North Main St.

[gregw]

I don't know if I would call the Camp St. area one of the "wealthiest neighborhoods" in the city. North Main is fairly isolated unless you drive there. I live near it but I only drive along it, usually only to go somewhere else.

I do like to walk to the Ivy for a pint about once a week though

Come to think of it, the upper part of North Main has never really been a distinctly East Side shopping district like Thayer, Wayland, and Hope St. Even Camp St used to have a mini retail area. It had an A&P market where Camp St Ministries now is.

North Main's traditionally been a much more citywide or even regional shopping area with midlevel retail places like Sears and a lot of automotive related businesses as it is Route 1. A lot of the bldgs there used to be car dealerships or auto repair places kind of like Elmwood which is also part of Route 1.

[Jenkins]

I think "right next" is one of those distance relations that Rhode Islanders have a problem with, like 15 minute epic voyages. Benefit Street empties onto North Main, it's a rather stark contrast coming off Benefit onto North Main. Camp Street wealthy? Not so much, but Hope Street is not too far from North Main.

Exactly. Coming from Boston, the distance from North Main to Hope street is considered "right next to". Forgot to factor in the Rho Dyland point of view

I do like to walk to the Ivy for a pint about once a week though

Love the Ivy. Rob is just the coolest bartender.

[brick]

Exactly. Coming from Boston, the distance from North Main to Hope street is considered "right next to". Forgot to factor in the Rho Dyland point of view

Uh, regardless, the reason you feel like you're going through a slum crossing North Main is because you have to climb up one of the mt. hope streets or go up to Rochambeau to get to the Ivy. And, some of those houses still look pretty slummy. Also, the north burial ground, while having some really nice monuments in it, cuts off that whole section of the city, giving more illusion to the slum feel.

[Jenkins]

Uh, regardless, the reason you feel like you're going through a slum crossing North Main is because you have to climb up one of the mt. hope streets or go up to Rochambeau to get to the Ivy. And, some of those houses still look pretty slummy. Also, the north burial ground, while having some really nice monuments in it, cuts off that whole section of the city, giving more illusion to the slum feel.

? Actually it is with full regard for the fact that to a Bostonian North Main St. is considered right next to the East Side that I find its condition so perplexing. That feeling/perception is based almost wholly on the condition of North Main and has very little to do with the condition of Rochambeau or 4th St., etc. Those streets I consider to be just fine. Camp is the only street that gives me pause, and I don't even come in contact with it since I go up 4th from North Main.

[brick]

? Actually it is with full regard for the fact that to a Bostonian North Main St. is considered right next to the East Side that I find its condition so perplexing. That feeling/perception is based almost wholly on the condition of North Main and has very little to do with the condition of Rochambeau or 4th St., etc. Those streets I consider to be just fine. Camp is the only street that gives me pause, and I don't even come in contact with it since I go up 4th from North Main.

except that MarkOne's post was in response to your perplexion about North Main being a dump.

It was a dump for years because what it is right next to is the Mt. Hope area which was a pretty good slum before the whole revitalization. For all Cotuit complains about the unfriendliness of the University Heights shopping center, you should have seen it five or better ten years ago. It was a slum. With a slum on one side and the burial ground on the other, I think that should answer your perplexion. Hell, if you saw what North Main looked like ten years ago, you would note the improvement. Unfortunately, noone really seems to care (with pretty good reason, there are better places to focus efforts) which means that No. Main will have slow revitalization compared to other areas.

[Jenkins]

except that MarkOne's post was in response to your perplexion about North Main being a dump.

except that....? huh? MarkOne responded to my point by saying that he considered NM to not really be close to the east side. I then said that to me, a Bostonian, it feels close, hence my perplexion at is condition. You then said regardless of that fact that I feel that NM is close to the East Side, it feels like a slum due to Mount Hope. Again, to me, not knowing the past of NM or Mount Hope, seeing it as close to the East Side from my out of town perspective, it is odd that it is run down. Mount Hope having nothing to do with that feeling.

[brick]

except that....? huh? MarkOne responded to my point by saying that he considered NM to not really be close to the east side. I then said that to me, a Bostonian, it feels close, hence my perplexion at is condition. You then said regardless of that fact that I feel that NM is close to the East Side, it feels like a slum due to Mount Hope. Again, to me, not knowing the past of NM or Mount Hope, seeing it as close to the East Side from my out of town perspective, it is odd that it is run down. Mount Hope having nothing to do with that feeling.

No, he replied that there is a slum between North Main and the rich people. Go re-read his quote. I promise you he never said that NM isn't close to the East Side. I'm just giving you the reasons it's there in answer to your perplexion. Remember that as little as 25 years ago Benefit St. was considered for redevelopment because of it's poor state. Hell when my cousin was looking at Brown in 1996 coming out of high school my aunt basically forbid her (with the all-powerful we will not provide tuition card) from coming to such a ruin of a city. Providence had a pretty steady decline throughout the 70's, 80's, and early 90's. Much of the suburban sprawl is a result of a time when people were afraid to step foot inside of Providence after dark. In some places, the revitalization has been very quick. And, Providence was helped more than most cities, I think, because of real estate speculation in the near-past market which has helped other neighborhoods. Since North Main itself was not so bad that it needed public investment, and since there is little opportunity for speculative investment, it hasn't improved at the same rate. And, as MarkOne alluded to, East Siders don't really see North Main. In its current state, it is more for shuttling traffic to 95 or into Pawtucket. East siders immediately climb Olney, Doyle, or Cyprus. Point being, it's not in the faces of the rich people who might want to have seen improvement before now.

There's your explanation for North Main St. Hopefully it will continue to get improvement. I'm guessing this post was a waste of time since you aren't all that interested, but c'est la vie.

[Jenkins]

No, he replied that there is a slum between North Main and the rich people. Go re-read his quote. I promise you he never said that NM isn't close to the East Side. I'm just giving you the reasons it's there in answer to your perplexion. Remember that as little as 25 years ago Benefit St. was considered for redevelopment because of it's poor state. Hell when my cousin was looking at Brown in 1996 coming out of high school my aunt basically forbid her (with the all-powerful we will not provide tuition card) from coming to such a ruin of a city. Providence had a pretty steady decline throughout the 70's, 80's, and early 90's. Much of the suburban sprawl is a result of a time when people were afraid to step foot inside of Providence after dark. In some places, the revitalization has been very quick. And, Providence was helped more than most cities, I think, because of real estate speculation in the near-past market which has helped other neighborhoods. Since North Main itself was not so bad that it needed public investment, and since there is little opportunity for speculative investment, it hasn't improved at the same rate. And, as MarkOne alluded to, East Siders don't really see North Main. In its current state, it is more for shuttling traffic to 95 or into Pawtucket. East siders immediately climb Olney, Doyle, or Cyprus. Point being, it's not in the faces of the rich people who might want to have seen improvement before now.

There's your explanation for North Main St. Hopefully it will continue to get improvement. I'm guessing this post was a waste of time since you aren't all that interested, but c'est la vie.

Dios Mio.

[PVDJack]

Hell, if you saw what North Main looked like ten years ago, you would note the improvement. Unfortunately, noone really seems to care (with pretty good reason, there are better places to focus efforts) which means that No. Main will have slow revitalization compared to other areas.

Brick, I enjoyed and appreciated your posts on this thread, but think (and hope, as a Summit resident) you might be wrong on the point above. My intuition says, zoning changes allowing, that NM will develop faster than most other "challenged" Providence areas. It is after all a four-lane boulevard connecting downtown Providence with downtwon Pawtucket. The southern end is turning around with Whole Foods et al, and the northern end just over the Pawtucket border is looking better and better. We've got the Sears and Andersen Little lots slated for some sort of development. Also a bunch of "For Sale" signs which will likely lead to other new owners. I really think NM may be reaching a tipping point.

PVDJack

[brick]

Brick, I enjoyed and appreciated your posts on this thread, but think (and hope, as a Summit resident) you might be wrong on the point above. My intuition says, zoning changes allowing, that NM will develop faster than most other "challenged" Providence areas. It is after all a four-lane boulevard connecting downtown Providence with downtwon Pawtucket. The southern end is turning around with Whole Foods et al, and the northern end just over the Pawtucket border is looking better and better. We've got the Sears and Andersen Little lots slated for some sort of development. Also a bunch of "For Sale" signs which will likely lead to other new owners. I really think NM may be reaching a tipping point.

PVDJack

Jack, I totally agree with you about the imminent future. However, I still think that the redo will start at the Pawtucket line and work in rather than starting at Doyle and working out. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but I do think it will be a while before driving along No. Main between Doyle and Rochambeau makes you feel like you are in a neighborhood. That North Burial ground is a daunting obstacle. I wish it had more trees, like Swan Point.

[PVDJack]

Jack, I totally agree with you about the imminent future. However, I still think that the redo will start at the Pawtucket line and work in rather than starting at Doyle and working out. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but I do think it will be a while before driving along No. Main between Doyle and Rochambeau makes you feel like you are in a neighborhood. That North Burial ground is a daunting obstacle. I wish it had more trees, like Swan Point.

Yeah, I think you're right, Brick. To your point, one of the most interesting nearby projects is the HUGE (650,000 sq. feet!) mixed-use redevelopment slated for Hope Webbing at 999 - 1005 Main Street on the Pawtucket side.

Map

Art in Ruins

Jack

[Frankie811]

I do like to walk to the Ivy for a pint about once a week though

I thought you meant the Ivy Drug Store, at Elgin & Hope St, formely the Elgin Drug Store, which sells liqour. Is there a bar up in Mt Hope called "The Ivy".?

[MikeR]

Jack, I totally agree with you about the imminent future. However, I still think that the redo will start at the Pawtucket line and work in rather than starting at Doyle and working out. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but I do think it will be a while before driving along No. Main between Doyle and Rochambeau makes you feel like you are in a neighborhood. That North Burial ground is a daunting obstacle. I wish it had more trees, like Swan Point.

Question - how is the condition of N. Main itself these days? My wife and I used to take my monther-in-law to Gregg's from time to time, but we haven't gone in a while - there were so many potholes and inch-wide cracks along that section it made it not worth the trip (we take her to the Smithfield Ave. location instead). The road needs to be reconstructed!

[Frankie811]

Question - how is the condition of N. Main itself these days?

The state made some improvements along the road. It's not as bad as it use to be. You should be ok!

[brick]

Question - how is the condition of N. Main itself these days? My wife and I used to take my monther-in-law to Gregg's from time to time, but we haven't gone in a while - there were so many potholes and inch-wide cracks along that section it made it not worth the trip (we take her to the Smithfield Ave. location instead). The road needs to be reconstructed!

What Frankie said. They re-paved the road and re-did the median about two years ago (or three? time flies) It's not nearly as bad as it was.

Jack, I'm pretty excited about the Hope Webbing project. I'm on Oak Hill (close to Shea HS) and would love to see that area of town get some good development.

[markOne]

No, he replied that there is a slum between North Main and the rich people. Go re-read his quote. I promise you he never said that NM isn't close to the East Side.

Indeed. N. Main is not physically far from the East Side. I am not from RI so I am not afflicted with the normal shortened sense of "far". In the areas mentioned by Brick it does seem economically distant though. It is getting better Cyprus and Camp Streets have some investors fixing up a few of the houses and the Police sub-station on Camp seems to have made a big difference. I even see officers walking the streets now and again. It is, however, a stretch to say North Main's neighbors are the most affluent in the city. Even at the other end most of the folks living closer to N. Main are middle class. I like N. Main and I have high hopes that as PVD and "the Bucket" continue to improve it will become a great link between the 2 cities.

N. Main is a long enough street that it has more than one "character". The part I think of as "North Main" is from Olney to 10th. For most of that section the neighbors on West side of the street don't offer much. I like the cemetery but it could use some serious beautification, and unfortunately I don't think the residents will be doing much to drive the local economy. The houses on the East side of the street up to about Woodbine are not exactly high rent. Further up the street things get much better but the neighbors still don't have the money of those who live on College Hill. Down where Benefit parallels N. Main the condos on N. Main go for a pretty penny, and there are several nice shops and restaurants (Mills Tavern:) ) That is where money and N. Main are juxtaposed, and it shows.

I thought you meant the Ivy Drug Store, at Elgin & Hope St, formely the Elgin Drug Store, which sells liqour. Is there a bar up in Mt Hope called "The Ivy".?

The bar is called "The Ivy Tavern". It is a nice little bar in Hope Village, in the same block as Hope St. Pizza. The Ivy also serves good food, except for the spaghetti and meat balls. The meat balls are HUGE which is good but they, and the sauce, are WAY over spiced. I can't even eat them. It is a flavor thing, not a heat thing.

[Frankie811]

There appears to be some type of contruction work being done on lower S. Main St between XO and Mill Tavern. Any ideas?

[basachs]

It is going to be a bistro, owned by the same guys that own XO. No idea on type of food, or when they will complete. I believe it will be done before thier new venture where Brewed Awakenings was, but who knows?

[Frankie811]

Caution to those who park their cars at the Bonanza/Peter Pan bus lot off N. Main St. Cars are being stolen from the customer parking area at an alarming rate. This has been going on for about a year now. The police and management have been promising increased security, but it hasen't helped.

[mr2448]

The bar is called "The Ivy Tavern". It is a nice little bar in Hope Village, in the same block as Hope St. Pizza. The Ivy also serves good food, except for the spaghetti and meat balls. The meat balls are HUGE which is good but they, and the sauce, are WAY over spiced. I can't even eat them. It is a flavor thing, not a heat thing.

First time I have ever heard of Hope Street refered to as "Hope Village". I guess we can't confuse it with the Village of Hope In Scituate. As a youngster it never had a name other than the business section of Hope Street. And of course it was much different. A & P, First National, Hope Theater, Millers, etc. A couple of years ago I provided the current owners of Elgin Drug pictures of the building and the inside when it had the fountain and was nothing more than a combo drug, candy and fountain type store. I remember it as being very dark inside because of the dark wood throughout the store. The owner was in his 70's at the time. The building was shared with a Sunnybrook Farms. Wow, straight out of "Leave it to Beaver"!

Mark

[Garris]

First time I have ever heard of Hope Street refered to as "Hope Village".

It seems to be a term that realtors have invented to identify homes in the area more than anything else. It's really not an identifier in wide circulation by the public. I actually think it's quite a nice moniker and fits the neighborhood well.

- Garris

[PVDJack]

Jon Howard, the President of the Summit Neighborhood Association, just informed me that there is a SNA Board meeting tonight at 7pm at the Rochambleau Library (downstairs). Among other business, they will be sharing the interim results of a recent survey of Summit residents regarding the future of North Main St. All are welcome.

PVDJack

[Frankie811]

Jon Howard, the President of the Summit Neighborhood Association, just informed me that there is a SNA Board meeting tonight at 7pm at the Rochambleau Library (downstairs). Among other business, they will be sharing the interim results of a recent survey of Summit residents regarding the future of North Main St. All are welcome.

PVDJack

Has it been confirmed that a Walgreen's is moving up there?

[Cotuit]

So, on the other end of North Main, the windows of the old Providence Monthly have been covered with brown paper for a couple months. Printed signs for "LOTUS" went up a couple weeks ago, and I came up with three theories:

1. yoga studio

2. Asian restaurant

3. Asian furniture store

The last one won. If you peek through holes in the paper, you see the high-end Asian furniture. Anybody know more about Lotus?

It appears to be open.

[Garris]

It appears to be open.

On a quick drive-by, it looked to be a furniture store. Is this right?

- Garris