Columbia Off-Topic

[krazeeboi]

I don't think anything you said was ban-worthy banter, and I largely agree. Nothing wrong with having a booster organization for your city (every city should have one, actually), but try to be a bit more professional when presenting a study; as is, it reeks of bias. I can definitely see some of the overwhelming negative adjectives coming from USC's archnemesis, as I'm sure many of them do not separate the school from the city. At any rate, I found it interesting that both Greenville and Columbia were found to be equally as "boring," LOL.

Here's something off-topic: the building behind (to the west) of Trustus has a big sold sign in front of it. What is that building and what has it been used for? Anyone know what's going in there?

[CorgiMatt]

I don't think anything you said was ban-worthy banter, and I largely agree. Nothing wrong with having a booster organization for your city (every city should have one, actually), but try to be a bit more professional when presenting a study; as is, it reeks of bias. I can definitely see some of the overwhelming negative adjectives coming from USC's archnemesis, as I'm sure many of them do not separate the school from the city. At any rate, I found it interesting that both Greenville and Columbia were found to be equally as "boring," LOL.

Here's something off-topic: the building behind (to the west) of Trustus has a big sold sign in front of it. What is that building and what has it been used for? Anyone know what's going in there?

It was most recently used as a warehouse for Whit-Ash Furniture. I haven't heard what the plans for it are. But Lady Street sure is looking good. It will be Columbia's next true urban downtown corridor.

[Spartan]

I'll probably get banned for saying this, but it's true: Greenville's boosterism is bogus, they try and spin everything in their direction and will try anything they can to make Columbia look bad. That survey was so ridicuously flawed they should be embarassed to even publish it. The vast majority of the respondents were Clemson students. Carolina and Clemson HATE each other and I don't use that term lightly. There is a tremendous amount of animosity between the 2 schools and especially their fans, so how could you expect anything else from a survey of mostly Clemson students. To them, Columbia = USC and vice versa. It was no accident that a riot almost started in 1902 or 1903 after a Carolina Clemson football game, lol.

You dont get banned for negative opinions. As long as you express them in the proper manner (e.g not an asshole) you are fine. This is a true a mostly statement, IMO. Greenville does that for many other cities too. They give the same treatment to Spartanburg, if not worse, since we are their nearest comptitor. I would not be surporised if Anderson gets it too.

This study was geared towards Greenville, and I think Clemson was in charge of running it, so naturally its going to be Upstate oriented. Its definitely not an unbiased report, but they do make it clear that many schools, including USC, did not participate. I also mentioned that a similar case in the Spartanburg forum... only 1 college in Spartanburg was polled. We have 6. USC Upstate and Wofford, arguably 2 the most significant schools, were not polled. Their inclusion would have likely changed the outcome for Saprtanburg as well (it would have likely boosted the city's stuation within this poll, IMO).

Clemson and Carolina do have a strong dislike of each other, but I think its a largely amicable dislike. And I say this is a proud graduate of the University of South Carolina, and a current student at Clemson University. I love telling people around here that I am a USC grad. Their reactions vary, but its always good fun. Some people DO take it to seriously at both schools, but I think the rivalry, while intense, is largely good fun for all. A have fellow students and co-workers that are affilitated with one school or the other, and its always an amicable exchange of words or various color-related insults (that respectable garnet vs that tacky orange for example).

[krazeeboi]

It was most recently used as a warehouse for Whit-Ash Furniture. I haven't heard what the plans for it are. But Lady Street sure is looking good. It will be Columbia's next true urban downtown corridor.

Thanks for that info Corgi and Matt. I think you're right about Lady. Here's how it's looking these days:

[krazeeboi]

Here's something off-topic: the building behind (to the west) of Trustus has a big sold sign in front of it. What is that building and what has it been used for? Anyone know what's going in there?

I found the answer to my own question digging through the archives:

[CorgiMatt]

I found the answer to my own question digging through the archives:

I rode by that building to get the high feeling I get when I see a sold sign on something. The sign is gone altogether now. I must have overlooked a reference to that building when clicking on archives. It's the building that forms an alley with Trustus, right?

[krazeeboi]

I do believe that it is. Sorry the link doesn't exactly take you to the post; you'll have to back up a page. So I wonder if the building that sits there now will be demolished or renovated?

[BrasilnSC]

Krazee, thanks for all the pics, here and on the other threads. It's good to see a visual update of all the progress happening in Columbia.

[shahram72]

I just took the family to Greenville to go to the Zoo and check it out this Saturday. It was a fun day trip. The zoo was small, but nice and free cause we have a Riverbanks pass(Atlanta only gave me 50% off). The BMW museum in Greer was closed and I was very disappointed about that. So we went downtown. WOW! I hope that is where we are headed. So many familes strolling the streets in downtown. The trees made it beautiful. And Reedy park, well it is the most beautiful park I have ever seen. We ate lunch at the restarant there, which really helped to make it a destination. Not like New Orleans Restaurant, which is just mediocre food at high prices. Not knocking Columbia, but they have really got it right over there. The news of SCANA is not good, but we have much development on the way. I hope that the development is conducive to bringing familes (and others) to hang out there, and not just residents. The residents only will not make it thrive like what I saw in Greenville. Downtown Greenville even rivaled what I have seen in Florida, and that's saying a lot.

Edited September 10, 2006 by shahram72

[krazeeboi]

Main Street in Greenville is definitely a gem that draws lots of people, that's for sure; I've seen it for myself several times. Columbia will probably never have one street that has that much activity on it because of the layout of its attractions vs. Greenville's. I think the closest may be Lady Street. Main Street in Columbia only has the potential for serious pedestrian activity like Greenville's from Hampton to Laurel. Also, Columbia's downtown activity is centered around districts (the Vista, Five Points) unlike Greenville's, which is more corridor-oriented and allows for a more concentrated urban experience. But still, Columbia can and should take a few notes from the neighbor to the northwest.

Krazee, thanks for all the pics, here and on the other threads. It's good to see a visual update of all the progress happening in Columbia.

No prob, I try to get them when I can.

[emerging.me]

I just took the family to Greenville to go to the Zoo and check it out this Saturday. It was a fun day trip. The zoo was small, but nice and free cause we have a Riverbanks pass(Atlanta only gave me 50% off). The BMW museum in Greer was closed and I was very disappointed about that. So we went downtown. WOW! I hope that is where we are headed. So many familes strolling the streets in downtown. The trees made it beautiful. And Reedy park, well it is the most beautiful park I have ever seen. We ate lunch at the restarant there, which really helped to make it a destination. Not like New Orleans Restaurant, which is just mediocre food at high prices. Not knocking Columbia, but they have really got it right over there. The news of SCANA is not good, but we have much development on the way. I hope that the development is conducive to bringing familes (and others) to hang out there, and not just residents. The residents only will not make it thrive like what I saw in Greenville. Downtown Greenville even rivaled what I have seen in Florida, and that's saying a lot.

I hear ya! My wife and I went to Greenville last weekend... I was blown away by Main Street! They have really done it with excellence -- all of the right finishing touches are there. My biggest problem with Columbia is, despite having many promising areas being redeveloped and innumerable projects on deck, none of them are genuinely being done with excellence.

Edited September 11, 2006 by emerging.me

[krazeeboi]

^Now I can say that about Main Street--streetscaping delays, not ensuring street level retail with the new First Citizens tower, lack of facade improvements, etc. But I don't think I can say that about Lady Street (or the Vista in general--a success story indeed) or even Five Points. The only holdup with those two projects is the streetscaping. Even if Columbia did everything with its Main Street that Greenville has done with its Main Street, Greenville would still come out ahead due to the layout. It has the Peace Center anchoring one end, Falls Park somewhere in the middle, and the Hyatt anchoring the other end (although activity is spreading beyond the two anchors); this makes it pretty easy for development to fill in between the nodes. Columbia has nothing comparable in this regard--Finlay Park and Koger are in the Vista and not on Main, and the Marriott doesn't serve as an anchor at all. This isn't to say that there isn't room for improvement as far as Columbia's redevelopment efforts are concerned, because God knows there is--we've reiterated that innumerable times here. A much better comparison would be Elm Street in Greensboro; it is laid out much like Main in Columbia, with the exception of the street terminating in front of a prominent civic structure. I couldn't believe the activity I saw on the street at night, and they have a good mix of clubs/restaurants/bars as well. And they have towers interspersed along Elm, unlike Main in Greenville where most of the activity is on the stretch away from the towers. Personally, I'm beginning to have high hopes for Lady, and Gervais is looking better every day. The only thing that works against it is that it's a high volume major thoroughfare, so pedestrian activity is limited. So there are glimmers of hope for Columbia, if it will keep doing the right things right and learn where others have done it right and it hasn't.

[krazeeboi]

Here's another area in which I think Columbia could learn from Greensboro (and it's been mentioned before).

[CorgiMatt]

In Saturday night's football game against Georgia on ESPN, the Gamecocks didn't do anything to help Columbia's image, but at halftime the cameral showed the Wade Hampton statue and the capitol dome, and one of the commentators said, "South Carolina has a beautiful capitol. South Carolina's a nice state; Charleston, Myrtle Beach; Columbia's a pretty city, nice campus."

[Spartan]

I hear ya! My wife and I went to Greenville last weekend... I was blown away by Main Street! They have really done it with excellence -- all of the right finishing touches are there. My biggest problem with Columbia is, despite having many promising areas being redeveloped and innumerable projects on deck, none of them are genuinely being done with excellence.

What you have to remember is the Greenville's Main St wasn't always excellent. They have added more and more layers to their base over time. They started with a streetscape, and moved up from there. In 20 years, there is no telling what sorts of things Columbia will have.

^Now I can say that about Main Street--streetscaping delays, not ensuring street level retail with the new First Citizens tower, lack of facade improvements, etc. But I don't think I can say that about Lady Street (or the Vista in general--a success story indeed) or even Five Points. The only holdup with those two projects is the streetscaping. Even if Columbia did everything with its Main Street that Greenville has done with its Main Street, Greenville would still come out ahead due to the layout. It has the Peace Center anchoring one end, Falls Park somewhere in the middle, and the Hyatt anchoring the other end (although activity is spreading beyond the two anchors); this makes it pretty easy for development to fill in between the nodes. Columbia has nothing comparable in this regard--Finlay Park and Koger are in the Vista and not on Main, and the Marriott doesn't serve as an anchor at all. This isn't to say that there isn't room for improvement as far as Columbia's redevelopment efforts are concerned, because God knows there is--we've reiterated that innumerable times here. A much better comparison would be Elm Street in Greensboro; it is laid out much like Main in Columbia, with the exception of the street terminating in front of a prominent civic structure. I couldn't believe the activity I saw on the street at night, and they have a good mix of clubs/restaurants/bars as well. And they have towers interspersed along Elm, unlike Main in Greenville where most of the activity is on the stretch away from the towers. Personally, I'm beginning to have high hopes for Lady, and Gervais is looking better every day. The only thing that works against it is that it's a high volume major thoroughfare, so pedestrian activity is limited. So there are glimmers of hope for Columbia, if it will keep doing the right things right and learn where others have done it right and it hasn't.

Greenville has the Hyatt at one end and now the baseball stadium at the other... Falls Park and the Pace center are in the middle. Columbia has a lot more to work with that Greenville, but Greenville has arguably capitolized on what it has in a better way.

[803metlife]

In Saturday night's football game against Georgia on ESPN, the Gamecocks didn't do anything to help Columbia's image, but at halftime the cameral showed the Wade Hampton statue and the capitol dome, and one of the commentators said, "South Carolina has a beautiful capitol. South Carolina's a nice state; Charleston, Myrtle Beach; Columbia's a pretty city, nice campus."

I thought I was the only one who heard that .They had nothing to say or as if it was unfamiliar turf.

[krazeeboi]

Greenville has the Hyatt at one end and now the baseball stadium at the other... Falls Park and the Pace center are in the middle. Columbia has a lot more to work with that Greenville, but Greenville has arguably capitolized on what it has in a better way.

Very true. We can admire what other places have done well, but let's not forget what our own cities have done well in the process. And as you have stated, Columbia has more to work with. We'll see how it all comes together in a few years or so.

[waccamatt]

Very true. We can admire what other places have done well, but let's not forget what our own cities have done well in the process. And as you have stated, Columbia has more to work with. We'll see how it all comes together in a few years or so.

In Columbia, the development is just spread over a much larger area...the Vista, Main Street, Five Points, the Stadium area, etc...

[krazeeboi]

^True. The dots just have to be connected, and it will take longer due to their spacing.

One of the letters to the editors in today's edition of The State makes a good point about the Lady Street streetscaping: as far as we can tell, no provisions have been made for bikers. Speaking of which, where are the bike lanes in DT Columbia? I don't think I've seen them clearly marked. Charlotte does a pretty good job with this.

Edited September 12, 2006 by krazeeboi

[JT Boy]

Greenville has the Hyatt at one end and now the baseball stadium at the other... Falls Park and the Pace center are in the middle. Columbia has a lot more to work with that Greenville, but Greenville has arguably capitolized on what it has in a better way.

I think that is a good point Spartan. Greenville's Main Street is really outstanding and way, way better than it was when I was at Furman there in the mid-80's. I think Greenville's challenge is that they have a lovely, but relatively small, downtown stuck in a huge swirl of repulsive suburban sprawl, with some nice mountains off in the distance. It is going to be a tough slog translating the Main Street feel into other areas of the city/region, and as far as I know, Greenville doesn't really have another urbanized area to work with outside the Main Street area.

I was in Greenville last year and noticed on the drive from downtown out to Furman that, while there were some fairly large changes, that there were also a huge number of the same rundown buildings, decrepit looking businesses and that junkyard/trash yard (not sure what it is ) off to the left of the road, just like it was in 1986. Each time I visit downtown Greenville, I always think "Wow, this is so nice, they've done such a great job here." Then I get depressed after driving through the sprawl to exit the area...

Columbia's challenge is that Main Street will never really be the "main street" of the city again, at least not in the way it was historically, so what is the role that Main Street plays now and how can the city help move towards success there. Columbia is blessed with the thriving urban neighborhoods and entertainment/retail districts of the Vista, Five Points, and Devine Street as additional urbanized areas within the city, with the potential to create another urbanized area on North Main.

Edited September 12, 2006 by JT Boy

[krazeeboi]

^Excellent points. All of the centers of activity aren't clustered together, so you don't really get the all-in-your-face effect like one does in Greenville.

At any rate, here's one conversation I don't think will be happening in Columbia anytime soon. This is why I really dig the Vista; it's authentic.

[goodbye]

I think that is a good point Spartan. Greenville's Main Street is really outstanding and way, way better than it was when I was at Furman there in the mid-80's. I think Greenville's challenge is that they have a lovely, but relatively small, downtown stuck in a huge swirl of repulsive suburban sprawl, with some nice mountains off in the distance. It is going to be a tough slog translating the Main Street feel into other areas of the city/region, and as far as I know, Greenville doesn't really have another urbanized area to work with outside the Main Street area.

I was in Greenville last year and noticed on the drive from downtown out to Furman that, while there were some fairly large changes, that there were also a huge number of the same rundown buildings, decrepit looking businesses and that junkyard/trash yard (not sure what it is ) off to the left of the road, just like it was in 1986. Each time I visit downtown Greenville, I always think "Wow, this is so nice, they've done such a great job here." Then I get depressed after driving through the sprawl to exit the area...

Poinsett Highway in Greenville definitely leaves much to be desired. It is probably the most unchanged of the major arteries into downtown, and sadly is the most direct link to Furman University. That said, there are clear signs of change along the way, and a solid, growing anchor lies close to the Furman end - Cherrydale and the nearby Montebello community. Of course there are many other great new projects developing nearby, and countless others happening and planned around the city. The closest to the incredible Main Street feel outside downtown would have to be the Augusta Road corridor, which could also use a bit of work, IMO. The new mixed-use developments being built at Verdae and Magnolia Park Town Center should definitely provide new cores of good urban growth as well.

While Greenville does not enjoy the large-scale grid system Columbia has been established with for so long, it more than exceeds the general expectations of visitors and new residents, thus allowing our state to have powerful and effective urban growth magnets in both the Upstate and the Midlands, not to mention the Lowcountry and Coastal regions as well.

Edited September 13, 2006 by Skyliner

[JT Boy]

Poinsett Highway in Greenville definitely leaves much to be desired. It is probably the most unchanged of the major arteries into downtown, and sadly is the most direct link to Furman University. That said, there are clear signs of change along the way, and a solid, growing anchor lies close to the Furman end - Cherrydale and the nearby Montebello community. Of course there are many other great new projects developing nearby, and countless others happening and planned around the city. The closest to the incredible Main Street feel outside downtown would have to be the Augusta Road corridor, which could also use a bit of work, IMO. The new mixed-use developments being built at Verdae and Magnolia Park Town Center should definitely provide new cores of good urban growth as well.

While Greenville does not enjoy the large-scale grid system Columbia has been established with for so long, it more than exceeds the general expectations of visitors and new residents, thus allowing our state to have powerful and effective urban growth magnets in both the Upstate and the Midlands, not to mention the Lowcountry and Coastal regions as well.

Yes, I think you are right about Poinsett Highway being the least changed of the major arteries. I do remember Augusta Road from my time at FU, but haven't been there in years and years. One of the difficulties about Greenville for me is that Main Street is so appealing and attractive, while much of the other new development in the region is simply not my style of development or choice of living situations. It might be very good for what it is, it just doesn't appeal to me.

I think you are right about the urban growth magnets across the state. And they are very diverse sorts of areas, which gives newcomers a range of options about what area to move to. Good for all of SC!

[waccamatt]

^Excellent points. All of the centers of activity aren't clustered together, so you don't really get the all-in-your-face effect like one does in Greenville.

At any rate, here's one conversation I don't think will be happening in Columbia anytime soon. This is why I really dig the Vista; it's authentic.

You know, I think that article explains my lack of enthusiasm in a nutshell: I call Charlotte "The Plastic City" for a reason; everything has to be planned and new and contrived. How in the world can people think a gritty are can be made? A gritty area/entertainment district evolves. It may be helped along by city improvements once it begins its evolution, but things like that happen by chance for the most part. A good example of this is 42nd Street in NYC. It used to be gritty and dirty and had a reputation, but it was cool and it was real. I was in NYC in July and remarked to a friend of mine (who lives in Chelsea) how boring 42nd Street and Times Square are today. That neighborhood is more like a theme park than a neighborhood, today, with chain restaurants and upscale stores. I hate to tell everyone (Tem, are you listening?), the mark of a great city is not just the number of upscale stores, restaurants and bars a place has, but it is the cool stuff that college students and other lower income people have that makes a place cool, too.

[TheSuperPope]

^^Thank God for 5 points!!! My college experience would have been much less entertaining without it... almost like I had gone to Clemson or something nah i'm just playing