249 replies to this topic

[Green_man]

So the city applied for federal funding... what happens next?  When do we hear if we receive funding?  Does the design phase start then or is it already underway with the city's portion of the bill?  I guess the question I'm really getting at is, when will we see actual progress in the form of construction?

(Sorry, over the years, Raleigh has taught me to "believe it when I see it" - just too many projects falling through)

[kermit]

^ The deadline for the TIGER III program is March 19. The DOT renders decisions on these grants quickly (in federal time) -- certainly before the DNC. Judging by NC's status as a swing state and the administration's fondness for rail I would say Raleigh has a better than average chance to land the cash.

[orulz]

From the description it sounds like Raleigh is proposing for a federal grant to cover 80% of a $70 million project. That's $56 million. For comparison, not a single TIGER grant awarded in 2011 was higher than $20 million. You have to go back to 2009 to find a TIGER grant that big, and there was a lot more money available for TIGER in that year. I see it as extremely unlikely that the entire project will be funded.

I suppose it's possible that Raleigh will get funding for one part of the project. There are three components, each of which could be mostly or completely built with $20 million TIGER funds plus the required $5 million (20%) local match.

(1) Track reconfiguration & new NCRR platform
(2) Viaduct building conversion to station
(3) West Street Extension

[Green_man]

According to today's City Council Agenda:  NCDOT proposed the following funding distribution:

• Station development: 80% federal, 10% state, 10% city
  
• Rail/track/platform improvements: 80% federal, 20% state
  
• Street improvements: 80% federal, 20% city

And then this brings the City's share of the project cost to ~$7 million ($4 million more than the $3 mil from the bond just passed).

The agenda also mentions "Triangle Transit has committed to being a partner in the application process, but is not in a position to offer a specific financial contribution at this time."

The uncertainty of our application worries me - especially with the history orulz provided.

Our current proposal doesn't even address future expansion and integration with all the TTA buildings.  If only we had the funds and foresight to pull off a Union Station development similar to Denver's under construction right now.

[Green_man]

This is the kind of development we need above the wye.

... Place proposed at DC Union Station)

Would connect the street grid for walkability between districts separated by the tracks.  Would provide usable space where there currently is none, both for mid- to high-rise buildings and also for open/park space.  Maybe there are complicating factors since there is active freight traffic on these tracks - but there are engineered solutions to solve that.  The major factors preventing a large-scale development like this are just shortsightedness and lack of ambition.

[orulz]

Green_man, on 13 March 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

This is the kind of development we need above the wye.

http://www.burnhamplace.com/index.html  (Burnham Place proposed at DC Union Station)

Would connect the street grid for walkability between districts separated by the tracks.  Would provide usable space where there currently is none, both for mid- to high-rise buildings and also for open/park space.  Maybe there are complicating factors since there is active freight traffic on these tracks - but there are engineered solutions to solve that.  The major factors preventing a large-scale development like this are just shortsightedness and lack of ambition.

There is a serious lack of buildable land in downtown DC. Office rents are astronomical - higher than anywhere else in the country except the most expensive parts of Midtown Manhattan. Land values are way, way higher than in Raleigh. Union Station, in particular, is about two or three minutes walk from all the senate offices and and about a half mile from the house offices, in other words: heaven for lobbyists, who have notoriously deep pockets. Even so, Burnham Place has been in the works since 2002 - that's a decade now - and continues to struggle to get off the ground.

So therefore, I would add a third item to your list of what is preventing something like that from being built in Raleigh: financial feasibility.

I have nothing wrong with planning for something like that to be built at Union Station in Raleigh in the future, but I'm pretty sure we won't see anything of the sort here for at least the next 25 years, probably 50.

[Green_man]

Yesterday, the City, NCDOT, and TTA applied for TIGER funding for the first phase of the Union Station project.  Announcement of decision is likely this fall.

There are 2 renderings in the City's press release on their website that I haven't seen before.  However, they are very small.  Any idea where to find larger images? (and more images?)

[Euphorius]

Thought I would share this http://dl.dropbox.co...iagram copy.pdf. It's a rendering of the proposed layout of whatever this place is being called now. It certainly isn't fitting of the name Union Station. Something tells me that in a decade or two, when this thing is outdated, there will be massive public outcry against spending more money to build another version of this. We will be relegated to planning for the new one for 30 years, the same way rail transit has went around here.

[orulz]

The way I think about it, we're buidling the "phase one" of the future Raleigh multimodal complex. When the whole complex build out is completed with air rights development and all that 30 years from now, this station will basically serve as the "south concourse".

[Jones133]

I like the plan. It expands easily and I agree with Orulz