Transit Updates for Greater Grand Rapids

[Rizzo]

I've been keeping tabs on The Rapid website and just saw today that the site was greatly improved! It appears to be more functional and interactive with the ability to purchase tickets online. The layout is just great...well done Rapid.

Go check it out. A+ improvement http://www.ridetherapid.org/

In Metro transit news: http://www.mlive.com/news/grpress/index.ss....xml&coll=6

Very interesting to see if this passes. It would be awesome if there was a small starter commuter from GR to the beach burbs...

Edited September 16, 2006 by Rizzo

[GRDadof3]

I keep watching for the giant Oppenheim statue installation to begin, but I haven't seen anything yet. I wonder how long it takes to build something like that.

[DwntwnGeo]

I posted this in a related thread, but thought maybe I should post it here also:

I guess they are planning to update the current Amtrack site rather than relocate it closer to the Rapid Central Station. I thought it would be nice if the Train/Greyhound/The Rapid stations could all be in the same spot?

Quote from the Business Journal this morning:

"Members of the Grand Valley Metro Council recently approved an agreement with the Michigan Department of Transportation that will lead to a makeover of the Amtrak station at 431 Wealthy St. SW."

The complete article is here: http://www.grbj.com/GRBJ/ArticleArchive/20...oard+Amtrak.htm

[tony speller]

I posted this in a related thread, but thought maybe I should post it here also:

I guess they are planning to update the current Amtrack site rather than relocate it closer to the Rapid Central Station. I thought it would be nice if the Train/Greyhound/The Rapid stations could all be in the same spot?

Quote from the Business Journal this morning:

"Members of the Grand Valley Metro Council recently approved an agreement with the Michigan Department of Transportation that will lead to a makeover of the Amtrak station at 431 Wealthy St. SW."

The complete article is here: http://www.grbj.com/GRBJ/ArticleArchive/20...oard+Amtrak.htm

that'd be nice and would make a lot of sense. it's too bad we can't take a train directly from GR to detroit though.

[michaelskis]

Any word on a light rail system yet?

[DwntwnGeo]

Any word on a light rail system yet?

From what has been mentioned earlier probably in this thread or another was that studies done currently don't show enough public transit use to justify a light rail system. The two studies are indicating either Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) or streetcars. From what I understand, both systems will have their own Right-of-Ways associated with them, so when the time comes in the future for a light rail system part of the cost will already be done.

[NorthCoast]

That scenario in Orlando was really neat. A lot of neighborhoods have been sliced and growth stunted by rail freight lines. I think it would help a lot of communities if these lines were used in support of a LRT system. Unfortunately, the reality is I'm pretty certain that many of these freight lines are still used quite regularly. Good thing there is the streetcar alternative. Either way it sure is exciting.

[michaelskis]

From what has been mentioned earlier probably in this thread or another was that studies done currently don't show enough public transit use to justify a light rail system. The two studies are indicating either Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) or streetcars. From what I understand, both systems will have their own Right-of-Ways associated with them, so when the time comes in the future for a light rail system part of the cost will already be done.

People don

[GRDadof3]

What they need to do is an economic feasibility study and not limits it to the city proper but to surround areas. Find out of people would use it for commuting purposes from other parts of the metro into downtown. Then determine where all the economic notes are within the individual neighborhoods. Those are your stops.

Its not a

[AlexPKeaton]

The old trolleys were profitable in their day, weren't they? Weren't they commonly run as private businesses and not city-owned? If it could make a profit then maybe private investment could work. If only it weren't so cheap to drive.

-nb

[Rizzo]

The old trolleys were profitable in their day, weren't they? Weren't they commonly run as private businesses and not city-owned? If it could make a profit then maybe private investment could work. If only it weren't so cheap to drive.

-nb

I remember from old stories that the Ramona Park line was the most profitable, it was always bustling -- it's probably obvious because the line fed into a well visited destination.

Edited September 18, 2006 by Rizzo

[tamias6]

Are there any current and successful examples of a privately owned mass transit system in the US? The reason I ask is I'm a bit on edge at the idea of privately of a held mass transit system. Take a look at the rail road berrons of the 1800's. They held monopolies and took full advantage of it big time. These monopolies were not really broken until the airplane, automobile, and the interstate system were created.

[DwntwnGeo]

Kalamazoo is along a main rail route between Detroit and Chicago. There are four different Amtrak stops going to Chicago (9:41am, 10:24am, 2:51pm, 8:12pm) and four stops going to the Detroit area (11:23am, 4:45pm, 6:24pm, 9:30). There is only one round trip service to Chicago out of Grand Rapids. I was wondering what people

[Allison Slater]

I know there's already a freight track running south out of GR through Wayland and I believe it leads into Kalamazoo. I also know that much of the old Interurban corridor still exists. There's a few buildings plopped over the top of it near downtown, the highway crosses over it near 100th st. twice, and that car lot near 100th st. also rests upon it. But aside from that, the majority of the old path is unblocked, and travels through or very near the original downtowns of the towns it travels through. It skirts Moline, runs right through the blocks just west of downtown Wayland (although the bus facility currently uses the path as a driveway, that would have to be re-routed, and the skate park is also off this driveway, so that would need new access as well.). Further south I don't recall how it interacts with its environment, but I know it's mostly undisturbed as a rural 2-track down to Plainwell.

In fact, I would LOVE to see something like this happen, especially with a stop in Wayland along the old Interurban route. Even if the current freight track were to be used, it would be easy to run it down the Interurban through Wayland, as the two run alongside within a few feet of eachother just north of town, and a station near Wayland's downtown would be exactly what it needs to revitalise downtown, which is (by a guess) 50% vacant.

[DwntwnGeo]

My thought was to run the existing freight track. I am not too familiar with the interurban routes. I followed the frieght lines from Grand Rapids to Kalamazoo, but I cannot tell what condition the tracks are in and whether they are even used today. With three complete "round trips" at various times each day, I would think it would generate as many passengers and hopefully more than what currently travels from Grand Rapids to Chicago.

[Yankee Fan]

In regards to the Interurban, a good place to go is Jamestown Township out by Hudsonville. The interurban used to pass right through there. In fact, the public library is built right on the old rail line and is designed with train themes throughout the building. Outside, a bike path bridge that crosses a small stream next to Riley was constructed out of wood to look like a miniature train bridge. it is even lit at night, which I think makes it one of three things with lights at night in Jamestown (the other two being the blinking red light and the bell tower on Jamestown Reformed Church.

[Rizzo]

Corridors I'd be looking at are i96 and 196 all routes to Downtown. Especially, when Metro Muskegon appears to be flowering with growth. When you look at the shore burbs, their growth potential and the current boom in GR you'll notice that eventually there will be some kind of transit initiative intermetro. If downtown GR becomes a magnet for lake shore commuters, I could see in the future a line for workers living in the shore burbs.

Muskegon to i96, traffic count is 26,400/24hrs

Holland to 196, 22,700/24 hours

The infrastructure is there.

Edited September 19, 2006 by Rizzo

[Allison Slater]

The north-south freight line is in good condition and is still used a few times each day. One of the conductors will often stop his train in Wayland, grab some Burger King, then continue on. I know there's side tracks running off towards the Dean Foods Plant which are also used. Because of this, I imagine there could be some complications in attempting to run a passenger system along this route, which is why I think building a new line along the old North-South Interurban, or at least providing points, especially near towns, where the line can split off to allow two rail types to pass eachother and load/unload without interference.

[grcitydog]

While I agree that this would be nice, (in fact I have often dreamed of it), I cannot imagine that there would be near enough demand to make it feasible. If you don't want to drive into Chicago and can't make the one departure per day in GR, you can always drive to Kzoo and be on the train in an hour.

[tamias6]

I was going to post my mass transit idea but the file I wanted to post was damage. I'll try again later

Edited September 20, 2006 by tamias6

[GRDadof3]

While I agree that this would be nice, (in fact I have often dreamed of it), I cannot imagine that there would be near enough demand to make it feasible. If you don't want to drive into Chicago and can't make the one departure per day in GR, you can always drive to Kzoo and be on the train in an hour.

The better option is actually to drive to Michigan City and get on the South Shore Line there (Carroll Avenue Station). It's only $7 or $8 one way, and parking is free, and you can park overnight. You'd normally pay $35 - $40/night to park in Chicago, so that savings alone is worth it. It takes you right to the Randolph St/Millennium Park station downtown Chicago, and is about a 2 hour ride (quite a few stops, but not bad).

South Shore Line Map

Fares

I posted more details HERE

[DwntwnGeo]

I guess the point I was asking was more along the line of

[Allison Slater]

I don't see how it wouldn't be profitable for amtrack if they did this... in the long run. The only question is, would ridership increase? I can imagine a lot of waylanders would try it if it were given a stop in wayland, but that isn't many people. Would people in Grand Rapids and Kalamazoo use it? With a lower cost between the two think I could easilly see some casual day-off-work ridership. Have one trip in the morning, another mid-day, and another later at night. Hop on the train, visit other city for the day, head back at the end of day and go back to your own bed without ever touching a steering wheel.

[suydam]

The better option is actually to drive to Michigan City and get on the South Shore Line there (Carroll Avenue Station). It's only $7 or $8 one way, and parking is free, and you can park overnight. You'd normally pay $35 - $40/night to park in Chicago, so that savings alone is worth it. It takes you right to the Randolph St/Millennium Park station downtown Chicago, and is about a 2 hour ride (quite a few stops, but not bad).

South Shore Line Map

Fares

I posted more details HERE

That is the only way I travel to Chicago anymore. It's cheap, easy, stress-free, clean, safe and drops me off in the heart of the city.

I highly recommend the South Shore Line from Michigan City (Carroll St. station) if you haven't tried it before.

[Nitro]

That is the only way I travel to Chicago anymore. It's cheap, easy, stress-free, clean, safe and drops me off in the heart of the city.

I'll third this notion. It's the only way I go to Chicago too. We went down for taste of Chicago this year, parked at Carroll Ave. got on the train and got off right at taste. We were there for the day, jumped back on the train and home before bed. Nice way to travel.