56 replies to this topic

[MJLO]

It's official, Phoenix city council, approved the 3billion dollar expansion of the airport.  They'll start planning for the underground tram system immediately.  I think it's outstanding, that airports already under a heavy load of construction, I can't imagine what it's going to be like when they follow thru with all of these plans!

I had no idea that the rental car facility cost 300 million!!! That's insane to me.  what do they have in there? Gold Plated walls?

[MJLO]

Terminal 2 renovation work almost complete

Does anyone else get annoyed knowing they sunk 24million dollars into T2 when they are going to tear it down in a couple of years?

[colin]

What's this tearing down T2 business? Por que?

Also rode through Sky Harbor on Valley Metro's fabulous Red Line on the way to Downtown. The only people riding it (late Saturday afternoon) were airport employees. And, btw, the Red Line would be the main route taken over by the light rail line since it runs from Downtown PHX to Downtown Tempe.

[MJLO]

I'll tell you right now Colin, If I had to take a flight out for a few days and I didn't want to mess with parking my car, you'd see my rear end on those trains heading to the airport.  I know i'm a different bird.  I think you'll see people warming up to the trains more as infill continues.  That's a good thing for lightrail, Sky Harbors proximity to downtown.  It wouldn't take long at all to get there if you were a socialite living in a high rise downtown.  Although, PHX socialites drive gigantic gas guzzling cars, it's the New York ones who use mass transit for everything.

[colin]

Ya know, not only does NYC have a fabulous transit system, but Upstate New York is also awesome. For instance, Buffalo is the smallest city in the country to have a subway (it was Rochester, but their subway was closed in the '50's) and Syracuse even has a light rail system. These are both metros with 1/4 or less the population of Phoenix's. Granted though, that they're more established and have had more time to develop their transit. But I'm all about New York right now as I'm planning a trip up there.

As long as they develop the park and ride properly, and have some sort of way to deal with multi-day parking, then ridership will be fine for Sky Harbor. You could almost think of it like an extra-extended economy lot, and I think many people will as well. I didn't mind parking there after driving from Tucson until they raised the rates so much. If I could drive up and park somewhere else, or, better yet, take a train from Tucson and catch the light rail to the airport, I would totally do it.

But why is Terminal 2 going to be torn down?

[MJLO]

Terminal 2 is going to be torn down because, Sky Harbor is still growing at a fast clip, and the airport will reach passenger capacity in the near future if they don't expand.  I believe Terminal 2 will be built in the style of T4 which was built to be expaned (It's now as big as it can get with the eighth concourse being built.  The current T2 Is the reason Sky harbor blvd is all wonky)  It's disorganzied given the way the airport is laid out.  It's antiquated, and the design cannot efficiently be expanded upon.

[colin]

Renovation of old Sky Harbor terminal nearly complete

So this article says 2013. Not really a couple of years, so I understand the need for the current renovation.

[MJLO]

i'm telling you right now, being an official for an airport vendor.  Timelines change

[MJLO]

Sky Harbor projected to be at capacity by 2025?



They keep talking about making Williams Gateway a reliever airport.  But to make that viable wouldn't it take millions to really get it from a small passenger airport, to one that handles millions of passengers?

[colin]

Yes, not only would you run into the problems of other reliever airports with inter-airport transit (of which Phoenix is years, years and years away from ever coming close to having, if even that), but you also to build in the facilities that aren't there already: rental cars, luggage processing, hangars, maintainence, etc.
I don't know a damn thing about airports, but I do know that using a reliever is usually not the answer.

[colin]

Automated train to help ease curbside congestion at Sky Harbor

More on the train. 2013 before it even starts.
Sigh

[MJLO]

It seems like everything in Arizona happens 40years after it's happened everywhere else.  But the  preparation and construction are massive for these kind of things.  I would imagine we'll see prep work for it soon.

[Delta767-300ER]

I have flown in/out of PHX at least 6 times.  The airlines were a mix of Delta, TWA, and the former America West.  

I believe I flew into Terminal 2 with TWA back in 2000.  The terminal was old, hot, and cramped.  Terminal's 3 & 4 seemed very modern and spacious.  I never had any problems getting to/from PHX other than traffic.

IMO, The airport is very modern with a desert feel to it.  I just wish the airlines would fly larger aircraft into PHX.

Could PHX build another runway over the freeway like ATL did?

-Delta767-300ER

[nuplanner]

The airport does have larger aircraft.  The British airways 747 flys into sky harbor everyday on the north runway.  It is the longest and can handle airplanes that size.  

About a 4th runway, they can not go south due to the riverbed.  The airport continues to buy up land north and west of the airport.  They want the 4th run way on the north side but the rail corridor is the limit of going north and the city of Tempe continues to fight them on every aspect of the airport.  

Terminals 3 and 4 are nice to a point, but the airport in general needs an upgrade in appearance.  The surrounding area does not look good and its just plain concrete ugliness when you fly in.

[cueball1914]

Can anyone tell me, what genius decided NOT to route light rail directly through the airport terminals?
Or did they purposely route it to where the terminals will be in a future expansion, since they can go no further South?
In any case this decision seems the height of stupidity, even for Phoenix, poster child of bad planning decisions...

[nuplanner]

I know what you mean man.  What I heard why they were not able to go through the airport is becase of its design.  When terminal 3 and 4 were built they did not think of a light rail system would go into the airport.  I guess if they would have built some of the supports or something to that affect, they could have brought it into the airport.  Cost is the major reason tho.  That’s another reason why the people mover will cost so much.

[MJLO]

As I understand it tho, they are straightening out Sky Harbor BLVD, Making a T4 twin where the current T2 stands, and having a tram/subway run from the light rail station on the east to the car rental facilities.