17 replies to this topic

[webbage]

Read this in the projo today...

http://www.projo.com...KI.328246e.html

What do you guys think about this?

[Baines]

webbage, on Jun 20 2007, 05:29 PM, said:

Read this in the projo today...

http://www.projo.com...KI.328246e.html

What do you guys think about this?

It is an outrage. You have here an elected official sworn to obey the laws deliberately acting to stop enforcement of law..federal law in this case. It is a clear effort to permit non-enforcement of the invasion of illegal aliens into our nation.

Note the use of "undocumented" instead of illegal. Let me ask you, if I break into your home, hide in a room for several days, and then are discovered, do you call the police and have me arrested and removed or have I earned the right to stay? Am I an uninvited guest or a criminal intruder?

Does the next ordinance stop police from enforcing the burglary of your home if it is done by an "undocu
mented"? How about being a sanctuary for all criminals - foreign and domestic?

This guy must be stopped and I, now that I am a resident of the city, will take this one to the wall. I intend to write to him, th Mayor, my Councilman, and Esserman.

[webbage]

Baines, on Jun 20 2007, 06:20 PM, said:

It is an outrage. You have here an elected official sworn to obey the laws deliberately acting to stop enforcement of law..federal law in this case. It is a clear effort to permit non-enforcement of the invasion of illegal aliens into our nation.

Note the use of "undocumented" instead of illegal. Let me ask you, if I break into your home, hide in a room for several days, and then are discovered, do you call the police and have me arrested and removed or have I earned the right to stay? Am I an uninvited guest or a criminal intruder?

Does the next ordinance stop police from enforcing the burglary of your home if it is done by an "undocu
mented"? How about being a sanctuary for all criminals - foreign and domestic?

This guy must be stopped and I, now that I am a resident of the city, will take this one to the wall. I intend to write to him, th Mayor, my Councilman, and Esserman.

That's exactly the way I feel. My favorite example of that term is that a drug dealer is technically an "undocumented" pharmacist.

Sadly since I don't live in PVD I really can't write anyone.

[semass]

webbage, on Jun 20 2007, 08:24 PM, said:

That's exactly the way I feel. My favorite example of that term is that a drug dealer is technically an "undocumented" pharmacist.

Sadly since I don't live in PVD I really can't write anyone.

I don't know how Rhode Island views it but Massachusetts makes a distinction between an illegal alien who was illegal from the moment they set foot in this country and an undocumented alien who entered the country on a valid visa and didn't leave when the visa expired.

[runawayjim]

while i have mixed feelings on the whole issue of illegal immigrants and what's going on in congress right now (or not going on since they couldn't get it to vote), i don't think the city law enforcement should be ignoring federal law.

illegal immigrants are important to our country, whether you think so or not.  they work jobs that most americans wouldn't even consider working, some of these jobs are important, like farm hands and maintenance.  in many cases, they work for less than minimum wage.  why?  because it's still a whole lot more money than they'd make if they were in their own countries.  in that way, they're better off here.  however, i think that those laws should be changed rather than kicking out the immigrants and building walls that will be scaled and fences that will be cut and having armed guards at the nations borders watching for people looking for a better life for their children.  isn't that what this country is about to begin with?

[webbage]

runawayjim, on Jun 20 2007, 09:03 PM, said:

illegal immigrants are important to our country, whether you think so or not.  they work jobs that most americans wouldn't even consider working

What about all the Americans that have lost jobs to the illegal immigrants?

[Jerry2]

No comment........Miguel Luna, David Segal etc. working in tandem to make the city of Pvd and the state of RI a better place for ALL!!!

[runawayjim]

webbage, on Jun 20 2007, 11:35 PM, said:

What about all the Americans that have lost jobs to the illegal immigrants?

i have a feeling they work more jobs that americans won't do than they have "taken" from americans.

and honestly... it's simple economics.  if someone is willing to work for less, why pay them more?  sure, "it's the right thing to do".  but this is a capitalist country.  the right thing to do never involves spending more money than necessary.

i'm all for amnesty for illegal immigrants, but they need some sort of punishment and we need to make sure more don't cross the border to "make the cut".  however, i also don't think armed guards, walls, and fences are the answer.  because, as semass mentioned, many of these "illegal" immigrants started off legal and just stayed longer than their visa allowed.

[dgreco]

webbage, on Jun 20 2007, 11:35 PM, said:

What about all the Americans that have lost jobs to the illegal immigrants?

i hate that argument even on the main board. I know the owners of a company (cleaning) and they couldn't get an american to work that job. they don't pay below min. wage, they pay somewhere in the 9 dollar range, which is still decent. But you would never get americans to do these jobs(and keep them past a month) and people say it is the business owners who are at fault. If anything they are helpnig keep the economy in a cycle. The american dream is not about dropping out of school and becoming a maintance worker, it is getting an education and living a successful and comfortable life. Why should we cater to americans who wont take advantage of an education?

Edited by dgreco, 21 June 2007 - 07:40 AM.

[Dan]

Providence Journal article
6/20/2007

"One ordinance would make Providence a “sanctuary city” — preventing city employees or the police from inquiring into the immigration status of city residents, or from reporting undocumented immigrants to federal immigration officers, unless the person has committed a felony offense."

[basachs]

This is and will continue to be such a controversial and passionate topic. I would offer that I am not a supporter of a lot of what the article is talking about, but I understand the position. I just dont agree with it.

[webbage]

dgreco, on Jun 21 2007, 07:34 AM, said:

i hate that argument even on the main board. I know the owners of a company (cleaning) and they couldn't get an american to work that job. they don't pay below min. wage, they pay somewhere in the 9 dollar range, which is still decent. But you would never get americans to do these jobs(and keep them past a month) and people say it is the business owners who are at fault. If anything they are helpnig keep the economy in a cycle. The american dream is not about dropping out of school and becoming a maintance worker, it is getting an education and living a successful and comfortable life. Why should we cater to americans who wont take advantage of an education?

http://www.californi...?articleID=7801

Who was doing the jobs before illegal immigrants came? Ghosts? Zombies? Other mythical creatures?

Edited by webbage, 21 June 2007 - 04:12 PM.

[runawayjim]

webbage, on Jun 21 2007, 06:10 PM, said:

http://www.californi...?articleID=7801

Who was doing the jobs before illegal immigrants came? Ghosts? Zombies? Other mythical creatures?

that's hardly an unbiased source.  i'd also be willing to bet his numbers are way off.

the thing about illegal immigrants working is they work hard, they work for less money (or in some cases, the same money but don't have stupid demands like the construction unions), and they get the job done more efficiently in many cases without needing coffee breaks once an hour.  they take pride in their work, unlike many americans just doing it to make some money.

the only thing i can agree with him on is the 28% of illegal immigrants in prison... they should be deported, regardless of the crime they commit.  the ones who are here just trying to make a better life for themselves should have some way of getting citizenship.

[Gusterfell]

webbage, on Jun 21 2007, 06:10 PM, said:

http://www.californi...?articleID=7801

Who was doing the jobs before illegal immigrants came? Ghosts? Zombies? Other mythical creatures?

There are so many holes and false arguments in that article, I almost don't know where to begin.  For starters:

1.  Everyone outside the industrial world would be guaranteed to "live a better life" in America?  Who are we to say our way of life is any better than anyone else's?

2.  A greater proportion of immigrants are on welfare than native families.  So what?  It has always been the case that immigrants to this country start at the bottom of the socioeconomic ladder.  That many of these immigrants are illegal simply speaks to how difficult the legal immigration process has become.

3.  "Currently, an alien living illegally in the United States often pays no taxes but receives unemployment, welfare, free medical care and other federal benefits."  Exactly how often does this happen?  There are no stats to back this claim up.

4.  All of the 9/11 hijackers were in the US legally.  Using 9/11 to attack illegal immigrants is nothing more than dishonest fearmongering.


Who were doing these jobs before the illegals?  In many cases nobody, as most of those service sector jobs didn't exist a couple decades ago.  Of the remaning jobs, many fell to recent immigrants who were here legally, but only because the immigration process was once much simpler than it is now.

[Liamlunchtray]

Dan, on Jun 21 2007, 01:50 PM, said:

Providence Journal article
6/20/2007

"One ordinance would make Providence a “sanctuary city” — preventing city employees or the police from inquiring into the immigration status of city residents, or from reporting undocumented immigrants to federal immigration officers, unless the person has committed a felony offense."

I think this is a great idea. Im totally behind Mr Luna on this.

[Dan]

Mexican returns to R.I. in quest for justice

"Edgar Velásquez, who sliced his face open with a chain saw last year while working for a Warwick tree service... arrived [this morning] in Rhode Island.  ...He and his attorney were scheduled to appear in court for a pretrial hearing this morning before Judge Bruce E. Morin, on a claim against Gorman for medical bills, permanent disfigurement and weekly benefits."

It does clearly indicate Velásquez slashed himself with the saw he was running, and he's not claiming the equipment wasn't up to snuff operationally.  But even if he was legally authorized to work in that position with the tree service, Gorman wasn't carrying Workers Compensation.

They're both negligent here if you ask me.  I honestly don't know what the WC standards are for heavy equipment operators (in other words - if he was a legal citizen - maybe he gets denied WC but can collect TDI in Rhode Island).  I think Gorman should be responsible for payment of Velásquez's medical bills and his business should be closed indefinitely until he can show that he's not running an illegal operation.  Velásquez goes home.  

There are plenty of Rhode Islanders skilled in this kind of work who are presently unemployed - through no fault of their own.  R.I. has lost countless machine operator jobs as manufacturing companies, one after another, have relocated out of this state.  We're not talking about cleaning toilets and washing dishes here.  

These jobs Americans will do, shame on us for looking the other way on Gorman and Velásquez.  Equal justice under the law.

[Dan]

Legislators unveil ‘Campaign for Fairness, Respect and Civil Rights’  
Rhode Island General Assembly

• All undocumented persons, including most criminal offenders arrested by Rhode Island law enforcement, would be shielded from U.S. immigration laws.  Undocumented criminals in RI would be exempt from federal immigration laws except if charged with a felony.
  
• Drivers' licenses would be made available to any person, regardless of citizenship.  
  
• Proposed restrictions would create opportunity for discrimination lawsuits against employers, landlords, and other private businesses who make eligibility decisions based in part on verification of clients' legal status.
  
• Proposed creation of new state interpreter jobs at the RI Department of Human Services office, and expanded state benefits to non-taxpayers.

If I didn't know better, I'd have to say some of these community-hero lawmakers are nothing but selfish lawyers looking for more than their fair share of job security.  

[dgreco]

Dan, on Feb 29 2008, 04:39 PM, said:

Legislators unveil ‘Campaign for Fairness, Respect and Civil Rights’  
Rhode Island General Assembly

• All undocumented persons, including most criminal offenders arrested by Rhode Island law enforcement, would be shielded from U.S. immigration laws.  Undocumented criminals in RI would be exempt from federal immigration laws except if charged with a felony.
  
• Drivers' licenses would be made available to any person, regardless of citizenship.  
  
• Proposed restrictions would create opportunity for discrimination lawsuits against employers, landlords, and other private businesses who make eligibility decisions based in part on verification of clients' legal status.
  
• Proposed creation of new state interpreter jobs at the RI Department of Human Services office, and expanded state benefits to non-taxpayers.

If I didn't know better, I'd have to say some of these community-hero lawmakers are nothing but selfish lawyers looking for more than their fair share of job security.  

Maybe someone could clear this up for me.  I was listening to 630wpro (not a fan even though I am a moderate conservative they piss me off most the time)  But someone around the 3 oclock hour said that we had a new bill passed about liquor and driving and liquor licenses and they stuck in there that basically you don't have to be a legal immigrant to get a Drivers License and drive.  Basically it was worded to say anyone is allowed to drive if they go to the DMV and get identification.  I do not know if he was soapboxing and was way off or something like this happened.  Thanks?