[billpa]

jpl02, on Feb 16 2006, 04:06 PM, said:

About the only thing in the states close to the 401 is Atlanta's Downtown Connector, or (when it's finished), I-10 in Houston from 610 to Katy.

I've not driven on those roads, but I would say the upper section of the NJ Turnpike is quite like the 401...

such as this.

[lammius]

billpa, on Mar 31 2006, 01:29 PM, said:

I've not driven on those roads, but I would say the upper section of the NJ Turnpike is quite like the 401...

such as this.

Yeah that looks like the 12-lane section south of New Brunswick. The Tpk sustains 16 lanes for awhile through Union & Essex Counties (3 cars-only lanes and 5 lanes in the trucks-cars-buses-HOV section in each direction). I think most of the segment between New Brunswick and the Eastern Spur/Western Spur split is 14 lanes though, dropping to 12 and then 10 lanes before the merge by Exit 8A.

[billpa]

lammius, on Mar 31 2006, 02:46 PM, said:

Yeah that looks like the 12-lane section south of New Brunswick. The Tpk sustains 16 lanes for awhile through Union & Essex Counties (3 cars-only lanes and 5 lanes in the trucks-cars-buses-HOV section in each direction). I think most of the segment between New Brunswick and the Eastern Spur/Western Spur split is 14 lanes though, dropping to 12 and then 10 lanes before the merge by Exit 8A.

I would nominate the NJ Turnpike through Newark, the greatest place in the world for transportation geeks. When you're driving (especially northbound) you can see hundreds of cars, buses and trucks around you on more than a dozen lanes--turn your head to the left and there are all manner of planes, 747s, Airbuses, etc. To the right there are several train lines...and beyond that? Port Newark/Elizabeth with huge container ships dropping off their goods. An amazing sight in all directions.

[Nightstar2001]

jpl02, on Feb 16 2006, 03:06 PM, said:

It looks like most of the road is asphalt judging from the photos. My question is why it wasn't built with concrete as opposed to asphalt, due to the harsh winters and concrete lasting longer and weathering the cold much better.

Concrete doesn't last longer here in Canada the main problem is due to the winters. The ground freezing and thawing causes holes under the concrete to form just like anything else and you get the infamous pothole.

Although many people don’t know this but there is concrete under the 401. The highway was originally built of concrete. (If you look at historic photo’s you’ll see what I mean) A lot of problems developed though because concrete isn’t very flexible in comparison to asphalt. So the solution was to keep the concrete underneath for straight and use asphalt on top for flexibility so if you ever see them doing work on the 401 and have the chance to see you’ll actually see the highway is much thicker then most and that’s because of the two layers. Also Discovery Channel up here ran a show that talked about how the repair the 401 in Toronto but sadly I don’t remember what it was called.

[damus]

urbanjames, on Feb 15 2006, 05:53 PM, said:

when the 401 was built, it was built as a "toronto bypass", being outside the built up urban section of toronto... today, it's pretty much right in the middle... the 407 was built north of toronto a few years ago as an electronic toll road and that has allowed people who want to go faster the ability to pay for that privilege...

Heh... I don't know much about the history of Toronto, but I have read that Montreal has been the "centre" of Canadien commerce until relatively recently. I find it amazing how urban Canada is, most of the growth in the US over the past half century or so has been suburbia or cities that aren't really cities (Phoenix, Los Angeles), while Canada's big cities have continued to grow in population. Must be the high petrol prices up there...

The only one of the "big 3" canada cities I've been to is Montreal. There isn't a city in the US anything like it. It's safe but at the same time almost as vibrant as Manhattan.

[tamias6]

The Stretch I-70 running next to the airport on the southwest side of Indianapolis, looks very much like the 401, only made of concrete instead of asphalt. Its freaking seeing row upon row of vehicles on both side of ther family car.

[Trae_1]

That is one big freeway. Maybe rail would have done good to it. Take up four center lanes, or two outer lanes on each side.

[Snowguy716]

Nightstar2001, on Apr 1 2006, 03:49 PM, said:

Concrete doesn't last longer here in Canada the main problem is due to the winters. The ground freezing and thawing causes holes under the concrete to form just like anything else and you get the infamous pothole.

Although many people don’t know this but there is concrete under the 401. The highway was originally built of concrete. (If you look at historic photo’s you’ll see what I mean) A lot of problems developed though because concrete isn’t very flexible in comparison to asphalt. So the solution was to keep the concrete underneath for straight and use asphalt on top for flexibility so if you ever see them doing work on the 401 and have the chance to see you’ll actually see the highway is much thicker then most and that’s because of the two layers. Also Discovery Channel up here ran a show that talked about how the repair the 401 in Toronto but sadly I don’t remember what it was called.

Come to northern Minnesota sometime.. you'll be hard pressed to find a cement road. Everything is asphalt here.. and more expensive to maintain. They have come up with some asphalt mixtures now, however, that after 8 years, are still relatively smooth without cracks... and still maintains a darker color.

I believe these are the ones that turn real red colored once the black goes away towards the end of its life cycle.

[Rican427]

Puerto Rico's freeway 18 has an Annual Average Daily Traffic of over 320,000 daily which is pretty good.

[lammius]

I've driven the 401 before, and it is indeed a big road. The exchanges between express and local lanes seem to occur more frequently than those on interstates in NJ.

I haven't seen many of the freeways in Houston or Atlanta, but the NJ Turnpike has a 20-ish mile section of 14 through lanes, between exits 9 and 14. There are two sections but instead of local/express, the separation creates lanes for cars exclusively on the interior roadway, cars, trucks, and buses together on the exterior roadway.

Here's a pic near Rahway, NJ (note there is a tractor-trailer in the Cars Only lanes).


More NJ Turnpike Photos

This post has been edited by lammius: 07 November 2006 - 01:23 PM

[bigboyz05]

That is one big a$$ freeway! Just imagine how the traffic would be jammed if it was just a regular 8-10 lane road.

[SBCmetroguy]

Holy WOW that's in-friggin-sane!

[BrandonTO416]

jpl02, on Feb 16 2006, 04:06 PM, said:

About the only thing in the states close to the 401 is Atlanta's Downtown Connector, or (when it's finished), I-10 in Houston from 610 to Katy. For a roadgeek like me, the 401 is a wet dream

It looks like most of the road is asphalt judging from the photos. My question is why it wasn't built with concrete as opposed to asphalt, due to the harsh winters and concrete lasting longer and weathering the cold much better.

I have a family member who is an engineer for the DOT in this state.

Here are the arguments against concrete:

*Extremely expensive
*Takes years of construction time over asphalt construction
*If concrete is not the expensive mix, with the longer and more expensive construction process, it crumbles faster than asphalt
*You cannot replace and resurface concrete, you may pave over it with... ASPHALT... but its a pain to replace and costs more to replace than the original construction. In other words you must re-construct concrete roadways, or either resurface them with asphalt. Resurfacing with asphalt defeats the purpose of having a concrete roadway.
*Asphalt can be resurfaced within months of time, and even in cold climates this is more suitable than laying a piece of concrete and leaving it for 20 years.

Lastly, an asthetic thing, concrete is rougher than asphalt 9 times out of 10. You'll experience less road bumpiness and road noise on asphalt a majority of the time.

Greater Toronto has better highways than most major US cities in my opinion. The 401 has some rough sections, but its not as rough as half the cities I've been to in the US.

This post has been edited by heckles: 08 November 2006 - 02:03 AM

[johnathan]

'Couple of Interesting Facts About Toronto To Provide Perspective regarding the high volume of 'The 401':

- #16 in World (#3 in North America) list of cities in terms of # of cars per sq. km (68,723)
- Toronto has about 2.6 Million people in 2006 (2.5 Million in 2001 Census) in its core, with 5.8 Million people in the GTA (Greater Toronto Area) in 2006 4.6 Million 2001 Census).
-Toronto essentially has a box-form ring around the main part of the city, with the 401 forming the major east-west link to other cities in the north end of the city (12-16 lanes within Toronto itself (more at major interchanges)), the Gardiner Expressway (east-west) going Downtown, the 427 (north-south, 12-20 lanes) on the outer western edge of the city and the Don Valley Parkway (colloquially DVP, 6 lanes) going North-South to Downtown and extending as the 404 (8-10 lanes, HOV under construction) north of the 401.
-Other important highways in the city is the north-south 400 (8-12 lanes) in the western-central area of the city starting just south of the 401 and extending northward, and a small intra-city 6-lane highway extending approx. 8km roughly centred around the 401 and in the central area of the city.
- Toronto has the largest (1st) freeway capacity in North America (5th in World) within the city itself (2.7 Lane Miles per Mile)
- Toronto is relatively dense with a land area of 629.91 sq. km and an average of 4127.6 people per sq. km. For example, Los Angeles (city proper) with approximately 4.0 Million people has a land area of 1214.71 sq.km and therefore a lower population density of 3251.7 people per sq.km!
- Toronto is what I call a city torn by different attitudes: The result is a city with a ton of cars but also decent (but not great ) transit. FYI: Toronto's transit system is 2nd in volume in North America only to New York City.

Why all this data: Gives you perspective. It is for these reasons (huge suburban area of 3.2 Million people vs. 2.6 Million in city proper), few support highways within the city and surrounding the city core, large public transit system, large overall population density, and additional through traffic from the Detroit to Quebec City corridor that the 401 has its claim to fame as the busiest and longest 12+lane highway in North America.

Footnote: The collector/express system throughout Toronto proper is very elegant and easy to follow. Lanes and exits are very well signed even when under construction, and overhead electronic boards inform the driver of upcoming exit closures or heavy traffic so that you can better plan and adjust your drive. Electronic sign example: "Collectors Moving Slowly Beyond Next Transfer, Express Moving Well" . 'Transfer' refers to the point where the collectors and express lanes exchange traffic. In addition, all three major interchanges (to other highways/freeways) have ramps from both the express and collector lanes, though not necessarily from both directions. With the addition of the HOV lane trial on the 404, they added an additional, dedicated HOV lane to 401 Westbound traffic in addition to the separate 401 Westbound Express and 401 Westbound Collectors ramps.

[Spartan]

Don't worry America, we will regain the title of the widest freeway in North America if Atlanta gets its way... it wants to widen I-75 through the NW suburbs to 23 lanes.

This 401 in Toronto is a cool concept. Sort of like a freeway within a freeway. It doesn't help Canada's supposedly "more urban" reputation, IMO.

[95-Souf]

Yeah that project in Atlanta is going to be ridiculous.
This makes me wonder where is L.A. would fit in this discussion. i would have at least thought the Santa Anna freeway would have been the widest in the US.

Also another thing, the NJ Turnpike seriously bottle necks about halfway downstate when those Truck Only lanes merge with the rest of traffic. Its funny to see people cut thru the gard rails when they see traffic comming to a halt in the Cars Only lane just before the merge.

But I never understood why I-95 in Miami-Dade County is completely concrete and the rest of the metro asphalt?

[Lady Celeste]

Spartan, on Nov 9 2006, 04:33 PM, said:

Don't worry America, we will regain the title of the widest freeway in North America if Atlanta gets its way... it wants to widen I-75 through the NW suburbs to 23 lanes.

This 401 in Toronto is a cool concept. Sort of like a freeway within a freeway. It doesn't help Canada's supposedly "more urban" reputation, IMO.

Let's hope that 23 lane disaster never gets built in metro Atlanta or anywhere in Georgia. From my understanding of the renderings of the freeway, it will look an awful lot like the 401 except it will have a BRT lanes running up the center.

[Spartan]

Yeah i know... BRT down the center is a horrid idea anyway. Mass transit needs to go where the people are, not in a river of cars.

[Copper]

[johnathan]

Awesome. For reference the field to the left of the highway is part of Pearson International, and this is in northern Mississauga.

Just west of here (another 100 metres or so) the highway expands to 25 lanes (with street on-ramps) or 21 lanes (expressway and expressway on-ramps).

Believe it or not even with all these lanes the expressway it is converging with (410 heading North, 403 heading South), there are no lanes FROM the 410 South and 403 North to the 401 West! These are still in the planning stages and will likely open once the highway expands its collector/express sytem further into Mississauga (it doesn't continue much past the 410/403 at present. If you look at google maps, you can actually see the rough outlines of makeshift ramps that may hae once been started but abandoned, and how shortly after this interchange the 401 shifts to a mere 8 lanes!