33 replies to this topic

[poonther]

stjoe, on Jan 11 2008, 05:52 PM, said:

very nice.


Question.......does this project meet the original goal of making Gaines St. a 'Destination area'? Or does it simply make the area 'better than it is today'?

Kinda both.  They've found out that most retail businesses don't want to locate on Gaines until some folks are living on the street first.  This project helps COT achieve that goal.  If they can get the private convention hotel started, that would really help w/drawing in destination type of businesses.  Residential has always been part of the Gaines Street plan.

Artspace is committing to the area too.  It will have residential as well as commercial spaces for art etc.

This proposal doesn't look anymore South FL or West Palm than it looks Chicago, Omaha, St. Louis,  Urban Midwest, Atlanta, Birmingham, Charlotte or Urban South.  It looks mainly like an example of today's urban architecture.

[stjoe]

"They've found out that most retail businesses don't want to locate on Gaines until some folks are living on the street first. This project helps COT achieve that goal. "

I understand your point.  I think Tally screwed this up big time then IMHO.  I think they could of leveraged FSU's need for space to put larger, more expensive, higher density dorms in the first 2 areas built on Gaines Street (the motel and this place).  Pushing FSU to develop that side of the street while the city focused on the other side would of been perfect.  It was a no brainer to me....but that ship has sailed.

This building is nice...and the hotel are nice, but I think they just aren't going to achieve a 'destination area'.

[csmurphy8885]

it would be a great boost to have fsu put some density of student living down there... It would be better for the university, i think , to spread out the dorms a bit.  They might be the most popular of all the dorms.

[humzai]

Would the added density of Fsu dorms actually be the kind retailers are looking for? I like the proposal looks like it will be a good addition to gaines.

[Florida]

I know from the whole Place Properties debacle that the city is not looking to have projects along Gaines that are exclusively Student Housing. They really want this area to be as diverse as any other part of the city as far as age is concerned.

[poonther]

humzai, on Jan 14 2008, 12:15 PM, said:

Would the added density of Fsu dorms actually be the kind retailers are looking for? I like the proposal looks like it will be a good addition to gaines.

Since I've been helping w/Gaines I've learned that many retailers don't look at student pops. in a favorable way when studying where to open a location.  Often times their lack of personal income (they aren't counting Mom and Dad's money)actually is a negative when stores consider locating in an area.  Of course there are exceptions to this like fast-food restaurants and retailers like Urban Outfitters that are mainly geared toward students.

The last master plan I saw for FSU shows plans only down to St. Augustine and not Gaines.  I learned from a university official that FSU and FAMU have an unwritten agreement to not encroach on each other by making Gaines the dividing line.  That is why the Master craftsman studio is dilemma for FSU, to fix it up the way they want on the southside of Gaines is a breach of that agreement.  I believe they are in talks w/FAMU to make sure they don't see this as a threat.

Another thing I've learned and seen while working on Gaines:  COT mid and upper level management and FSU mid and upper level management work very well together.  They seem to understand both parties need to get along and work well w/each other.  The problems I've seen seem to only occur when TK and the Mayor and Commission get involved.

SJ, I'm not sure what will happen exactly w/Gaines as far as becoming a destination area.  It may not become that initially, but I think as the area develops and matures, it may reach that goal.  Now will we still be alive when that happens...who knows.

[Florida]

poonther, on Jan 15 2008, 10:36 AM, said:

Since I've been helping w/Gaines I've learned that many retailers don't look at student pops. in a favorable way when studying where to open a location.  Often times their lack of personal income (they aren't counting Mom and Dad's money)actually is a negative when stores consider locating in an area.  Of course there are exceptions to this like fast-food restaurants and retailers like Urban Outfitters that are mainly geared toward students.

The last master plan I saw for FSU shows plans only down to St. Augustine and not Gaines.  I learned from a university official that FSU and FAMU have an unwritten agreement to not encroach on each other by making Gaines the dividing line.  That is why the Master craftsman studio is dilemma for FSU, to fix it up the way they want on the southside of Gaines is a breach of that agreement.  I believe they are in talks w/FAMU to make sure they don't see this as a threat.

Another thing I've learned and seen while working on Gaines:  COT mid and upper level management and FSU mid and upper level management work very well together.  They seem to understand both parties need to get along and work well w/each other.  The problems I've seen seem to only occur when TK and the Mayor and Commission get involved.

SJ, I'm not sure what will happen exactly w/Gaines as far as becoming a destination area.  It may not become that initially, but I think as the area develops and matures, it may reach that goal.  Now will we still be alive when that happens...who knows.

Thanks for the info Poonther.

I've got a few more graphics I'd like to share on the actual building.

[Florida]

650 W Gaines Street

South Elevation



North Elevation



East Elevation



West Elevation

[stjoe]

Poonther,

As always, thanks for your great posts.  I enjoy your insights.

[csmurphy8885]

I always forget how broke i was as a college student... lol.  darn.

But without flooding the area with coffee shops, bars, and pool halls, I still think we can find sutible business who could appreciate droms on Old st augustine.  Getting students on the outskirts of campus, could solve alot of the parking and traffic issues fsu deals with on the daily.  At the same time, making it possible for students to walk a block down the hill for a sub and a pop, or a ice cream sunday.


I would like to see something to set this project apart a little (once there is development around it) so that residents can say, "Yeah the building on Gaines with the ______".  Though, if may be a while before that would even be neccissary ("Yeah, the building on Gaines"!)

[Tally Drywall]

Florida, Do you know when bids start?

[Go Gators]

Welcome to UP-Tallahassee Tally Drywall!  You have come to the right place to find out about all things Tallahassee.

Flori-duh/TaureanJ/TJ/Toyota(his Tallahassee Democrat alias)/Urban/Florida no longer posts here.  A while back, he wasnt granted moderating rights and he got upset.  You see, he thought for some reason that this had become "his" board.  Anyway, long story short, he ended up leaving this site wike a wittle baby!  

Having said that, Im sure there is someone here who will be able to answer that question for you!

EDIT:  "Florida" added (again) to the end of the names list to reflect that TJ has changed his name AGAIN according to an informant.  Identity crisis anyone?

Edited by Go Gators, 01 July 2008 - 07:02 AM.

[TD]

Drywall, they started construction on this project today

[poonther]

Having worked w/the GGG, I'm tickled pink to see this project break ground!