14 replies to this topic

[frymasterspeck]

Hope City is the self-applied name of the tent city growing beneath the disused section of 195 East in/near downtown Providence.

So I posted this over here, but this morning I got a feeling that this is just the beginning. It might have been the way those two bicycle cops rode ever so slowly on the sidewalk across the street from the tents, looking ever so carefully into the shadow where the dozen or more tents are clustered.

Whole thing just gave me a bad, bad feeling.

[runawayjim]

Have you seen Sacramento's tent city? It's apparently getting pretty bad over there.

[frymasterspeck]

Interesting article by Jim Barron on Stimulus Package money set aside for homelessness. In the P-Times, of all places.

And New York Times on Fresno. This one bears a resemblance to Hope City.

Edited by frymasterspeck, 26 March 2009 - 11:46 AM.

[TheAnk]

I find it fascinating that in our current socialistic state of the state that ANYONE can be homeless or destitude. I mean, Obama spent more money than all presidents combined, ever, in 30 days? (I did not verify this fact, I just read it somewhere and it sounded fantastic)

Why even work any more? I recently heard that you can collect up to $600 PER WEEK on unemployment.. What are we doing working, are we idiots? I think The Ank might try to get laid off, buy a coleman stove and mosey on down to Tent City.. I can live off of six hunge per week, EASY.. These people in Hope City are not HOMELESS!! They are GENIUS!!! I wish I had the guts/brain to be on unemployment and live in a tent.. I loved camping..

Enjoy the rampant hyperinflation folks... I think what Obama meant by "Change" was thats what your dollar will be worth when he is done spending and inflating like a drunken sailor.. I bet all you libbies out there had no idea your president was going to turn the free world into Corporate Welfare Heaven.. LOL.. What a joke our country is

[TheAnk]

Oh, and if someone can explain to me how spending money for homeless is ECONOMIC STIMULIS I'd love to hear it.. The last time I checked, thats welfare.. Corporate welfare, homeless welfare, home-buyer welfare, home-foreclosure welfare, commuter welfare.. WORKER WELFARE... This is so ridiculous, I cannot even believe its happening..

[f1rehead]

TheAnk, on Apr 8 2009, 04:56 PM, said:

LOL.. What a joke TheAnk is

There fixed that for ya.

Your side destroyed the world's economy. I think it's only fair we let the other side see if they can't fix it.

How is giving money to the homeless economic stimulus? If we fatten them up they taste better and sell quicker at the market. Duh.

[Liamlunchtray]

TheAnk, on Apr 8 2009, 06:00 PM, said:

Oh, and if someone can explain to me how spending money for homeless is ECONOMIC STIMULIS I'd love to hear it.. The last time I checked, thats welfare.. Corporate welfare, homeless welfare, home-buyer welfare, home-foreclosure welfare, commuter welfare.. WORKER WELFARE... This is so ridiculous, I cannot even believe its happening..

Ank - You So Crazy!

[frymasterspeck]

TheAnk, on Apr 8 2009, 04:00 PM, said:

Oh, and if someone can explain to me how spending money for homeless is ECONOMIC STIMULIS I'd love to hear it..

You'll have to take this as "directional" data - as they say in the trade - because I don't know of any studies on the economic returns of direct aid. BUT, there are plenty of studies on the impact of food stamp increases. It is generally accepted that increasing food stamps $1 yields $1.73 in economic returns. That 73% ROI is considered the best for various forms of stimulus.

From a basic economics perspective, it stands to reason that this would be so. Using last year's tax rebate for comparison, it is also widely accepted that a fairly large portion of that went into "savings." In fact, the US savings rate is higher now than it has been in decades. But that is misguided or at least misleading terminology.

We think of savings as additional funds put by in case of emergency. But the official definition of savings includes directly paying debt - like credit card debt or outstanding bills. So a large chunk of the rebate went to paying down debt - which has ZERO economic stimulus impact. Hence its classification as savings. This is the downside of tax-rebate/tax cut type stimulus. It hits really fast (faster than this slow-ass stimulus) but it doesn't go bang. It goes fizzle. (I never saw mine. Like a lot of people, I owed the IRS money, so they put my rebate against my debt. And it counted, technically, as savings.)

(Eyes rolled back in your head yet?)

By contrast, those on the lowest rungs of the socio-economic ladder have long-since been written off by their creditors. These people who live truly hand-to-mouth are so in need of the basics (like food) that ANY money they get in hand is INSTANTLY translated into a consumer action. Economic stimulus is directed at driving consumer spending and, hence, saving/creating jobs.

Is it smart to have an economy so badly dependent on consumerism? That's another talk for another thread.

[TheAnk]

Fry if you can explain to me how paying down debt with the stimulus check differs from the bank bailout I'd love to hear it.. If a bank customer pays down a CC with that $$, its the same net result as the bank bailout; the funds go to the bottom line of said bank for "lending" purposes.. The fact that in one case it passed through the customers' hands for a brief second is completely irrelevant..

f1rehead, my side, will never get a chance.. It can't possibly happen.. The sea saw between your side and the republicans since the beginning of time is a lose-lose Ponzi Scheme battle where the only intermittent winners are corporate greed and illegitimate children born stictly for a pay check.. Its a sad reality of the disgusting state of our country and politics..

[f1rehead]

You're absolutely right about credit cards. That's why we shouldn't be bailing out these financial institutions. Or the car companies either. The entire economy since about 1970 has been built on feet of clay. Any stimulus money is just being wasted in propping it up. At the end of the day, there's still too much debt. A big problem with the economy is that the multiplier has gotten way out of control. It's time to bring it down to reasonable levels. Much of that will have to be in the form of deleveraging. Tough, but it has to be done. The bank bailouts (moreso than the car companies who are being pared down) are pretty much being encouraged to keep operating like they did before. That just can't happen. The financial system is a mess, it shouldn't have been allowed to get that way in the first place, and it shouldn't be allowed to keep operating that way now.

Oh, and you obviously don't know what my side is.

[frymasterspeck]

f1rehead, on Apr 28 2009, 12:46 PM, said:

A big problem with the economy is that the multiplier has gotten way out of control.

You make it seem like it just kinda happened. In reality, several very well-connected investment bank CEOs directly lobbied the SEC to change their leverage ratio from 12:1 to 40:1. And, amazingly, the went too far out on the limb.

Also, TA, you make a nice case against tax cuts as a form of stimulus. Thanks.

[TheAnk]

Also, TA, you make a nice case against tax cuts as a form of stimulus. Thanks.
[/quote]

Fry, I don't know why you would think TheAnk would be pro economic stimulus/welfare of any kind, being a libertarian. But since you are a liberal, anyone with a differing opinion to you is automatically a redneckpublican. But even that doesn't make sense, because that $300-600 stimulus only went to poor people, making it a democrat tool of social control. So I will admit I am thoroughly confused by your comment.

[frymasterspeck]

I heard about another tent city - Camp Run-amok - on South Water. Any intel?

[dialectric]

Camp Run-amok, the South Water camp, has been getting a fair amount of press over the past few months. Recently several projo articles and a shorter nytimes piece (http://www.nytimes.c...nd.html?_r=1) have tracked its growth and disbanding. At its largest, it had 60+ residents, significantly greater than the Hope City population.

I biked by yesterday, and most of the tents are gone from the site, though it didn't look completely abandoned yet. Projo has briefly covered their search for a new site.

-dialectric

[dialectric]

A September 18th article in the Brown Daily Herald about the 1047 Westminster St. homeless camp:
BDH Article

According to the Projo, they have been given a 1 week deadline to move from this location:
Projo article

Edited by dialectric, 18 September 2009 - 06:02 AM.