Raleigh's Fayetteville Street

[ChiefJoJo]

I watched the very end before the vote, so I'm sure I missed 90% of the discussion...

They clearly did not have the votes to fund all $21.3M, so they approved a reduction of the original budget of $21M to $16M. They directed the manager to recommend what plaza/street/ped elements should be implemented as a priority for the project to be built this fall, and the remainder would be funded either by private gifts (Isley mentioned Goodman's name), a potential funding tie-in with the site 2/3 sale, or potentially looking at next year's budget... either way, it's basically what I thought would happen: the budget was reduced by $5.3M and the remainder must come from other sources or a future council.

Apparently City Plaza will be built in it's entirety after all, although the $16M bond amount will remain as council directed. With a bit of value engineering, some additional private contributions and other capital project funds, sufficient money has been found to fund the plaza almost completely. With final council approval, construction could be underway by late summer (Sept timeframe).

[DanRNC]

^Thats great news as this plaza is truly the linchpin of F-Street.

[Jones_]

The buildings along the street are slowly cleaning up....the building next to the future Mahler Gallery, where York is marketing RBC condos, is just about finished being painted and it looks really good. The building is known as the Lumsden-Boone building and was built in 1896. It has a great looking tin facade...I have seen tons of buildings like this in places like New Orleans but Raleigh has only this one. The 200 block west side is becoming a nice looking historic row...an important compliment to buildings like RBC Plaza....

[ChiefJoJo]

^ and it's great to see the new facades.

another older building on F St is ready for a makeover, The old Holly's Hallmark at 213 Fayetteville St looks to become a bar/restaurant:

1 Provide completed application, drink menu, & equipment specifications..

2 Specify bar lighting, bar details, provide equipment plan and finish schedule..

3 Calculate bar hot water recovery requirements and specify accordingly..

4 Specify bar water supply and waste plumbing connections..

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

Apparently City Plaza will be built in it's entirety after all, although the $16M bond amount will remain as council directed. With a bit of value engineering, some additional private contributions and other capital project funds, sufficient money has been found to fund the plaza almost completely. With final council approval, construction could be underway by late summer (Sept timeframe).

Anyone have any idea of when the city council will give there "final" appoval for this Plaza area? I wonder if given the time frame remaining for the opening of F. St. part 2 if it can still happen in time for autumn of next year?

[JeffC]

From today's N&O:

RALEIGH - The City Council on Tuesday voted to issue up to $30 million in certificates of participation for three city projects:

* $8 million for a new solid waste transfer station.

* $6.3 million to extend Fayetteville Street to Lenoir Street. * $14.7 million for the remaining cost of an underground parking garage under construction on the south end of downtown.

I take it this underground parking garage is the one under the extension of Fayetteville Street?

[ChiefJoJo]

The design for the pavillions on City Plaza are being revealed today:

1. City Plaza Pavilion Design Review

During the City Plaza approval process, City Council requested the opportunity to review the design of the plaza retail pavilions. As a less than 10,000 sq. ft addition to an existing building, the pavilions fall under the administrative approval authority. The pavilions will be privately funded, constructed and leased. A presentation of the design will be made by the pavilions

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

The design for the pavillions on City Plaza are being revealed today:

1. City Plaza Pavilion Design Review

During the City Plaza approval process, City Council requested the opportunity to review the design of the plaza retail pavilions. As a less than 10,000 sq. ft addition to an existing building, the pavilions fall under the administrative approval authority. The pavilions will be privately funded, constructed and leased. A presentation of the design will be made by the pavilions

[Redman84]

They had a story on WRAL about this a few minutes ago, but the pictures they showed of the project were hard to really get an idea what was going where because they weren't up for very long. Did say that there are national retailers that are interested in occupying these "pavilions" already.

[ChiefJoJo]

Here is the WRAL story on the pavilions.

As the story notes, the vote on final funding package for the City Plaza takes place next month on Sept 5. We need to get some folks out there to show our support for the plaza to the council. As the time moves closer, send me a PM if you want to come, and show your support. This plaza will be the centerpiece of our downtown, and frankly it will be the image that we project to the world, so it's crucial we get this right. I think this is the perfect issue for us to translate discussions and ideas to the public realm.

[serapis]

This will be another large stepping stone for DT Raleigh, if it doesn't get skimmed down. The video renderings were rather vague. Does anyone know where we can get a better look?

[DanRNC]

^I don't feel too comfortable that this will not be skimmed down based on the idiotic questions/comments from the council yesterday. Crowder claimed these pavillions took too much space away from the plaza during events like the once-a-year-parade and Raleigh Wide Open although the square footage adds up to less than 4000sq. ft. Why have retail all the other days of the year when you can have some extra space for 2 days out of the year? Also, this may collapse (because its a bridge) based on another comment because of recent events in Minnesota so we should probably scrap this-what a joke. The water feature honestly looks pathetic. The lighting scheme looks pretty good but will probably be nixed because its not tradtional enough, may disrupt air traffic patterns, and block the tumbleweeds from blowing from the capital to Memorial Hall-just a premonition of things to come.

[RALNATIVE]

^I don't feel too comfortable that this will not be skimmed down based on the idiotic questions/comments from the council yesterday. Crowder claimed these pavillions took too much space away from the plaza during events like the once-a-year-parade and Raleigh Wide Open although the square footage adds up to less than 4000sq. ft. Why have retail all the other days of the year when you can have some extra space for 2 days out of the year? Also, this may collapse (because its a bridge) based on another comment because of recent events in Minnesota so we should probably scrap this-what a joke. The water feature honestly looks pathetic. The lighting scheme looks pretty good but will probably be nixed because its not tradtional enough, may disrupt air traffic patterns, and block the tumbleweeds from blowing from the capital to Memorial Hall-just a premonition of things to come.

it does seem like the city council is better at coming up with "what if" scenarios than coming up with ways to mitigate risks. afterall, what were they elected for?

[DanRNC]

The sad part is that their "what if" scenarios are outright idiotic meanderings with about a 1/10 second amount of thought. They are the ones who wanted traffic flow down the plaza. Hey, if you want to avert infrastructure collapse maybe you shouldn't let people build 42-story skyscrapers in flood plains.

[RALNATIVE]

The sad part is that their "what if" scenarios are outright idiotic meanderings with about a 1/10 second amount of thought. They are the ones who wanted traffic flow down the plaza. Hey, if you want to avert infrastructure collapse maybe you shouldn't let people build 42-story skyscrapers in flood plains.

Raleigh badly needs more retail in the CBD and I think that these pavillions offer just what the doctor order. Based on the descriptions that i've heard so far, they will be innovative and tastefully done. They will definitely help to draw more people to the CBD.

Unfortunately, our leaders don't seem to realize this because they are so heavily focused on other things (i.e. space restrictions) that should be secondary to meeting Raleigh's needs for having more retail downtown. What good is it to bring more office space and residential downtown when there is limited retail available day and night? I think that the city council should be more proactive at finding solutions to potential problems instead of trying to shoot everything down.

[sax184]

Here is the WRAL story on the pavilions.

As the story notes, the vote on final funding package for the City Plaza takes place next month on Sept 5. We need to get some folks out there to show our support for the plaza to the council. As the time moves closer, send me a PM if you want to come, and show your support. This plaza will be the centerpiece of our downtown, and frankly it will be the image that we project to the world, so it's crucial we get this right. I think this is the perfect issue for us to translate discussions and ideas to the public realm.

Another set of incredible comments from the astute WRAL-TV-watching public. Wow.

Many good comments from the posters here. It seems like the Council has a collective short memory span about the tradeoffs they made when they said they wanted to allow traffic through the plaza rather than a carless space.

[raleightransplant]

Hmm. I too read the comments on WRAL. Unreal. I love this forum (UP) because you get good insight from people who get it and really want to see great things happen here. Then I read WRAL and I wonder if we'll ever get anywhere. I fear that 'RAL might be the prevailing sentiment of people who live in this town...depressing actually. Do these people see ANYTHING that ever excites them, even if it's "dreaming"? I would hate to go through life whining about every possible thing and doubting myself along the way. But that seems to be how many go about living...why even get out of bed? We DO need to get some people out there to support this thing.

[plus2]

So far the companies interested in these pavilions are food and drink merchants. That's not what downtown is dying for. We have restaurants and coffee shops on Fayetteville St. We need more retail locations.

Let me add that if a pavilion were replaced with a restaurant with LOTS of outdoor seating I would be all for that!

[serapis]

We ought to Bum Rush those idiots on wral.com and plant grenades of rationale in their regressive, flat earth minds (thanks vitaviatic )!

This day in age, the "Idiocracy Movement" is on the rise around the globe!!!

If you have just an ounce of logic/rational sanity, you will see it as well.

[DanRNC]

I like the comments (WRAL) saying that drug dealing and other crimes are relegated to downtown. If I remember correctly the statistics show that downtown actually has one of the lowest crime rates in Raleigh. The best are posts explaining why we don't need retail downtown as we have the mall. I guess life does revolve around the mall.

[Gard]

I would like to see a developer do a similar project in downtown to what I saw in London, UK. They had what look like a series of ordinary buildings that fit into the downtown, but when you walked into one of them, you discovered that these weren't all separate buildings afterall, but rather one large building that is a mall. If I hadn't gone in there, I would have never known it was a mall.

[serapis]

I like the comments (WRAL) saying that drug dealing and other crimes are relegated to downtown. If I remember correctly the statistics show that downtown actually has one of the lowest crime rates in Raleigh. The best are posts explaining why we don't need retail downtown as we have the mall. I guess life does revolve around the mall.

I bet most of those D students have never set foot DT. I go jogging DT alot, there isn't a spec of crime in sight. Idiots!!!!!!!!

[RALNATIVE]

So far the companies interested in these pavilions are food and drink merchants. That's not what downtown is dying for. We have restaurants and coffee shops on Fayetteville St. We need more retail locations.

Let me add that if a pavilion were replaced with a restaurant with LOTS of outdoor seating I would be all for that!

What downtown needs are more places to go grab a quick bite to eat or an ice cream during the day, or maybe a small convenient store, so that downtown workers can actually walk somewhere closeby on their breaks to get a snack or a magazine or some Tylenol. Being a downtown resident myself, I won't even get started on what downtown needs during evening hours. We have made alot of progress, no doubt, but the bottomline is, if we are to continue to grow beyond where we are now, we've got to start adding the essential infrastructure. We will never be a trully urban city without the basics in place.

[Redman84]

Problem is that the majority of people who make negative comments towards downtown are people who never visit downtown. These are the people who live on the outskirts and may have come downtown at one time, maybe years ago and saw run down looking establishments along Salisbury St. and Wilmington St. and never would have attempted to get out of their cars and walk down Fayetteville St. Mall. They came once, felt unsafe, and are yet to return. These are the people who don't realize that Fayetteville St. is actually a Street again, that is busy with activity day and night. These are the people that think that WTVD's only studio is in Durham. These are the people that are unaware that RBC Centura is in the process of building a massive building downtown that will include high rise condos. And I would gather to imagine that most of the people that make comments like these are transplanted here for one reason or another, and aren't people like myself and many of us others who have grown up here and want to see our beloved city succeed and have a successful downtown.

[serapis]

Problem is that the majority of people who make negative comments towards downtown are people who never visit downtown. These are the people who live on the outskirts and may have come downtown at one time, maybe years ago and saw run down looking establishments along Salisbury St. and Wilmington St. and never would have attempted to get out of their cars and walk down Fayetteville St. Mall. They came once, felt unsafe, and are yet to return. These are the people who don't realize that Fayetteville St. is actually a Street again, that is busy with activity day and night. These are the people that think that WTVD's only studio is in Durham. These are the people that are unaware that RBC Centura is in the process of building a massive building downtown that will include high rise condos. And I would gather to imagine that most of the people that make comments like these are transplanted here for one reason or another, and aren't people like myself and many of us others who have grown up here and want to see our beloved city succeed and have a successful downtown.

Well said!