Raleigh's Fayetteville Street

[wfdude]

Hey everyone, I was down on Fayetteville Street today for lunch and I took a bunch of pictures... not great, but I thought I would share. Enjoy! I'll use a couple of posts to post the pictures.

[carynative]

That building is at the northernmost point on the mall of state buildings north of the capitol and legislative buildings. I don't know what state agency it houses, though.

I know for sure that it houses the Department of Environment and Natural Resources and the Department of Crime Control and Public Safety, not sure what else though. It's name is the Archdale Building.

[urbanesq]

^^^ The Archdale Building also houses several other smaller state offices. I think it's probably the ugliest building in Raleigh. My wife worked there several years ago, and said it was the most oppressive physical work environment she'd ever been in. NOT a happy structure.

[JTsaysToYou]

For all its ugliness, the archedale has an ineresting shape, just throwing that out there. They need more glassand windows, but it has an interesting shape.

I went in there one time and it is VERY oppressive environment

[Jones_]

I have to go the Archdale from time to time, and its really not all too different than any other office building except that years and years of no maintenance money is evident...everything has a white institutional feel to it, except the offices where the important people work...Secretary Bill Ross (DENT) e.g. has quite the plush suite with a view towards Fayetteville St from teh 14th floor.

[CSP]

Anyone know of the exact height of the Archdale building? I've never been able to find it. Or the height of the Clarion hotel.

Archdale Building - 47.2 m

Clarion Hotel - 62.5 m

[Eastwestrob]

Nice pictures and thank you wfdude

[DanRNC]

Looks as if F-Street got a another nice tenant to keep the arts theme going.

Story

[Jones_]

Looks as if F-Street got a another nice tenant to keep the arts theme going.

Story

Nice....need lots more of this stuff, cultural this and that of all types....

[Eastwestrob]

Looks as if F-Street got a another nice tenant to keep the arts theme going.

Story

A great deal for DT Raleigh and a big hats off to Bobby Lewis

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

If I am not mistaken,(which is very possible), this is the building that Bobby Lewis just bought and is trying to turn into,(with the help of a Miami developer), an extension of the Radisson hotel and add 30 stories to the atrium? If I rememer correctly.

[carynative]

Do you mean the Sheraton?

[Jones_]

No, I think DwnTwnRaleighGuy means the next building north of there...four stories with that new medieval looking facade on a much older brick shell....its between the Sir Walter and the Sheraton.

Interesting, I just noticed in looking up this picture that the atrium between Two Hannover and the Sheraton is deeded separate from either of those buildings with its own unique owner.

[urbanesq]

If I am not mistaken,(which is very possible), this is the building that Bobby Lewis just bought and is trying to turn into,(with the help of a Miami developer), an extension of the Radisson hotel and add 30 stories to the atrium? If I rememer correctly.

What?!? Is there a separate UP thread on that? I don't remember hearing about that project.

Enlighten me, please...

No, I think DwnTwnRaleighGuy means the next building north of there...four stories with that new medieval looking facade on a much older brick shell....its between the Sir Walter and the Sheraton.

Interesting, I just noticed in looking up this picture that the atrium between Two Hannover and the Sheraton is deeded separate from either of those buildings with its own unique owner.

I thought Barbara Mulkey owned that building?

And, wow. I work in Two Hannover and never knew the atrium was a separate parcel. Wild.

[ncwebguy]

Here is the UP thread about the building north of the Sheraton's atrium.

The N&O story mentions Bobby Lewis, a Raleigh Development principal, as owner of the four story building the Opera office/store. It might be like the NC Symphony's store in North Hills, yet be a lot closer to the theater complex.

This quote from the N&O story:

You just don't let small buildings sit on expensive dirt for long.

could mean the opera store is only a temporary location to be moved elsewhere when the market can support a bigger building on the expensive dirt.

[DanRNC]

Here is a link on Phase II of F-Street.

Livable Streets

Its good to see they are consulting with PPS to come up with a very unique and workable plaza. I guess I may have to eat craw as an ardent supporter of the Plensa project if this plaza is successful.

[krazeeboi]

PPS appears to be a great, reputable organization to consult with concerning these types of things. I think Greensboro's leaders consulted with them in planning and designing the city's new downtown park, which looks to be very nicely done.

[ericurbanite]

phase 2 looks like it could signify Raleigh. I really cant wait for this, the convention center, hotel, condos to be done. Fayetteville St will be the new glenwood.

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

I guess I may have to eat craw as an ardent supporter of the Plensa project if this plaza is successful.

I think you mean "eat crow"?

Trust me, I speak from personal experience, it's not as good as chicken, but not to bad either. It shows our humility, which doesn't come out often enough I think.

[ncwebguy]

I like the F Street phase 2 design a lot. Neat touches/features include:

- the created by the "pick up and drop off" entrance to the Marriott will be on F Street, instead of Salisbury.

- the entrance circle does not *connect* to F Street, so pedestrians can continue south from Davie to South Street without mixing with vehicle traffic.

- The plaza is still bisected by traffic, but it is "contained" to the north-south axis and not "boxed out" to the square's edges, as in the Plensa design.

- for events, F Street traffic can be cut off at Davie street, or "circled" like it is now in front of the Sheraton. It would be ideal for the "posts" to be removable for concerts like Alive after five, but may not be for increased pedestrian safety.

- it adds street connectivity to One and Two Hannover, buildings that have little connection to the "street" as they are now. Two Hannover's second floor balconies are part existing conference rooms, so I don't know the level of activity they would generate. But with the new CC, confernce space in the Sheraton/Two Hannover might be less in demand, so it could be redeveloped as a raised patio restaurant/bar above one of the "pavilions."

The "height differnence" from One/Two Hannover's entrances to the street appear to be handled well, though it still feels like the "plaza" is dead space. There needs to be some artistic element -- bring Plensa back with those drawings as his "canvas". Or bring the Sir Walter statue back (Where is he???)

*No* reflecting ponds (or other *poorly maintained* water features), please! Maybe a more southern-like *checkers* game on the often imitated oversized chess board. Though chess does reflect the educated, worldly population of the area. Smaller, granite "bench boards" could line up, like the ones that used to be near the Sir Walter Hotel entrance. This could give the area a Washington Square Park vibe to South F Street.

[plus2]

Smaller, granite "bench boards" could line up, like the ones that used to be near the Sir Walter Hotel entrance.

I would really like to see some of those downtown! But more shade is a must! Some large shade trees would be helpful to attract people to come and stay at the plaza, not just pass through.

[dmccall]

I don't think we can ever expect trees here as the plaza is on top of a parking deck.

I agree that PPS will bring some good ideas to the table. I saw Fred Kent speak last month in Durham and they have some interesting ideas. The key concepts they tend to bring to every project are: simplicity, loose chairs so people can dictate their own seating arrangements, line your buildings with retail, put coffee and free stuff to do there. He showed plenty of examples of dead spaces and how off-putting things like complex modern art and water features deter people.

Go to the pps website and look at their logo. Obviously they are respected by the Downtown Alliance people.

I like these preliminary renderings. I would add a canopy element like strings of Christmas lights over the plaza areas flanking Fayetteville Street (but not crossing F St).

My only problem with all of this is that if a single plaza concept is implemented (As opposed to a pair of complementary plazas flanking a street) then when is it ever going to be used as a single plaza? The barricades cannot pinch the street more than its width in front of the Sheraton because parades would be slowed. The street cannot be closed on the south end of the plaza because the Marriott porte cochere can never be blocked.

To me, the better plan is to put in two very simple, complementary plazas flanking the street. Then go for Sites 2 and 3 for a central event plaza. That site is the doorstep to the arts complex, so events can invite people to Memorial auditorium or ME events can spill into the plaza.

[ncwebguy]

I think the Marriott entrance comes off Salisbury between the hotel and Two Hannover (an extended West Cabarrus Street, south of the Two Hannover underground parking deck entrace), not F Street. There could be a F Street connection to the entrance, but it does not *need* one.

The east side of F street at the "Cabarrus" intersection looks to be an entrance to the underground parking deck, flanked with steps to a "side plaza" between One Hannover and Site One.

Trees might not be possible, but large bushes are on the existing parking deck. They are in the raised planters between the existing plaza and One and Two Hannover. I don't think oak trees could do well there, but some kind of tree might thrive in that environment. It will have to be something that can get by with little sunlight though.

F Street can be as wide as it is between PE I and Sheraton. It will leave enough space for a decent meeting space (with F Street closed) from One and Two Hannover through Raleigh Memorial Auditorium.

If that is not workable, extend One and Two Hannover to the sidewalk line created by F Street north of there.

Sites 2 and 3 have not been set in stone yet...

[dmccall]

Here's the schematic of the Marriott followed by the view of the NE corner of the building as seen from F-St.

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

Here's the schematic of the Marriott followed by the view of the NE corner of the building as seen from F-St.

Thank you very much for finding/sharing these picture, they are very helpful to someone like me who has a hard time imagining this part of the two projects. But these pictures show it very clearly. Again, my thanks!