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Va. Beach misses the mark


urbanvb

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Why fight it? I say have the planning board disapprove. If they have a FAR requirement in their plan for the area use that as a means of disapproving the redevelopment of Pizza Hut into the small Dollar Tree store. If the Dollar Tree and Vitamin Shop try to take it to court give up and let them in. Several years from now when developers become interested in a higher and better land use, use the FAR requirement and any of the other 6 redevelopment criteria as justification to condemn and redevelop the parcels.

All of this is contingent on a favorable New London decision from SCOTUS, though.

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Whatever you tell them, make sure you tell them that this isn't the way to preserve "historic" buildings in an attempt to give Town Center "character"

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dude that is hilarious. Make more comments like that i need a good laugh every now and then.

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Definitally a wtf?! moment.

give it time. While it is a stupid idea, especially a no name dollar store. That will change as the area grows.

Just dont expect downtown VaBeach to build a giant downtown over night. many developers are still ify about it until it produces real results. (ie the cosmo openning).

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While I'm against having a vitamin shop and dollar store next door to the Cheesecake Factory, I don't know how convincing we can be. I honestly am afraid that Va. Beach council may respond by saying "while we promote Town Center to be a living, trendy lifestyle with high-end offices, retail, restaurants, and entertainment, we also would like to attract any and all people to visit Town Center to show there is something for everyone." Unfortunately, anyone in a business or retail world would say that in defense to doing stupid decisions that don't make sense to their projects.

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While I'm against having a vitamin shop and dollar store next door to the Cheesecake Factory, I don't know how convincing we can be. I honestly am afraid that Va. Beach council may respond by saying "while we promote Town Center to be a living, trendy lifestyle with high-end offices, retail, restaurants, and entertainment, we also would like to attract any and all people to visit Town Center to show there is something for everyone." Unfortunately, anyone in a business or retail world would say that in defense to doing stupid decisions that don't make sense to their projects.

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Personally, the vitamin shop is not that bad.. what IS bad is putting a Dollar General store beside the Kmart store. It adds nothing to the upscale image they are trying to portray for the Town Center. But, I really feel if a Super Target is coming (which I feel will be included in the new and upcoming Town Square), Kmart's days are numbered. It can't last but for so long until an investor decides that the whole Kmart property is better suited for something nicer.

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I have no idea where I heard it, but when Town Center was first proposed, names like Abercrombie, Pottery Barn, and other "MacArthur-esque" names were thrown around a lot in reference to the redevelopment that would be spurred about Town Center. I think a Dollar Tree or General or whatever falls just a little short of that. Maybe after a few years the stores that will occupy those spaces will no longer be able to afford it and will be replaced by more... fitting ones. I do believe that stores and restaurants geared towards the middle and lower income family should be present, but not gaudily cheap stores. :angry:

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I have no idea where I heard it, but when Town Center was first proposed, names like Abercrombie, Pottery Barn, and other "MacArthur-esque" names were thrown around a lot in reference to the redevelopment that would be spurred about Town Center.  I think a Dollar Tree or General or whatever falls just a little short of that.  Maybe after a few years the stores that will occupy those spaces will no longer be able to afford it and will be replaced by more... fitting ones.  I do believe that stores and restaurants geared towards the middle and lower income family should be present, but not gaudily cheap stores. :angry:

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Yeah, lol. I actually lost sleep over this one :rofl: . Good ole Va. Beach, two steps forward and twelve steps back. <_<

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and i know it was posted already, but did anyone look into a new law that set specific requirements for what could be built in the town center area?  Anything that could justify not have the dollar store?

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I have looked at it. Only things in the B-3A Pembroke Central Business district, and B-4C Mixed use district have requirements that may limit such development. B-3A basically is Towncenter, B-4C was designed specifically for projects like cityview, cornerstone, and the proposed towncenter like development at HQ. Unfortunately, the dollar general falls into none of these zone. I believe it is zoned B-3, which coincidentally has no height limit, but also has no regs on what exactly can be put there business wise. (It may even be B-2, I'll have to check and get back with you.)

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Well I have good news and bad news. Good news first, I found this link http://www.vbgov.com/dept/planning/vgn_files/policy_ch2.pdf

To the city's master plan (created in 2003 and updated 12/20/04) with never before seen renderings of what the city plans to do with pembroke and the surrounding areas. (pay particular attention to pages 14 and 15, i think you'll like what you read :D ).

Now for the bad news

I found this excerpt in the city zoning code:

Within the B-3A Pembroke Central Business Core District, the minimum buildingheight shall be thirty-five (35) feet and the maximum buildingheight shall be four hundred (400) feet. In the B-4C Central Business Mixed Use District, minimum building height shall be thirty-five (35) feet and the maximum buildingheight shall be two hundred (200) feet.

(e)    Notwithstanding the above, no building or other structure shall exceed the heightlimit established by section 202(B) regarding air navigation

^^^^This is the zoning sector that the Westin is in and therefore the Westin is not likely to exceed 400 ft (it will probably be exactly 400) without out a council approved variance (i.e. won't beat the James Monroe tower).

Now for more good news:

This is a council impossed height limit that has nothing to do with military or FAA flight paths (there are no restrictions due to either of those entities in that area). This limit exist solely to ensure that the surrounding area is not overwhelmed by some gargantuan tower before the area has a chance to fill in.

The area to the west and north is zoned B3 Central Business District and has no height limit. To the west of Towncenter is where a mirror development has been proposed for the HQ property. To the North is the pembroke parking lot. An office tower is supposedly being developed for the property where suntrust bank sits. Their lease runs out at the end of this year and once that tower is built it will be connected across Virginia Beach Blvd to the rest of Towncenter via a pedestrian bridge.

The B4C district is where cityview is going and as you can see above there is a 200ft height limit. In this case i agree with this limit because you want to step the skyline up towards downtown. Once there is more infill, all of these limits are likely to be relaxed seeing as they are self -imposed.  Keep in mind that Downtown Norfolk has no height limit period so the Westin is not likely to hold the title for very long.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

^^^^I know this is a repost but i thought it would be helpful to the discussion in here.

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it is a no win situation with this one then. Unfortunately, the dollar store owner lives in the area as well. My friend here at UVa says that his parents know the guy so he is definitely a beach resident. I imagine he has a lot of power with all this stuff since he is at minimum a multimillionaire.

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