Belk at Phipps?!?

[StevenRocks]

Still, no Dillard's in Wal-Mart-anchored strip centers, at least- so if Dillard's is bad, Belk's is still slightly worse, in terms of its lowest stores. And Dillard's is closing its bad stores, even slowly, while Belk still opens them in strip centers.

Belk has identified smaller markets as a means for solid, profitable growth. The standard small-town Belk prototype is around 65,000 square feet and typically is in the best shopping center in town. As old store leases run out, they're being replaced with new, remodeled, or expanded locations that are both stylish and modern. Belk is often the only retailer in town selling national-brand merchandise and prestige cosmetics.

These stores shore up Belk's bottom line and create legions of loyal customers that apprecaite that a store with some semblence of class wants to locate in their town.

Belk is able to operate the smaller stores along with the larger ones by outfitting the larger stores with more designer merchandise and fancier products and services.

Often times, large Belk stores are less glamourous than their competition. But it should be noted that strong sales at Belk stores are part of the reason why the upscale anchors come in the first place.

[mallguy]

Belk has identified smaller markets as a means for solid, profitable growth. The standard small-town Belk prototype is around 65,000 square feet and typically is in the best shopping center in town. As old store leases run out, they're being replaced with new, remodeled, or expanded locations that are both stylish and modern. Belk is often the only retailer in town selling national-brand merchandise and prestige cosmetics.

These stores shore up Belk's bottom line and create legions of loyal customers that apprecaite that a store with some semblence of class wants to locate in their town.

Belk is able to operate the smaller stores along with the larger ones by outfitting the larger stores with more designer merchandise and fancier products and services.

Often times, large Belk stores are less glamourous than their competition. But it should be noted that strong sales at Belk stores are part of the reason why the upscale anchors come in the first place.

Exactly why Belk should operate Parisian stores and Belk stores, like Federated does with Bloomingdale's and Macy's. Can't wait for people in Georgia who are used to small-town Belk stores to see the Belk sign going up on Phipps Plaza. Goodwill and brand image are important, and Belk is ignoring both.

[TRoberts]

Exactly why Belk should operate Parisian stores and Belk stores, like Federated does with Bloomingdale's and Macy's. Can't wait for people in Georgia who are used to small-town Belk stores to see the Belk sign going up on Phipps Plaza. Goodwill and brand image are important, and Belk is ignoring both.

It's already stated in the Belk press release that all of the Parisian stores are to be rebranded to Belk by the third quarter of 2007. That includes Phipps Plaza.

And to all of you guys who say you don't understand the whole "A, B, C, etc" store categorizing... EVERY retail chain categorizes their stores - usually on sales volume. Obviously, stores with a higher sales volume need higher amounts of inventories than stores with a lower sales volume. The same holds true for Neiman Marcus, Nordstrom, Saks 5th Avenue and everyone else. You can't classify an entire chain of stores as one type store and then send the exact same merchandise and quantities to every store. Retail sales don't work that way. Retail sales are dependant on the location of the store foremost. What sells at Neiman Marcus in Florida is going to neccessarily be what sells at Neiman Marcus in New England.

And anyone that calls Macy's upscales after their buy-out of May Department Stores and ultimate rebranding of EVERYTHING is crazy. Upscale is a chain that DOESN'T have a store in every major and minor metropolitan area.

Anyway, sorry guys, but it looks like Belk is coming to Phipps. Congrats...

[Abe2M12]

I'm definetly not thrilled that Belk is comming to phipps, but i don't think its that huge of an upset. Its not like they are robbing us of our history like marshall field's becoming macy's. Atlanta however is in need of a flagship Barneys. It's kind of an advantage that belk isn't recognized in Atlanta, therefore local shoppers can decide for themselves on what impression to judge the store. As for the future phipps location, belk better pull out all the stops, surpassing the "flagship" at southpark mall in Charlotte. Sure Southpark is the "best" in the Charlotte area but by atlanta/dallas/houston/miami/etc. standards its pretty much second place i.e Perimeter Mall (very nice but not exactly phipps/lenox) I was at southpark yesterday and sure i've always liked it but i'm still suprised at how similar its department stores are. There really is no difference in the merchandise at the belk/dillards/hect's (soon to be macy's although bloomingdales would fit in better but N.C doesn't seem ready) sure belk sells theort and stuart wietzman but it ends there, the only one that stands out is Nordstrom and the soon to open tiny 80,000sq ft Neiman Marcus (which people are making an exaggerated deal out of) Ever since federated bought may, lord & taylor left for the northeast, and barney's decide to grow small, malls have been scouring to find department stores to fill in the gaps, Belk seems to be the only option for phipps. It could be worse and stay vacant but that would never happen.

[shrek05]

Perhaps the Belks at Phipps will be different than others. At least I hope so. It definitely does not fit in with everything else (similar to Sears at Ala Moana and South Coast.) But similarly, all department stores have better stocked stores and worse stores. Dillard's has a pretty poor reputation in the southwest, but the Dillard's at Scottsdale Fashion Square (the largest in the chain) stocks many higher-end items like Armani, Dior, and Chanel. Belks at Phipps may do the same...well they will have to if they want to survive.

Come to think of it, I have never ever heard of Saks, Neiman Marcus, Bloomingdales or Nordstrom haivng A, B or C stores. I have never seen a Neiman Marcus at some strip mall in some exurban part of Atlanta.

Thats untrue. Of course, not as badly as Belks or Dillards, but they definitely have higher tier stores and lower stores. The new Neimans at SouthPark will most likely not carry many of the higher brands (its only 80,000 square feet.) The Saks in Phoenix for the longest time (late 80s to mid 90s) didnt carry a lot of the big brands until in 1999/2000 when consumers complained about the lack of many prominent brands like Chloe, Elie Tahari, Balenciaga, Brioni, etc (and today the Saks in Phoenix is fully stocked with SK-II and Shu Uemura making their debuts there too). Though Phoenix now stocks these items there are still many around the country that are significantly understocked, like at Denver, San Antonio, and San Diego, and other smaller markets are all still understocked.

Even individual brands have different levels. Only a handful of LVs in the country carry the ready-to-wear (pretty sure Atlanta doesnt have LV ready to wear). And among those stores, some are much better stocked like Costa Mesa, Forum Shops, 5th Avenue (all sizes, etc) whereas the Union Square on in SF, though has ready to wear, is significantly less impressive. Also many LV stores are basic ones, only carrying luggage and small leather goods (Denver, Short Hills, Charlotte, Nashville, etc). Every brand has rankings and the Belk at Phipps better be different if they are smart.

[StevenRocks]

Exactly why Belk should operate Parisian stores and Belk stores, like Federated does with Bloomingdale's and Macy's. Can't wait for people in Georgia who are used to small-town Belk stores to see the Belk sign going up on Phipps Plaza. Goodwill and brand image are important, and Belk is ignoring both.

Honestly, keeping both Macy's and Bloomingdale's brands doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but I can see why Federated did it. Macy's and Bloomingdale's are powerful brand names that represent something special to shoppers all around the world. They also looka and feel different when you visit them.

Belk and Parisian are closer in marketing and merhcandising than Macy's and Bloomingdale's are. Parisian hasn't been particurally elegant in years and Belk isn't that different than Parisian when you compare stores in the same town or the same mall.

I think that it's a mistake to underestimate Belk's intentions at Phipps Plaza and to over-hypothesize consumer behavior of Atlanta shoppers. Belk's not a dumb company. If they took on a high-profile location like Phipps, it ain't gonna be a carbon copy of stores in Cumming or Dalton. Secondly, despite the analysis we've done here, ultimately the market will decide if Belk's made the right decision. Not us.

[memphian]

Well.... here is a link from Nashville. If the types of comments coming out of Nashville are any indication; Belk will have an uphill battle on its hands in a lot of markets. (The Cool Springs Parisian has historically been one of the best performing stores in the Parisian chain).

http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...ESS01/608030381

[TampaTKE]

In Florida, Belk is similar to a Kohl's, Bealls or Marshall's. They have nice clean Suburban stores. Dillards in Florida is moderately upscale on par with Macy's and the recently departed Lord & Taylor. Dillard's carries some quality brands in Florida (Tommy Bahama, Polo, BCBG, Sigrid Olsen, Clairborne, Kenneth Cole, etc). Dillards fits in many upscale Malls in FL with stores like Tiffany, Hugo Boss, Gucci, Louis Vitton, Nordstrom and Neiman Marcus. Dillard's also appears in middle income malls with Macy's, Banana Republic, etc.

[mcheiss]

We in Arkansas know how you guys feel, both of our Parisian Stores under development have been scraped, which is so sad.

[StevenRocks]

In Florida, Belk is similar to a Kohl's, Bealls or Marshall's. They have nice clean Suburban stores. Dillards in Florida is moderately upscale on par with Macy's and the recently departed Lord & Taylor. Dillard's carries some quality brands in Florida (Tommy Bahama, Polo, BCBG, Sigrid Olsen, Clairborne, Kenneth Cole, etc). Dillards fits in many upscale Malls in FL with stores like Tiffany, Hugo Boss, Gucci, Louis Vitton, Nordstrom and Neiman Marcus. Dillard's also appears in middle income malls with Macy's, Banana Republic, etc.

A lot of why Dillard's is percieved as the better brand is because they came into Florida by aquiring Ivey's and Gayfer's/Maison Blanche, stores that tended to locate in swankier malls than Belk-Lindsey did. It also helped to block any efforts Belk had to expand into nicer malls or aquire new vendors where they competed with each other, through what's called "anchor veto power" and exclusive vendor agreements that came with their aquisition of the nicer stores. Dillard's bought their Florida influence, while Belk organically built theirs.

After Dillard's, flush with cash, bought all the best locations, Belk was pretty much run out of Florida. Belk responded by basically screwing Dillard's on Belk's home turf in the Carolinas. In most of North and South Carolina, Belk is the premier chain and Dillard's is the second-fiddle. Anyone who doubts Belk's ability to function in an upscale matter needs to check out their core-market stores.

[StevenRocks]

Well.... here is a link from Nashville. If the types of comments coming out of Nashville are any indication; Belk will have an uphill battle on its hands in a lot of markets. (The Cool Springs Parisian has historically been one of the best performing stores in the Parisian chain).

http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...ESS01/608030381

That's an incredibly snarky article. The Kurt Barnard quote particurally irritated me. Parisian was more like Lord & Taylor than Saks. If Parisian was more like Saks, this sale wouldn't have happened because Saks, Incorporated would be essentially cutting off its "right arm."

[Abe2M12]

That's an incredibly snarky article. The Kurt Barnard quote particurally irritated me. Parisian was more like Lord & Taylor than Saks. If Parisian was more like Saks, this sale wouldn't have happened because Saks, Incorporated would be essentially cutting off its "right arm."

Wow! i totally agree, that quote by Barnard was just like what/embarrassing all wrapped up in one plus he felt the same way about macy's. Its not like i'm personally offended but this is a professional speaking, but he is entitled to his wrong oppinion. Has he ever been inside a saks before? i've only been to two parisians and they were nice, a little too mature for my taste but nice, however nowhere near saks. I wonder what saks he went to? (if he's been) maybe the outlet at oprymills! Belk may not be like bergdorfs or saks but neither is parisians.

[StevenRocks]

I've learned to not to take Kurt Barnard and Britt Beemer's quotes very seriously. They're labeled as analyst, but I think they mostly just repeat the trend reports without adding any real insight.

[Lady Celeste]

How big is the Parisians space at Phipps Plaza?

I noticed that Dallas is getting a Barneys. Dallas and Atlanta retail are more inline with each other as they are both maturre markets. There is a Barneys was a Barneys in East Beverly Hills that was 115,000 sqayre feet. Why can't the Parisians spot go to Barneys? Surely Sam Massell won't allow this to occur to Phipps. He is afterall the mayor of Buckhead. I know he can pull some strings here or there.

If the Atlanta fashionista crowd turned their noses to Parisians and the old "lower our standards" Lord & Taylor at Phipps then what makes Belk think it will woo them over. People did not not go to Parisians at Phipps because it stocked bad merchandise. This Parisians was liken to the Belks at SouthPark. They didn't go because it was Parisians at the wrong mall.

The Atlanta market is a hard market. Dillards had to scale back it's Atlanta plans because the metro is already inundated with a plethora of shopping options. Belks will do well at malls like Arbor Place and Stonecrest but I can't see it doing well at Phipps. I don't care if they sell Roll Royces at this Belk...when people say "where did you get that wonderful ensemble?" You reply "Belk." "Oh, Belk *uneasy giggle*...I see. So how are your children?"

Hours later she will be chatting you up talking about "the Rosenthals must have come on hard times. I never knew...they always look so dignified. (comment from other person) How do I know...she is buying her clothes from Belks."

Wait, that makes it look like I would be the gossiper...and I never gossip.

[shrek05]

How big is the Parisians space at Phipps Plaza?

I noticed that Dallas is getting a Barneys. Dallas and Atlanta retail are more inline with each other as they are both maturre markets. There is a Barneys was a Barneys in East Beverly Hills that was 115,000 sqayre feet. Why can't the Parisians spot go to Barneys? Surely Sam Massell won't allow this to occur to Phipps. He is afterall the mayor of Buckhead. I know he can pull some strings here or there.

I think Parisian is the biggest department store at Phipps and the Nordstrom there is about 130,000 square feet, so something larger than that. Barneys cant go into just any space, we learned that in Phoenix. San Francisco happened to have a space that fit Barneys size requirements (most of them are around 80,000-100,000(max) with NYC as an exception.

Also, I think Atlanta is a little more mature than Dallas. Dallas didnt have a lot of retail until recently (with the new opening of NorthPark Center). And, being new, and in a prime city that was relatively lacking retail, NorthPark Center attracted a slew of high end fashion. THey built a store specifically for Barneys to fit into.

But Barneys has stated it will be expanding quite aggressively (its opening 4 new departments stores and 5 new Co-Ops in one year?) Its already verbally confirmed to open in Phoenix by 2008 at a new development. I think its only a matter of time before it opens in Atlanta. You never know, Belk might just sell the space to Barneys....

[Andrea]

Belks will do well at malls like Arbor Place and Stonecrest but I can't see it doing well at Phipps. I don't care if they sell Roll Royces at this Belk...when people say "where did you get that wonderful ensemble?" You reply "Belk." "Oh, Belk *uneasy giggle*...I see. So how are your children?"

Hours later she will be chatting you up talking about "the Rosenthals must have come on hard times. I never knew...they always look so dignified. (comment from other person) How do I know...she is buying her clothes from Belks."

Wait, that makes it look like I would be the gossiper...and I never gossip.

Celeste, I've honestly never thought of Belk's as all that skanky. I've many times purchased clothes for myself and my family there and they seemed about as nice as anywhere else. However, I will have to admit that we are neither fashion plates nor have we ever been plugged in to the upper classes.

Of course, I grew up on the south side and we thought that Sunshine Plaza at Moreland and Custer Avenue was a big deal! When Belvedere came along, it was "northside" luxury beyond our wildest dreams.

[kayman]

That's an incredibly snarky article. The Kurt Barnard quote particurally irritated me. Parisian was more like Lord & Taylor than Saks. If Parisian was more like Saks, this sale wouldn't have happened because Saks, Incorporated would be essentially cutting off its "right arm."

Steven, I've been to a lot of Parisian and Belk stores, and the statement has a lot of truth behind it. Outside of the Carolinas Belk is seen as a sub-par moderate department store. They will have do a South Park treatment of the Phipps, Summit, and CoolSprings stores if they want to keep the current Parisian customer base in the long run. People are talking and the general consensus is they will respond with pockets at other stores like Dillard's, Saks, Neiman-Marcus, and Nordstrom. I will be one of those people too.

[kayman]

How big is the Parisians space at Phipps Plaza?

I noticed that Dallas is getting a Barneys. Dallas and Atlanta retail are more inline with each other as they are both maturre markets. There is a Barneys was a Barneys in East Beverly Hills that was 115,000 sqayre feet. Why can't the Parisians spot go to Barneys? Surely Sam Massell won't allow this to occur to Phipps. He is afterall the mayor of Buckhead. I know he can pull some strings here or there.

If the Atlanta fashionista crowd turned their noses to Parisians and the old "lower our standards" Lord & Taylor at Phipps then what makes Belk think it will woo them over. People did not not go to Parisians at Phipps because it stocked bad merchandise. This Parisians was liken to the Belks at SouthPark. They didn't go because it was Parisians at the wrong mall.

The Atlanta market is a hard market. Dillards had to scale back it's Atlanta plans because the metro is already inundated with a plethora of shopping options. Belks will do well at malls like Arbor Place and Stonecrest but I can't see it doing well at Phipps. I don't care if they sell Roll Royces at this Belk...when people say "where did you get that wonderful ensemble?" You reply "Belk." "Oh, Belk *uneasy giggle*...I see. So how are your children?"

Hours later she will be chatting you up talking about "the Rosenthals must have come on hard times. I never knew...they always look so dignified. (comment from other person) How do I know...she is buying her clothes from Belks."

Wait, that makes it look like I would be the gossiper...and I never gossip.

I must agree people are starting to say the same thing around Birmingham as well about Belk. Belk's only stores in the area are in the exburbs until the McRae's-Proffitts acquistion. Those acquistion still didn't change people's perception of the stores, most are like "I only go there if I want bargain basement clothes for my kids". The word is around town now is with the people of upper incomes is that they will be shopping elsewhere from now on like Saks or other cities.

[StevenRocks]

Steven, I've been to a lot of Parisian and Belk stores, and the statement has a lot of truth behind it. Outside of the Carolinas Belk is seen as a sub-par moderate department store. They will have do a South Park treatment of the Phipps, Summit, and CoolSprings stores if they want to keep the current Parisian customer base in the long run. People are talking and the general consensus is they will respond with pockets at other stores like Dillard's, Saks, Neiman-Marcus, and Nordstrom. I will be one of those people too.

I'm sure that the Parisian stores in Pensacola, Florida and Tupelo, Mississippi really give that Saks feeling. I can feel the Fifth Avenue luxury from here, it's so strong

Belk is out to change the negative perceptions of its stores. But it can't stop ignorant people who would turn up their noses at Belk to shop at Dillard's. Six-of-one, half-a-dozen of another, I say.

[kayman]

I'm sure that the Parisian stores in Pensacola, Florida and Tupelo, Mississippi really give that Saks feeling. I can feel the Fifth Avenue luxury from here, it's so strong

Belk is out to change the negative perceptions of its stores. But it can't stop ignorant people who would turn up their noses at Belk to shop at Dillard's. Six-of-one, half-a-dozen of another, I say.

Myself, my family members have had one too many bad experiences with Belk, I would rather take my chances at JCPenney, Sears, or TJ Maxx before Belk again. Every chain including Bloomingdales and Neimans have Class C stores, and Tupelo, Pensacola, Tuscaloosa, and Gadsden (including former locations like Western Hills and Eastwood) was Parisian's. But there is a huge difference between a Class C Parisian and a Class C Belk. We all know this.

[NCMike1981]

It's so strange to me, someone who grew up in Belks core market, to hear so many people hating the fact that the chain is moving further into their market. It sounds like there is a huge difference between stores in their core markets when compared to stores elsewhere.

Dillards really isn't all that big in NC. In the Triangle area we have just 3 Dillards compared to 9 Belks. I know that this sounds like oversaturation on Belks part but people around here tend to view the chain differently then, say people in GA or TN...

Here are pics of the 3 Triangle area Dillards stores courtesy of their website...

Click on the pics to see where they are located if you are bored...

[StevenRocks]

Myself, my family members have had one too many bad experiences with Belk, I would rather take my chances at JCPenney, Sears, or TJ Maxx before Belk again. Every chain including Bloomingdales and Neimans have Class C stores, and Tupelo, Pensacola, Tuscaloosa, and Gadsden (including former locations like Western Hills and Eastwood) was Parisian's. But there is a huge difference between a Class C Parisian and a Class C Belk. We all know this.

What on earth could Belk have done to you and your family that was so unforgivable? I can't make you like a store that you don't want to, but I'm a little baffled by this.

I've said this at least a couple of times already, but Belk isn't out to ruin the former Parisian stores. If anything, they'll enhance them if they can. The biggest difference will be the name.

[mallguy]

Belk certainly isn't out to ruin the Parisian stores but Belk is Belk and runs Belk stores- I'd think that Belk buyers and execs would, due to years of working for Belk, be likely to make the Parisian stores into Belk ones, since Belk employees naturally think that Belk merchandising, presentation, etc. are what works. Thus Saddlebred clothes and Levi's will be added to former Parisian stores, not out of spite or anything, but because Belk people think that's what will work, as they've worked well for Belk for years. Sure, hopefully Belk buyers, etc. will keep the Joseph Abboud ties and the Tailor Byrd shirts, but the stores will likely have some low-brow clothes added in as well (just as Belk SouthPark has some low-end clothes), along with maybe some new high-end brands as well.

Ugh. Change isn't always good.

[shrek05]

The biggest difference will be the name.

Heh. Name does a lot. Even if Belks at Phipps carries the same brand as Norstrom, a poor reputation associated with the name Belk will go far. People would rather be seen in Nordstrom purchasing that item than at "Belk." Of course, I've never seen how bad one of these "horrendous" Belks are, but in that Tennessean article, it looks pretty bad. IF that is Atlanta's preconceived notion of that department store...they will struggle regardless of what they sell when tryign to target the higher end shoppers.

Where you buy it is quite important , dont overestimate the superficial. Just cuz its the same brands doesn't mean anything.

[Andrea]

Belk certainly isn't out to ruin the Parisian stores but Belk is Belk and runs Belk stores- I'd think that Belk buyers and execs would, due to years of working for Belk, be likely to make the Parisian stores into Belk ones, since Belk employees naturally think that Belk merchandising, presentation, etc. are what works. Thus Saddlebred clothes and Levi's will be added to former Parisian stores, not out of spite or anything, but because Belk people think that's what will work, as they've worked well for Belk for years. Sure, hopefully Belk buyers, etc. will keep the Joseph Abboud ties and the Tailor Byrd shirts, but the stores will likely have some low-brow clothes added in as well (just as Belk SouthPark has some low-end clothes), along with maybe some new high-end brands as well.

Ugh. Change isn't always good.

I think it's important to to keep in mind the community that a store serves. We're talking about Phipps Plaza here, not Beverly Hills. Yes, Buckhead has its zillionaires, but it's also home to tons of regular families who decided to stay put and make their home in the city, rather than run for the suburbs. Many of us are not exactly made out of money, and we simply want to buy good quality, serviceable clothes for ourselves and our families. I look forward to having a nice Belk's here. I've shopped at Belk's since I was a little kid and I don't see the problem.