.  There was no county.  In fact, there was nothing for miles of this plantation house.  So Raleigh came about in 1792 from a purchase of a land that occured in this house.  The house is older than 200 years.  It is said to have been built around 1760-75.  

So the house faces South on Hargett which also faces the Bloomsbury project.  The house originally was closer to Boylan.  About 300 feet from it's current location.  And it faced DT.  But that was many many many, you get the idea, many years ago.  

The condition of the house is incredible.  This is my first visit to a 200 + year old house with this kind of importance and history.

Its an awesome place. Some more tidbits though... there were several thousand people in Wake County by 1763 many of them as affluent as Joel Lane but also many of them slaves. The Hinton's of eastern Wake for example (Johnston County back then) had been well established since about 1740 and by 1763 probably accounted for upwards of 200 free and enslaved people. I do know of one house for certain in Garner on Colonial drive that dates to 1743 so Lane's house is not the oldest left standing which is a common misnomer. Bloomsbury functioned more like a small town with the Wake County Courthouse built in 1771 and its associated activities, and the confluence of several major roads making this area very active. The Joel Lane family cemetary was located behind Crockers on Morgan Street and was unearthed by accident in the 1970's after having been paved over years earlier. The graves were relocated to City Cemetary on East Street.

[Atlside]

Washington Duke Hotel later renamed the Jack Tar Hotel

Washington Duke Hotel. Construction. July 16, 1924
http://dclibrary.net...photos/e205.jpg

http://www.dclibrary...photos/e213.jpg

Washington Duke Hotel- Construction. November 3, 1924
http://dclibrary.net...photos/e208.jpg

Washington Duke Hotel. Construction. ca. January, 1925.
http://www.dclibrary...photos/e211.jpg

Washington Duke Hotel. Construction Feb.4, 1925
http://www.dclibrary...photos/e212.jpg

http://www.dclibrary...photos/e214.jpg

http://www.dclibrary...photos/e216.jpg

Washington Duke Hotel. April, 1925
http://www.dclibrary...photos/e219.jpg

http://www.dclibrary...photos/e230.jpg

Durham 1925
http://www.dclibrary...toarch/e056.htm

http://www.dclibrary...photos/d186.jpg

Washington Duke Hotel- Lobby 1925
http://dclibrary.net...photos/e220.jpg

Martin Luther King, Jr., addresses the Southern Political Science Association at Durham's Jack Tar Hotel November 13, 1964.
http://www.durhamcou.../dcrhp/mlk5.htm

Edited by Atlside, 21 October 2006 - 05:46 PM.

[NCMike1981]

Man I wish the Washington Duke had been saved....didn't it rival the CCB/Suntrust tower heightwise? It reminds me of a building that would fit in perfectly on Front St in Wilmington....

Edited by NCMike1981, 21 October 2006 - 02:43 AM.

[dmccall]

Thanks for the lesson. I never knew about that building, and would certainly be great to still have it (although it would just be full of old people who don't spend money at street level retail)

Roanoke, VA was the first thing that came to mind when I read the thread title. They have a tudor-styled grand hotel downtown and a thriving commercial district. The city is about the size of Durham and was once a very wealthy railroad center, so like Durham, there was a lot of money back in the era when people built great houses.

[NCMike1981]

I think I read somewhere that the building was slowly falling into disrepair by the time it was demolished in the mid '70's. I believe it had become a bit seedy under the Jack Tar moniker and was closed for a few years before the city bought or recieved it and decided to tear it down in hopes of getting a better building in it's place. Was anything ever built on the former lot or is it an empty lot today?

[danclever]

NCMike1981, on Oct 22 2006, 02:13 AM, said:

I think I read somewhere that the building was slowly falling into disrepair by the time it was demolished in the mid '70's. I believe it had become a bit seedy under the Jack Tar moniker and was closed for a few years before the city bought or recieved it and decided to tear it down in hopes of getting a better building in it's place. Was anything ever built on the former lot or is it an empty lot today?

Yeah, at that time there was little will to spend money on that kind of restoration.  Out with the old- in with the new.  

It remained an open lot since its demolition.  Up until the current plaza reconstruction, it was a parking lot.  I'm kind of glad they didn't put something new in it's place, given the architectural fads of the time.  

Before the Washington Duke/Jack Tar I think the city hall occupied that space.  The post office originally sat where the CCB/Suntrust Tower is today.

[JDC]

It'd be a lot cooler if they kept the hotel and never built the "WE WANT OPRAH" building.

At least we've got the Marriott now, where I recently spotted some U. Miami football players.

[Jones133]

Found these two maps a while back.  The 1920 bluebook map has Boylan Heights as the most recent development shown.  You can see how it is the first divergence from Raleigh's grid pattern.  The 1951 Topo shows the huge explosion northward,  post WWII facilitated by automobiles. Inner city flight was in full bloom soon to be facilitated by big time road improvements in the mid 50's. You can almost smell the beltline cooking....

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Edited by Jones133, 27 October 2006 - 07:05 PM.

[dmccall]

Jones133, on Oct 27 2006, 09:04 PM, said:

Found these two maps a while back.  The 1920 bluebook map has Boylan Heights as the most recent development shown.  You can see how it is the first divergence from Raleigh's grid pattern.  The 1951 Topo shows the huge explosion northward,  post WWII facilitated by automobiles. Inner city flight was in full bloom soon to be facilitated by big time road improvements in the mid 50's. You can almost smell the beltline cooking....

So...in 1920 you could get to Oxford by traveling north OR south?!!  

the 1951 map is most interesting in that it has Anderson Drive, but there's no Wade Ave. I suppose Wade is the result of a little connector here and there to make a full-fledged artery, kind of like Shelley Rd's morph into Millbrook.

Edited by dmccall, 27 October 2006 - 10:46 PM.

[Transplant]

These are interesting maps. Although we can blame the automobile, the train tracks really appear to be a major facilitator to the lack of the grid.

As heavy industry moves away from DT, I hope the city state and RR work to realign these. Yes, I understand there are rail yards inside the beltline, but its still a pipe dream of mine.

Edited by Transplant, 30 October 2006 - 08:44 AM.

[orulz]

Transplant, on Oct 30 2006, 10:43 AM, said:

These are interesting maps. Although we can blame the automobile, the train tracks really appear to be a major facilitator to the lack of the grid.

As heavy industry moves away from DT, I hope the city state and RR work to realign these. Yes, I understand there are rail yards inside the beltline, but its still a pipe dream of mine.

I've put a great deal of thought about this too given my obsession with railroads. The lines south & west of downtown aren't really a problem and would be very difficult indeed to relocate, but to the north there is a great opportunity for consolidation. The two railroads heading north from downtown don't just hinder the city's connectivity, they are also an operational burden for the railroads.

The Norfolk Southern line next to Glenwood Avenue and west of Capital Boulevard should be deactivated, and become a rail-trail (or maybe transit - a way for light rail on Glenwood to bypass Glenwood South) while freight trains could be on a shared CSX alignment east of Capital and parallel to TTA, as far north as Edgetonwhere the lines cross beneath Wake Forest Road. The biggest reason this can't or hasn't happened yet is that Norfolk-Southern's busy Glenwood Yard is on the segment that would be deactivated. The yard, however, is tiny (as freight yards go), not very modern, physically constrained, and in the Roanoke Park historic neighborhood so it has significant potential for redevelopment, and could help to reconnect Captial with the rest of town. If NCRR bought a large lot directly on the tracks between Raleigh and Garner, we could certainly bring Norfolk-Southern to the table.

Bringing CSX to the table would be more difficult. They would benefit from removal of the diamond at Edgeton and simplified freight transfers to/from Norfolk-Southern, but besides that only money would talk, since it would probably require re-negotiation of the entire TTA deal. The yard would need to lose some capacity for an added through-track. We might also lose one or both of the canopies at the historic Seaboard station (Logan Trading Co.)if we are to fit the two-track TTA line as well as a consolodated freight main line between the station building and the Cotton Mill. Something else that would be nice (but expensive) would be grade separations at Harrington/West, and a few streets across (under?) the yard - probably Wade or Fairview connecting to Halifax.

Edited by orulz, 30 October 2006 - 10:18 AM.

[orulz]

RE the 1920 map- Am I correct in my assumption that the bolded streets are streetcar lines?

[Transplant]

orulz, on Oct 30 2006, 01:23 PM, said:

RE the 1920 map- Am I correct in my assumption that the bolded streets are streetcar lines?

Interesting question. I assumed they were simply the 'main' streets. These would be appropriate locations for street cars though.