[MZT]

Yeah, Montgomery Ward was the last anchor left at Carousel Mall in San Bernardino too. Rumor was they wanted to leave, and the city kept urging them not to.

That was in Y2001, maybe the Mall turned around or Montgomery finally bailed.

[DigitalSky]

NCMike1981, on Oct 4 2005, 05:44 PM, said:

Kind of off subject but I have always wondered why, in Durham, Dillards never signed onto the Southpoint Mega Mall, but instead chose to keep stores in University Mall in Chapel Hill and South Square Mall (I believe they had planned on the mall not completely dying, they did survive for 6 months after the opening of Southpoint, pretty much the only thing left in the mall by the time it left). It just seems odd to me. Did Dillards do so well at the 2 old locations they did not feel a desire to open at the new 5 anchor mall, or did they simply wait too long to sign onto the project?

I would have liked for Dillards to have been incorporated into the redeveloped South Square somehow, even if a completely new store was included alongside Target and Sams. I think I'll always wonder though, why didn't they abandon South Square immediately when Belk and JCPenney did....Same thing with University Mall, I wonder if both Belk and Dillards had left if it would have remained a mall or been reinvented somehow. I recall a period of uncertainty when the mall owners were searching for a new anchor. Maybe Dillards saved that mall.

Anyway if any1 has any insight to the above, or comments feel free to respond

Yeah i find that a bit ironic too... Dillard's did kinda replace their North Hills store with the Triangle Town Center store... but they have no presence at either Crabtree Valley, Southpoint or Northgate. (not northage lol)

This post has been edited by cantnot: 04 October 2005 - 10:20 PM

[StevenRocks]

NCMike1981 & cantnot:

I think what happend to Dillard's in Durham was that Southpoint didn't want them. When Urban Retail was drawing up the mall, they landed comittments from Hecht's and Sears early, and then scooped Nordstrom from Crabtree Valley. There were two anchor spots left and JCPenney and Hudson Belk signed on so that they wouldn't get killed at South Square after the new mall opened. There was no room at the table for Dillard's and they attempted to go it alone.

There wan't any place in a redevleoped South Square for Dillard's either. It remained profitable until the end of its life, but was never particurally successful after it converted to Dillard's from Ivey's. The building was in the way of Faison's plans, the demographics were shifing away form Dillard's favor and the store could not sustain itself through the denmolition and redevelopment period.

The University Mall Dillard's is a ridiculously small operation, but it's a strong selling store, especially after Hudson Belk moved out of Chapel Hill. They made a smart move keeping that store.

At North Hills, Dillard's fully intended to buld a new store, but the redevelopment plans kept changing and getting delayed. When the Jacobs Group came calling for Triangle Town center, Dillard's was more than willing to move there.

I hope that the Lord & Taylor at Crabtree Valley gets replaced by at least Dillard's. There needs to be a midtown Dillard's store still and that would be a great spot, barring somthing more upscale doesn't take it first.

On the Dillard's at Eastland, keep your fingers crossed. I have a feeling that Big D will bolt: maybe not this Christmas, but definately when Mint Hill opens.

[DigitalSky]

I think, unfortunately, when Bridges opens we'll see Belk, Dillards and Harris Teeter gone from Eastland. I hope i'm very wrong

[csedwards72]

cantnot, on Oct 5 2005, 12:21 AM, said:

I think, unfortunately, when Bridges opens we'll see Belk, Dillards and Harris Teeter gone from Eastland. I hope i'm very wrong

I drove by Eastland yesterday and there were plenty of cars in the parking lot- at least around the Dillard's. That mall still seems to do a decent business. Anyone have any numbers for its performance after Northlake's opening?

[StevenRocks]

No word yet on Dillard's Eastland. In theory, the store should be doing okay because Northlake was technically a new market, but it's hard to say how and if the business will transfer in the future.

This post has been edited by StevenRocks: 24 October 2005 - 01:43 PM

[Version70-8]

csedwards72, on Oct 24 2005, 09:12 AM, said:

I drove by Eastland yesterday and there were plenty of cars in the parking lot- at least around the Dillard's. That mall still seems to do a decent business. Anyone have any numbers for its performance after Northlake's opening?

As StevenRocks stated, Northlake may pull a bit of the business away from Eastland, but the two markets and customer base are entirely different. The last that I had heard, Eastland's business has stayed the same. I used to work for Limited Brands over there and although it was a small volume mall, I was surprised at the volume my store managed to reach. Corporate office always said that Limited, Express, Bath & Body Works, and Victoria's Secret were all planning to leave the mall once their leases expired in 2007. (Ironic timing if Mint Hill does indeed come to fruition by then huh?) American Eagle is buying their time as well.

Now that the mall has once again been sold, now to an investment group, IMO the best thing for the area would be to raze the mall and invest into a small lifestyle center (ie. Arboretum) with a mix of big box but also quality apparel chains. For Heaven's sake let's avoid just another strip mall with Dollar Tree and Cash America!

[DigitalSky]

Version70-8, on Oct 24 2005, 04:59 PM, said:

For Heaven's sake let's avoid just another strip mall with Dollar Tree and Cash America!

Amen.

I don't think that they'd do something like Carolina Circle Mall though since Wal-Mart's planned a supercenter not too far away on Independence.

What kind of stores would we see in this lifestyle center? Other stores like BCF i.e. TJ Maxx, Marshalls, Ross etc... ?

[StevenRocks]

A revitalized Eastland as a lifestyle center is a good possibility. I wonder though what would be the right fit retail-wise.

I'm pretty sure Burlington Coat would stay, and attracting another off-pricer wouldn't be too much trouble. A couple sit-down restaurants are realisitc, as well as retaining Ashley Stewart, GNC and Foot Locker.

The question becomes, as cantnot stated, what will fill in the gaps? The mall's market is not beyond reapair and there's untapped money in that decidely underserved neighborhood, but I'm stumped about who'd be interested.

This post has been edited by StevenRocks: 24 October 2005 - 06:41 PM

[DigitalSky]

Do you think Sears would stay?

[Version70-8]

I think that Sears would stay especially with the Southpark store now gone. Also, I think that Old Navy, Bath & Body Works (successful it seems at all locations), Kohls, Hallmark, Radio Shack, and World Market are among a few who could make it there if recruited. The best chance for success though would come with a really well-planned and designed center. If the city starts to build quality centers in even the most diverse, poor, or older areas of town, then other businesses will also. Eastland is a unique area of the city, but that doesn't mean that the residents don't deserve or cannot maintain a quality option for shopping like the rest.

[csedwards72]

I agree with the Eastland area's prospects but why tear the mall down? Apart from that pitiful sun logo above the entrances and the '70s-looking Sears sign on top, the mall doesn't need much updating; the interior seems decent, although it is starting to look tired. There is one mall on North Tryon- Northpark Mall- that appears to be vintage '70s but still seems to do OK, with some lower-priced stores filling most of its spaces. I see Eastland becoming a larger version of that mall: not particularly nice, but doing a decent amount of business.

[StevenRocks]

cantnot, on Oct 24 2005, 09:24 PM, said:

Do you think Sears would stay?

If there's still a Sears chain in five years, I think it will.

[lupitachica]

As a newly transplanted NYer, I visited Eastland Mall expecting to see women being raped in graffiti covered dark hallways based on some of the commentary I've heard & read. What I found was a shopping center typical stores mixed in with retail shops that cater to a more hip hop community (for lack of a better term). The kids in the mall looked like your typical baggy clothes wearing types. There was nothing scary about them. Did I miss something? Was there some past crime wave that I missed? Or is it that the "look" of the people using the mall strike a fear some? I didn't get it. The mall looks depressed and I blame the businesses who don't seem to have put a lot of effort into making the stores more appealing. As a new shopper, I wasn't turned off by my fellow consumers, I was turned off by the clear disregard for the us all.

I never for one moment felt unsafe. What's the deal with that assessment of the Mall?

[DigitalSky]

lupitachica, on Oct 25 2005, 04:25 PM, said:

What's the deal with that assessment of the Mall?

I guess it's all relative.

[lupitachica]

I'm trying to figure out the basis for the "dangerous" label being given to Eastland. I'm thinking I'm uninformed about recent goings on in the Mall that have left the general population feeling unsafe. Was there a slew of robberies of shoppers or something like that prior to my arrival?

Now I've shopped at Southpark as well and clearly Southpark is a higher end mall and better kept mall. There is no Tiffany store (to say the least) in Eastland so I had to go to Southpark to get my jewelry cleaned. But in terms of stores like Express, the Limited, Victoria Secrets, Footlocker - mall staples - they are there in Eastland. If I'm shopping for Donna Karen, I probably wouldn't go to Eastland but if I'm looking for a pair of Nikes and a bra, I really don't see why I wouldn't go to Eastland. I did see that the Belks had terrible clothing and I blame the store's buyer and the directive he/she was given for that. Many of the people who shop at Eastland, I suspect, go elsewhere when they want a wider variety of choices.

The buying power of the African American consumer is phenomenal and I'd love to know how much money the stores in Eastland make in comparison to their counterparts taking into consideration size, consumer traffic, etc. The mall seems busy yet clearly not well taken care of. Why?

[authenticbeing]

lupitachica, on Oct 25 2005, 04:05 PM, said:

I'm trying to figure out the basis for the "dangerous" label being given to Eastland. I'm thinking I'm uninformed about recent goings on in the Mall that have left the general population feeling unsafe. Was there a slew of robberies of shoppers or something like that prior to my arrival?

Now I've shopped at Southpark as well and clearly Southpark is a higher end mall and better kept mall. There is no Tiffany store (to say the least) in Eastland so I had to go to Southpark to get my jewelry cleaned. But in terms of stores like Express, the Limited, Victoria Secrets, Footlocker - mall staples - they are there in Eastland. If I'm shopping for Donna Karen, I probably wouldn't go to Eastland but if I'm looking for a pair of Nikes and a bra, I really don't see why I wouldn't go to Eastland. I did see that the Belks had terrible clothing and I blame the store's buyer and the directive he/she was given for that. Many of the people who shop at Eastland, I suspect, go elsewhere when they want a wider variety of choices.

The buying power of the African American consumer is phenomenal and I'd love to know how much money the stores in Eastland make in comparison to their counterparts taking into consideration size, consumer traffic, etc. The mall seems busy yet clearly not well taken care of. Why?

I'm a New York Transplant as well (though I've been in NC for 10 years now, 6 in Charlotte) and I do not know why Eastland gets such a bad rap either. I've shopped there many times, have even gone there by myself and I'm a female, and I have never had a problem. There was a fight that broke out with some teenagers some months back, but Eastland had its rep before that so I'm sure all that did was inflame it, but was not the cause of it. Perhaps I will get flamed for it, but I really think that it is a racial issue. Coming from the North you may not have noticed it yet, but you will, there is more of a racial divide down here still. It's not overt, but subtle. And it's not a strictly black/white issue either. Alot of the international community resides on the east side, which is what makes it so unique and flavorful, but that is what I think many don't like about it. Hopefully it's just growing pains and Charlotte will get over it and embrace the international community and give more love to the east side.

[csedwards72]

I moved from Spanish Harlem in Manhattan to Charlotte, so I'm a NY transplant as well, in a way. Do an archive search on charlotte.com or charlotte.bizjournals.com and some interesting stories come up, showing why Eastland gets such a bad rap.

[appatone]

I don't think it is so much racial as it is socio-economic. We want that area to be a booming international district. Central's multi-cultural appeal is what we want to keep and build on.

[Version70-8]

appatone, on Oct 25 2005, 05:54 PM, said:

I don't think it is so much racial as it is socio-economic. We want that area to be a booming international district. Central's multi-cultural appeal is what we want to keep and build on.

I worked at Eastland for a few months and then worked at Southpark, and yes, it has a scarier reputation than it should BUT...

1) A person was shot and killed on the ice-skating rink many years ago!
2) A group of men literally taped an "Out of Order" sign on an ATM one day, unplugged it and started moving it out of the mall on a handtruck!
3) The UPS delivery guy (if not UPS, then Fedex) was shot in the leg by a passing car on Black Friday a few years ago...in the middle of the day with the holiday shoppers in mass quantities all over!
4) I saw a fight break out between 2 guys once that grew to include over 10 people, men and women, fighting while over 30 others watched and encouraged. All stores nearby had to pull their gates and stay in lockdown when someone shouted, "GUN!", until over 10 police officers ended the hoopla.
5) Remember "Lean On Me"? Yup, that is how some mall security officers look, with blazers, nightsticks, and radio. Not to mention the city operates a Field Office between Belk and The Limited.
6) A lady waiting for the bus was kidnapped and raped a few years back.

and that is just a few.

It isn't really a racial issue, albeit it is for some ignorant people, but like has been mentioned, is more of a socioeconomic one. Even the citizens in the area, for the most part, be it black, Asian, Hispanic, or whatever, all go elsewhere. Most people in that area are also supportive of converting the mall to an outdoor center or community center. I love the area's diversity and unique stores and cultural awareness choices, it just needs a larger sense of support from the city, which I believe has arrived recently?