Charlotte-Douglas Airport (CLT) Expansion

[Urbanity]

And the plot thickens...  Apparently the Mayor and the Council looked at a new tax on airport parking to help pay for the streetcar and CIP which is what may be what spearheaded the whole Airport Authority move.

 

If this is all true then I am really getting pissed at the whole Mayor/council dysfunction.  Instead of hashing out the CIP and then funding it last Spring they now endanger everything from the Airport control to the Panthers relationship simply because they can't agree on the CIP and are ttrying to sneak funding for their favorite projects from it through other sources.

[15895]

But who knew the panthers and airport and even streetcar dilemma would be such a state issue?

It's not fair to blame our council for exploring all possible ways back from the 2012 election month....

Sounds like someone is stirring the pot to turn Charlotte/City Council into the bad guys.

It's not like a raise in taxes would've hurt the airline business. It's only effecting Charlotteans. Not travelers in transit. Charlotte was exploring the idea of a tax as I'm sure with a lot of other ideas... The airport is a city department. It's not like a tax on airport parking would effect the airlines or air travel 1 bit.

Edited March 8, 2013 by AirNostrumMAD

[Urbanity]

^ I hear you but disagree.   

At the risk of being off-topic my basic point is that the city has not dealt with financing the CIP for a year now.  Two of the items on the CIP (amateur sports and streetcar) have now been the cause of problems (caused by the city) because they looked to funding sources either a little nefariously (amateur sports and Panthers) or through an area they had no business looking (streetcar and airport).

Yes.  The State has new management and they are making their stamp known.  Their vision versus the city's vision on infrastructure and development spending is not on the same level and that is not the city's fault. That said - the city can't ignore this reality and assume that the NC Government has its back for pushing through its funding priorities.

 

They have to get their act together.  They need to put the effort and resources into passing the CIP (with or without Streetcar) versus so much time and effort that has gone into looking for the alternate sources.  It's damaging the city's credibility.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Urbanity

[ah59396]

I was always under the impression that the best way for the city to gain the public's trust was by creating new taxes, trying to keep them hush hush, and then using them to fund unpopular projects....weird!

[cltbwimob]

^ I hear you but disagree.

At the risk of being off-topic my basic point is that the city has not dealt with financing the CIP for a year now. Two of the items on the CIP (amateur sports and streetcar) have now been the cause of problems (caused by the city) because they looked to funding sources either a little nefariously (amateur sports and Panthers) or through an area they had no business looking (streetcar and airport).

Yes. The State has new management and they are making their stamp known. Their vision versus the city's vision on infrastructure and development spending is not on the same level and that is not the city's fault. That said - the city can't ignore this reality and assume that the NC Government has its back for pushing through its funding priorities.

They have to get their act together. They need to put the effort and resources into passing the CIP (with or without Streetcar) versus so much time and effort that has gone into looking for the alternate sources. It's damaging the city's credibility.

I think the city looked at possibly using the parking tax revenue for the streetcar and asked the city attorney to look into the issue. When the city attorney told council it was illegal to use that revenue stream, they dropped it.

It is not that the state wants to turn control over to an airport authority that frustrates me about this whole saga. It is the fact that the legislature is clearly trying to assert their dominance over the city of Charlotte by ramming a bill through with seemingly little thought given to how this bill will affect the airport long term and absolutely no desire to study the effects of such a move. We are talking about changing the entire governing structure of an operation that contributes 12 billion dollars annually to the local economy. This idea has gone from concept to near reality in a matter of weeks, and we can not even commission a study to look at how we might mitigate the unintended consequences, how the bond issue would be resolved, how to properly implement such an authority, and what powers would be relegated to such an authority. That is what makes this so frustrating.

And the governor thinks this is a city issue between local factions... I thought members of the general assembly, the ones hell bent on shoving this bill through , were state level politicians.

Edited March 8, 2013 by cltbwimob

[Norm2]

I think the city looked at possibly using the parking tax revenue for the streetcar and asked the city attorney to look into the issue. When the city attorney told council it was illegal to use that revenue stream, they dropped it.

It is not that the state wants to turn control over to an airport authority that frustrates me about this whole saga. It is the fact that the legislature is clearly trying to assert their dominance over the city of Charlotte by ramming a bill through with seemingly little thought given to how this bill will affect the airport long term and absolutely no desire to study the effects of such a move. We are talking about changing the entire governing structure of an operation that contributes 12 billion dollars annually to the local economy. This idea has gone from concept to near reality in a matter of weeks, and we can not even commission a study to look at how we might mitigate the unintended consequences, how the bond issue would be resolved, how to properly implement such an authority, and what powers would be relegated to such an authority. That is what makes this so frustrating.

And the governor thinks this is a city issue between local factions... I thought members of the general assembly, the ones hell bent on shoving this bill through , were state level politicians.

You are absolutely correct. It was just an idea that the council floated but were shot down because it is illegal. they never seriously tried to pursue it. I think someone in the Observer is trying very hard to make Charlotte look bad. You also have the Observer reporting how much the Panthers made in 2 years, yet they had to cut their spending one year because of the NFL lockout. You play with words and a few numbers and people will believe anything you want. Especially since I a lot of people these days only see headlines and do not read the articles attached to the headlines. I do not disagree that our city council and mayor have been dysfunctional lately.....but I do not fault them at all for trying to find different revenue sources for their projects.

[southslider]

Well, whatever enhanced revenue scenario the Howard and Swain-led committee end up recommending for the transit system plan, you can bet there won't be a line to the airport.  The new authority can pay for that one on their own.

[teeg]

There's a really interesting chart on today's aviationplanning.com "Hot Flash",

http://www.aviationplanning.com/HotFlash.htm  

 

CLT was one of only 6 of the top 30 US airports to see more aircraft takeoffs/landings in FY2012 than in FY2005.  

 

[ah59396]

Great article in the Business Journal, as Doug Parker met with reporters today to talk CLT and the US/AA merger.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/blog/queen_city_agenda/2013/03/us-airways-ceo-calls-merger-fabulous.html

 

My favorite quote from the article:

 

“As it relates to Charlotte, this merger is fantastic news,” Parker said. “The reason we’re confident about antitrust approval is because the networks are so complementary. ... One of the holes in the American Airlines system is up and down the East Coast, particularly the Southeast. Charlotte fills that hole extremely nicely.”

 

 

Another gem:

 

"Parker said all the Charlotte jobs should remain. He also said it’s likely the maintenance and training centers here will, at worst, be status quo. It’s more probable they will grow, particularly with a number of pilot retirements anticipated soon, creating turnover and more need for training. In similar fashion, the two airlines’ commitment to buy 600 planes will also require extensive maintenance training and transition for mechanics and for the changing airline fleet."

 

 

Obviously the guy would never walk in and tell everyone negative news if there was truly any.  Yet in the same accord, I doubt he'd be so candid about it being a positive for the city if it truly were not.  He would simply divert the questions or play the "we are currently assessing our strategy" card.  Hopefully this will be as positive for us as he seems to make it sound.

[15895]

An airline CEO would never say "we are assessing our strategy."

They usually say they will be able to serve XYZ airport to more destinations and they plan on growing. The one gem is what Parker didn't say; American plans on going forward with Sao Paulo flights from Charlotte and Philadelphia. Also Parker stated why Charlotte was relevant; our geography. Other than that, we could be Beside Dallas and we'd hear "Charlotte being 5 miles down the road Could grow in order to relieve congestion from Dallas". Airline CEO's will flat out lie to politicians during mergers.

[ScottCLT]

Update on the airport construction...I have been there way too many times in the past few weeks, but thankfully home for 2.5 weeks in a row (tentatively). Anyway, both hourly decks are demolished...still working on the columns from the west deck, but it's pretty much gone. The two new hourly decks are making nice progress, but still a ways off.

Parking has been a beotch lately. I have been there a couple times in the past few weeks where daily east, daily west, daily north, long term one, and long term two were all closed. I hate driving to long term 4, which is seemingly in the middle of nowhere, so I have been using Park N Go on occasion. Really not very safe feeling, but they do have great service. They pick you up at your car as soon as you park and drop you off right back at your car when your get back - no walking, no remembering, no shelters. Not bad, and their shuttles are more timely than CLT shuttles.

The daily parking decks are a mess now because of the construction...I was there today and driving through a construction zone on gravel roads to get to the west daily deck. Also no more walking to the terminal from the daily decks...the bus is the only option.

Out by the Business Valet lot, ther is a ton of construction and grading too. Looks like they are starting to build an under/overpass for roads that are not yet there. I am guessing this is for the new entrance from Little Rock Road.

Happy to see so much going on around the airport, but also will be happy when it's done.

[nowensone]

Yeah, I've been flying out of CLT for roughly 30 years, it has been around 2 years since my last flight, and I can't recall that it has ever not been in a state of construction/change of some kind.  The site position and placement of ingress/egress was long ago either done without vision or was constrained in some other way.

[HopHead]

^Yea, I used to fly out of CLT every week up until about 2 years ago myself. Now it's every few months (being home on a somewhat regular basis is nice though). So, every time I pull up into the airport it's something new that I'm seeing. I was there a few weeks ago and saw they were in the process of knocking down the west hourly deck and the new hourly decks being consructed are making nice progress. Right now it's a lot of short term pain since you can't walk from the East/West daily decks anymore and you're forced to ride the bus. Even in the middle of the day (when I was traveling) it was packed and finding a spot was difficult. I guess I was lucky to find one based on what ScottCLT said. Once they do open the new rental car facility right in front of the main terminal it will make a huge difference in congestion just by not having all those rental car buses having to pass through there. We will just have to suffer for another year or two until then.

[SentioVenia]

They moved the statue of Queen Charlotte down to ground level between the daily decks.  I'm guessing she will be moved back to a position of prominence when the construction is finished.

Edited March 22, 2013 by SentioVenia

[atlrvr]

There is a long Q&A with Stan Campbell in today's CBJ.  He was a former city councilman, airport advisory committee member and the current face of the push to create an Airport Authority.  After reading the piece, I'm off the fence and clearly in favor of an authority based on his "side of the story".

 

1)  The mayor and Curt Walton asked Jerry Orr to retire by the end of 2012.  USAirways told them both that they would prefer to see Orr stay through their merger, and they were told that its none of their business.

2)  The city has represented the airport bonds as back by the City of Charlotet, which is not true.

3)  The airport was forced to take CMPD police against they wishes, not because of security issues, but because the city was given stimulus funds to hire more officers, and those stimulus ran out in 2012, so they decided to use the airport budget to maintain those officer/salaries an.

4) Jerry Orr was told the city would not hire a current aiport staff member as his successor.  US Airways local exec was told they were not welcome to give their opinion on who should be named as his successor.

[cltbwimob]

There is a long Q&A with Stan Campbell in today's CBJ. He was a former city councilman, airport advisory committee member and the current face of the push to create an Airport Authority. After reading the piece, I'm off the fence and clearly in favor of an authority based on his "side of the story".

1) The mayor and Curt Walton asked Jerry Orr to retire by the end of 2012. USAirways told them both that they would prefer to see Orr stay through their merger, and they were told that its none of their business.

2) The city has represented the airport bonds as back by the City of Charlotet, which is not true.

3) The airport was forced to take CMPD police against they wishes, not because of security issues, but because the city was given stimulus funds to hire more officers, and those stimulus ran out in 2012, so they decided to use the airport budget to maintain those officer/salaries an.

4) Jerry Orr was told the city would not hire a current aiport staff member as his successor. US Airways local exec was told they were not welcome to give their opinion on who should be named as his successor.

If all this is true, then I also support the notion of giving control to an authority, although I still do not think the authority should be rammed through but rather given due diligence with respect to consequences not intended. Interesting to see how this has taken so many turns. I can barely formulate an opinion before new information comes to light and I have to reconsider my own thoughts.

[15895]

Maybe an authority Would be a better option; however, the authority must be set up in a sensible manner and not some political mess Re: Ashville Airport Authority

[WesleyHeightsWay]

With no Hourly Decks at CLT...where does one park now if picking someone up? At the (newish) Daily Decks and ride the bus? Or is there another option?

[SentioVenia]

With no Hourly Decks at CLT...where does one park now if picking someone up? At the (newish) Daily Decks and ride the bus? Or is there another option?

The Daily decks, then take the shuttle to Departures (it only picks up from Arrivals).  The shuttle stop is between the East and West Daily decks.

[LKN704]

There is a long Q&A with Stan Campbell in today's CBJ.  He was a former city councilman, airport advisory committee member and the current face of the push to create an Airport Authority.  After reading the piece, I'm off the fence and clearly in favor of an authority based on his "side of the story".

 

1)  The mayor and Curt Walton asked Jerry Orr to retire by the end of 2012.  USAirways told them both that they would prefer to see Orr stay through their merger, and they were told that its none of their business.

2)  The city has represented the airport bonds as back by the City of Charlotet, which is not true.

3)  The airport was forced to take CMPD police against they wishes, not because of security issues, but because the city was given stimulus funds to hire more officers, and those stimulus ran out in 2012, so they decided to use the airport budget to maintain those officer/salaries an.

4) Jerry Orr was told the city would not hire a current aiport staff member as his successor.  US Airways local exec was told they were not welcome to give their opinion on who should be named as his successor.

Now I am not sure if this is true or not, but if it is, it bothers me. US Airways is the airport's largest customer, and it is their business. The company has every right to give input on Jerry's successor. The hub will not be successful if there is not a good partnership between CLT and AA/US. As each day goes on, an airport authority starts to sound better to me.

 

On a different note, the CLT 2015 page on the airport's website has been updated to include projects such as the INTL terminal and Concourse A/B/E expansions.

 

http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/Airport/Pages/CLT2015FutureProposedProjects.aspx

http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/Airport/Pages/CLT2015UpcomingProjects.aspx

[Norm2]

If all this is true, then I also support the notion of giving control to an authority, although I still do not think the authority should be rammed through but rather given due diligence with respect to consequences not intended. Interesting to see how this has taken so many turns. I can barely formulate an opinion before new information comes to light and I have to reconsider my own thoughts.

So why would Walton say one thing but the Foxx say another? Is the city just doing an about face now since they are about to lose the airport? Probably so.....

[cltbwimob]

So why would Walton say one thing but the Foxx say another? Is the city just doing an about face now since they are about to lose the airport? Probably so.....

I am really having a tough time keeping up with the "he said, she said" component of this saga.  It seems as if every couple of days there is a new spin on the story, however recent articles from the Observer and Bizjournal increasingly substantiate the State's case for creating an authority.  Just a couple of weeks ago, while I was not wholly against the idea of having a CLT authority,  I was vehemently opposed to having the bill pushed through the legislature with such seeming recklessness.  However, based on recent articles, it seems as if the city has been far more reckless than the state with regard to airport governance.

 

I agree with AirNostrumMAD in this case.  Neither state nor city leaders should use the airport governance issue as a means of political posturing.  If an authority is to be created, the state should ensure that the method in which such an authority is created is properly vetted, ensure the bond issue is resolved, and ensure the leadership is appropriate with a strong mix of business leaders and workers in the aviation industry.

[Bikeguy]

^ how about reserving some space on the Authority for those who use the airport and those who live under its three ( soon to be four) flight paths..?

[ScottCLT]

With no Hourly Decks at CLT...where does one park now if picking someone up? At the (newish) Daily Decks and ride the bus? Or is there another option?

The easiest way is to park in the cell phone lot (there are signs to it). You park for free and tell your friend to call you when the have their bags and are ready to leave. You will be at the arrivals area within a minute or so from that lot, so there is really no waiting for the person that arrives. On another note, when the hourly deck were there, it was very easy to just park there for 15 minutes, come back to your car, and if you left within 30 minutes, it was free. I am sure that will be the same when the new hourly decks are finished, but it will be more of a walk.

[rancenc]

Another great location is the Airport Park that overlooks the runway.  I usually wait there if I have to pick someone up at the airport.

 

The easiest way is to park in the cell phone lot (there are signs to it). You park for free and tell your friend to call you when the have their bags and are ready to leave. You will be at the arrivals area within a minute or so from that lot, so there is really no waiting for the person that arrives. On another note, when the hourly deck were there, it was very easy to just park there for 15 minutes, come back to your car, and if you left within 30 minutes, it was free. I am sure that will be the same when the new hourly decks are finished, but it will be more of a walk.