47 replies to this topic

[GRDadof3]

Starting a new topic for this, pulled from the retail thread.  The possibility of bridging over the ramp entrance, filling the entire footprint, and going up 75,000 square feet sounds pretty exciting.

http://www.bing.com/...503&form=LMLTCC

http://www.mlive.com..._pa.html#_login

Hmmmm..

[tSlater]

It'll be interesting to see what's proposed, and if developers can manage to get funding for whatever they propose.

[Hoeks]

This is probably too ambitious considering the climate, but it would be great if the development included the triangle lot adjacent (dream on ).  At the very least, I hope this logic creates an added pressure to sell the lot for development.

[GaryP]

I wonder if this is connected to Zondervan's move

[GRDadof3]

GaryP, on 22 August 2011 - 10:56 AM, said:

I wonder if this is connected to Zondervan's move

I thought Zondervan was moving because they didn't have any money and were downsizing?  Why would they move into a high-end, most likely class A, facility downtown?

I'd say whatever proposal comes forward, it will not include much office space.  Not with Bridgewater under bank foreclosure and losing tenants.  Most likely apartments, would be my guess, with ground floor retail.

[arcturus]

GRDadof3, on 22 August 2011 - 12:09 PM, said:

I thought Zondervan was moving because they didn't have any money and were downsizing?  Why would they move into a high-end, most likely class A, facility downtown?

I'd say whatever proposal comes forward, it will not include much office space.  Not with Bridgewater under bank foreclosure and losing tenants.  Most likely apartments, would be my guess, with ground floor retail.

My guess is apartments also considering how low vacancies are.  Demographics certainly work in their favor with the rapid increase in 1 and 2-people households according to the latest census statistics ...

http://www.mlive.com...chigan_hou.html

[GRDadof3]

arcturus, on 23 August 2011 - 09:02 AM, said:

My guess is apartments also considering how low vacancies are.  Demographics certainly work in their favor with the rapid increase in 1 and 2-people households according to the latest census statistics ...

http://www.mlive.com...chigan_hou.html

I was working on an article about the census and found that only about 1/4 of Kent County households have school aged children living at home now.  One of the lowest recorded in decades.  Pretty much the same trend nationwide.

It makes sense.  Most people are generally waiting until their 30's and even 40's to have kids.  And kids of baby boomers have long left the house, for the most part.

[joeDowntown]

By the wording, it'll be interesting to see if they try to get a national player to come in to town. Someone with "expertise". I'm sure a mixed used development (w/ apartments) would do really well there. But with the lending climate the way it is, it seems like it'll take someone with deep pockets to get it done. Will be interesting to see if it can be pulled off by local developers, and if national developers have any interest in GR.

Joe

[mpchicago]

GRDadof3, on 22 August 2011 - 12:09 PM, said:

I thought Zondervan was moving because they didn't have any money and were downsizing?  Why would they move into a high-end, most likely class A, facility downtown?

It was my understanding Zonedrvan was closing its distribution center, consolidating with a Harper Collins DC. I don't think any office staff was being let go.  Still would be good to see them downtown, somewhere.

Glad the city is on the ball with this parking lot, would be nice to see some infill there.

Edited by mpchicago, 23 August 2011 - 12:35 PM.

[GRDadof3]

joeDowntown, on 23 August 2011 - 11:03 AM, said:

By the wording, it'll be interesting to see if they try to get a national player to come in to town. Someone with "expertise". I'm sure a mixed used development (w/ apartments) would do really well there. But with the lending climate the way it is, it seems like it'll take someone with deep pockets to get it done. Will be interesting to see if it can be pulled off by local developers, and if national developers have any interest in GR.

Joe

Are there any "national" developers left.

There might be some Chicago developers who are struggling with saturation in that metro area, perhaps.  Maybe I'll reach out to some Chicago architects I know...

[Yankee Fan]

Not sure if this is completely relevant to the topic, but I talked with a guy this morning at Rockford Construction who said that they will have a pretty large project announced for DT GR in the next couple of months.  Anyone care to elaborate on this?!

Edited by Yankee Fan, 24 August 2011 - 08:12 AM.

[GRDadof3]

Yankee Fan, on 24 August 2011 - 08:11 AM, said:

Not sure if this is completely relevant to the topic, but I talked with a guy this morning at Rockford Construction who said that they will have a pretty large project announced for DT GR in the next couple of months.  Anyone care to elaborate on this?!

I would imagine it's the renovation of the old Merton Hotel into another GRid70 type project. It was reported on last week or the week prior.

There's also a Rockford Construction trailer parked at the corner of Wealthy and Division....

[Jippy]

For the City to choose issuing the RFP now (in a depressed real estate climate), the City has almost certainly been approached with a credible development proposal. It will become evident by the fact that one proposal will be significantly more advanced than the remaining.

[joeDowntown]

A realtor mentioned in passing that something "really cool" was brewing. At the time, I thought he was talking about a particular space in a particular, but looking back on it, I think he may have been talking about this project. I know who I'm betting on in the early rounds.

I just hope we don't see renderings with a suburban style Walgreen's as a main focal point (Rockford Construction lost out to Sam Cummings on that proposal, which ended up becoming Gallery on Fulton).

Joe

[Yankee Fan]

http://www.mlive.com...ut_fued_at.html

After reading this article today, I am wondering if maybe the Ford museum upgrade is what the guy at Rockford Construction was talking about.

[joeDowntown]

Has anything else surfaced about this lot possibly being put up for sale? The article said the city commission was going to discuss the issue in August. Was anything ever decided (wondering if this is on the market yet)?

Joe

[GRDadof3]

From the minutes of that meeting:

RESOLVED:
1. That the 17-space metered surface parking lot including certain air
rights adjacent to the Ottawa-Fulton parking ramp (the “Property”), having been
recommended for disposal by the Parking Commission, shall be sold in
accordance with City Commission Policy No. 900-41 through a combination of
the listing and sale option and the negotiated sale method; and
2. That the Property shall be listed for sale with the Grand Rapids
Association of Realtors Multiple Listing Service with the actual purchase price
to be determined by an independent appraisal of an appraiser mutually
acceptable to the City and purchaser determined within 45 days of closing; and
3. That, upon request and payment of option fees, the prospective
purchaser may have an option to purchase the Property for a maximum of
three years; and
4. That a proposal to purchase the Property shall include (a) the
proposer’s experience in developing or redeveloping property in downtown
Grand Rapids; (b) a proposed mixed-use office/retail development with a
substantial opportunity to attract tenants that are new to the City; © a
development with a minimum investment of $15,000,000 (exclusive of the
Property purchase price) and containing a minimum of 75,000 square feet to be
completed within three years of purchase; and (d) an agreement by the
purchaser to enter into a development agreement memorializing development
criteria including development milestones; and
5. That Economic Development staff shall review proposals received
and may as a result of such review negotiate with one or more prospective
purchasers and upon completion of negotiations will bring such proposal(s)
forward to the City Commission together with a recommendation for the City
Commission’s consideration for approval, approval with condition or rejection;
and
6. That all resolutions or parts of resolutions in conflict herewith shall
be and the same are hereby rescinded.

[joeDowntown]

If they want at least 75,000 sq. ft, how many stories would that be (to fit on the current footprint) approximately?

Surprised 4b didn't mention residential. Why couldn't it be residential/retail or all three. It seems like new residential (apartments) would be a higher demand use for the spot than office at this point.

Thanks for the find GRDad.

Joe

[sonic]

I would estimate about 20,000 sq ft per floor, since the space is triangular, and looks slightly larger than 200 ft on each side (though I could be wrong). So, sadly, that looks like only about 4 floors.

[andrew.w]

sonic, on 02 October 2011 - 03:33 PM, said:

I would estimate about 20,000 sq ft per floor, since the space is triangular, and looks slightly larger than 200 ft on each side (though I could be wrong). So, sadly, that looks like only about 4 floors.

I just calculated about 23,000 sqft, but the first floor would only have 13,000 with the ramp entrance.  
Although the interior spaces would be more desirable if the building 1) did not take up the entire lot, or 2) provided for atria or light courts, because otherwise any room in the north corner of the site is going to be 140-180 feet from exterior walls and windows.