They used to be higher up on that list (#9 at one time I believe), but that's in part due to a number of formerly public companies (Chrysler for example) going private in recent time.

Golscorer4, you're going to have to check that 21st Century comment. Visbeen can pursue ANYONE taking renderings off his site without permission and certainly anyone who reposts them, duplicates them and redistributes them. There are copyright warnings on his site...it's his intellectual property regardless of the technology that allows you to save them on your computer. The original post even said they took the renderings off of his site...duh...that wasn't the City of GR Planning Commission's web site.

Give me a break...I'm a bit disturbed that people think because it's on the web that you can just take photos/drawings/or other content and simply illustrate or repurpose those images wherever or whenever you please. You're not entitled!

GRDAD, thanks for taking those down...it's very respectful of Wayne and his property. He's probably being generous by not making a bigger deal out of it than he could.

So I head inside and the first thing I noticed was all the skylights that are in the new wal mart. If one would notice, when it's a nice and sunny day out, the store lights most of them are turned off until nighttime. They are probabily doing this to save energy.

You're right, he made an error, the images were posted, he asked for them to be removed (and had the right to), they were removed, end of story.

Most UPers saw them, commented, had some fun, now it's time to move on to something else.

edit: just saw your added comments, and I'm glad we're in agreement.

Thats exactly what I was getting at. I was just trying to say the error was on Visbeen's part b/c it was naive to think that it wasn't going to happen. Of course that doesn't make it right. To clarify, I fully understand and agree with the removal of the images.

Uhh, sorry, but posting intellectual property, artwork, photography and/or copyrighted material publicly on a website does not inherently transfer ownership to whomever downloads it. Bands don't do it because they know there are millions of poachers just waiting to download free pirated music, and it would be way too hard to track them all down and prosecute them (even though they have the right to).

I don't think anyone is saying that Visbeen doesn't have copyright on those drawings. They are his creation, of course he has the copyright on them and had every right to take them down. It was an error on his part however to put them up and not expect someone to find them, copy/paste them, and speculate about them. You don't see bands putting up music that can be downloaded on line (for free, hypothetically, for the sake of this argument) and then pull it down saying that they didn't think people would save it and therefore infringe upon their copyright.

Golscorer4, you're going to have to check that 21st Century comment. Visbeen can pursue ANYONE taking renderings off his site without permission and certainly anyone who reposts them, duplicates them and redistributes them. There are copyright warnings on his site...it's his intellectual property regardless of the technology that allows you to save them on your computer. The original post even said they took the renderings off of his site...duh...that wasn't the City of GR Planning Commission's web site.

Give me a break...I'm a bit disturbed that people think because it's on the web that you can just take photos/drawings/or other content and simply illustrate or repurpose those images wherever or whenever you please. You're not entitled!

GRDAD, thanks for taking those down...it's very respectful of Wayne and his property. He's probably being generous by not making a bigger deal out of it than he could.

What makes you so sure?

from Knape...

"Wayne told me he has clients in China and wanted to show them some of the larger scale work his firm is capable of."

"He's hoping Urban Planet will pull them down, too, since he never granted permission to reprint the renderings."

Hey, welcome to the Internet buddy. Welcome to the 21st Century. If you want your clients to see them, use e-mail. Furthermore, the internet isn't print media, and its not as if someone was claiming to have done the work rather than him. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see any rights violations here.

Hey, welcome to the Internet buddy. Welcome to the 21st Century. If you want your clients to see them, use e-mail. Furthermore, the internet isn't print media, and its not as if someone was claiming to have done the work rather than him. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see any rights violations here.

from Knape...

"Wayne told me he has clients in China and wanted to show them some of the larger scale work his firm is capable of."

"He's hoping Urban Planet will pull them down, too, since he never granted permission to reprint the renderings."

Hey, welcome to the Internet buddy. Welcome to the 21st Century. If you want your clients to see them, use e-mail. Furthermore, the internet isn't print media, and its not as if someone was claiming to have done the work rather than him. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see any rights violations here.



Really? Everything above the 5th floor in the most recent one looked like it belonged in Dubai somewhere. This one...



...is just a taller version of his houses. Check it out, its even in a gated community, so to speak.

I have to say I really like Visbeen's high rise stuff, I always thought of him as "big house" architect guy. Maybe he'll get to see one of his high-rise ideas get built here someday.

Chris Knape checked it all out for us and it's what we all probably figured deep down was the truth. There were a couple other cool renderings he posted for us to see, even though the Market and Fulton ones are gone now. I have to say I really like Visbeen's high rise stuff, I always thought of him as "big house" architect guy. Maybe he'll get to see one of his high-rise ideas get built here someday.

http://blog.mlive.com/knapescorner/

My fiance and I are looking for a place in the GR area that offers scooter rentals. We're getting married this June and would love to use a scooter for our "get-away" car. Or, if anybody is willing to let us rent their scooter that would be great too. Our church and reception sites are only about 3 miles apart from each other and it's all downtown so it wouldn't be far.

...

FYI, the article had nothing to do with Market & Fulton.

A couple of years ago when there was all this talk about Toyota coming to West Michigan, does anyone remember were the rumored sites would have been? Personally, I think this is a long shot for Michigan and a longer shot for W Michigan.

Also, I meant to add that they're building a surface lot behind Founders (Williams/Finney side). Should have around 160 spots and completed in mid-June (just in time for Founders Fest).

It's from a writer from the BBC normally stationed in Washington D.C, who travels the country on the campaign trail. Grand Rapids is definitely unexciting compared to that. Don't fret too much about it.

In my mind it was taken down, because as stated before this was a conceptual drawing, using a highly talked about corner of downtown property. Someone was showing design potential. There is nothing to suggest otherwise.

I think we should all excersize a little more discretion when things that can be proven only to be speculative, come into play.

I would consider this pretty negative:

"To sample the discontent I went to Grand Rapids, a city as unexciting as its most famous son, the late Gerald Ford. "



.....

Also, dbrok's site, GRNow.com has 5 really awesome crane shots at 460' that they got from the builder in their flickrstream:

Check them out: http://www.flickr.com/photos/grnow/sets/72157604939214089/

Imagine how cool it'd be to see some 400 ft wind turbines NW of town from that vantage point.

The writer was just trying to frame his article, pointing out the "sad state of the U.S. economy, Grand Rapids being ground zero", and here come the Democrats riding into town trying to connect with out-of-work manufacturing folk. That's all. The other 10,000 articles were just regurgitated AP wording, which weren't positive or negative toward GR.

So much is going on this weekend in Uptown! The free Trolley rides around the Uptown shopping districts starts on Saturday from 10am-3pm. Wealthy Street Spring Fling, Farmer's Market, Heritage Hill garage sales, and more.....

A wonderful weekend to spend in the neighborhood! TripleG

So much is going on this weekend in Uptown! The free Trolley rides around the Uptown shopping districts starts on Saturday from 10am-3pm. Wealthy Street Spring Fling, Farmer's Market, Heritage Hill garage sales, and more.....

A wonderful weekend to spend in the neighborhood! TripleG

I find it weird how the renderings were taken down immediately. Taking it down within such a short time only fuels speculation. A simple disclaimer would have been appropriate.

You missed the entire point . . . .I'm not advocating smoking in public places, I'm just saying there are bigger issues to worry about than some lousy smoke wafting your way . . . . .

The first level of the stepped back floors has been poured. I got some shots that I'll post tonight if no one else gets a chance to take some this afternoon.

Point of View Video from Muskegon Chronicle:
Thunderhawk First Ride POV Video

Point of View Video from WZZM TV's Take Five Show w/ Stephanie Webb:
Thunderhawk Media Day Rides POV Video

[I'd rather sit next to the smoker for an hour then get killed on the road by the person who was not smoking but drinking too much . .. . . .. . drinking is far worse issue that ruins lives, ruins marriages, causes countless health issues, etc etc but is still a social preference and highly encouraged form of entertainment . . . ban the smoke great! then move on to the far more serious issue . . .

Okay, this is going too far now... Yes, I would rather smell like stink butts over GETTING KILLED. You bring a great point. I would also choose smelling like smoke over getting attacked by a sea lion. AND, I would choose polluting my lungs due to your cigarette over getting struck by lightning. Second-hand smoking isn't so bad after all...

Every time I am driving down the street or highway and a filth-monger in front of me tosses a stink butt out the window, I swear and wonder why this isn't policed more as well........pigs.

Also, I meant to add that they're building a surface lot behind Founders (Williams/Finney side)

Founders got some praise today at City Commission mtg. They, along with developers John Green and Andy Winkel, received an award from the Historoic Preservation Commission for their renovation work.

Yeah, "Geoff" comments...but, well like most media quotes, we don't ever get context so they can make it sound as good or bad as they want. And yeah, the % was just my interpretation on it...it doesn't really give any numbers or anything...just that there were a LOT of foreclosures... We have some, but we're also #8 for best home market (apparently!) so the article just seemed a little unfair or biased or well, just not the kind of press we like to get.

BUT if any renderings (Visbeen's or anyone else's) are taken (stolen) off of a back-door client preview section of a web site then I think it's the wrong thing to do to post them on UP for consumption/commentary here.

Tell me I'm wrong, but you'd think there would be some kind of confidentiality from the very start. I doubt Visbeen would risk breaking an agreement with such an important client just to add it to an online portfolio.

I find it weird how the renderings were taken down immediately. Taking it down within such a short time only fuels speculation. A simple disclaimer would have been appropriate.

That, or he's getting a huge kick about playing everyone who saw it and started going off on speculations...

Sometimes one needs just to humor himself

I find it weird how the renderings were taken down immediately. Taking it down within such a short time only fuels speculation. A simple disclaimer would have been appropriate.

What a joke! Any project that can't take the pre project UP level of vetting shouldn't have made it to the crappy sketch-up rendering phase. If the images were sensitive they shouldn't have been posted on his web site in the first place. If Visbeen didn't know they were sensitive then someone's not sharing properly.

Don't fall for it.

I'm sure their hotel will be as successful as Icon on Bond...

I'd be more concerned about the comments of "Geoff" then the foreclosure stats., and I didn't see anything about a 80-90% abandon rate in GR, only on Broadway Ave. (which probably IS correct.)

Front page of today's New York Times.

That is pretty amazing then that UP can command such power. I don't doubt that GR developers check up on this forum to gauge opinions on their projects now and then, but to scrap a project because of speculation on this site? Not sure about that one. Also, the fact that WZZM (I think) wanted to highlight this site on one of their broadcasts is a statement of that growing influence. Not to inflate any of our egos here or anything.

Well it's about time our great city got a big political boost like this,it always fun to go on any news site and see Grand rapids, mi, well the name at least.

I also wonder what it might to do the credibility of UPGR if every time someone wants to do a conceptual drawing and the people here go ape nuts.

Although I do wonder if UP had anything do with 275 Fulton Place's demise (too much speculation flying about).

Ughhh...this isn't exactly the kinda press I thought we'd get after last night. And I don't know what he's smokin' either.....GR is NOT the epicenter of the imploding economy...we may be caught on the edges, but... And where the heck did he find 80-90% abandon homes as he seems to imply?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7401771.stm

Two of the wave trusses are up as of tuesday. Naturally, I didn't have my camera with me at the time, but let me assure you that the whole structure looks about 40% more massive with those things sitting aloft.

CNN is nothing. It's now in over 10,000 media outlets worldwide:

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&um=1...tnG=Search+News

In the former Flute Boutique space. Been there a few weeks, was very busy weekend evenings.

I'd like to advance the idea that in the unlikely event that there is something real behind this, perhaps the project is better served NOT being dragged under a microscope on UP prior to the developers going public with it.

The fact the the images were removed as soon as they were publically posted could be seen as evidence of this.

If this is real, we'll have plenty of time to chatter on like kids on Christmas Eve once something is announced.

I know that's contrary to the spirit of this forum, but sometimes loose lips can sink ships...and no one benefits from that.