Spartanburg Long-Range Transportation Plan (2025)

[roads-scholar]

Hi Roads-Scholar,

What about I-185 on the west side of Greenville?  This freeway only has like one, maybe two exits between I-85 and it's termination point near the hospital.  How did this freeway keeps it's official interstate designation?  It looks like this was an old highway that they simply made controlled access.  It seems to get so little use.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Interstate 185, like some of the upstate's other roads, has an interesting history. I-185 was originally constructed in the early 1950's as part of the new routing for US-29. US-29's original routing out of Greenville was Augusta Street to Grove Road, now SC-20 (take a drive down Grove Road and you will see, and feel, some of the original pavement). A new US-29 was built from Wade Hampton Boulevard along what we now know as Church Street, Mills Avenue, I-185, and I-85 all the way to Anderson.

When the federal government and the state of South Carolina were planning our interstate routes in the late 1950's it was decided that I-26 would run from Charleston to Asheville via Columbia and Spartanburg. Greenville wasn't very happy about being bypassed. In an effort to mollify Greenville, the state gave Greenville two spur routes leading from I-85 into downtown. The first of these spurs was I-185. It was built over the recently contructed US-29 alignment. This is why I-185 and US-29 are co-signed betweened the hospital and I-85. This is also why I-185 fails to meet current interstate safety standards with it's narrow median and shoulders.

The other spur route between I-85 and downtown Greenville is I-385. When built, I-385 was a completely new freeway.

I-585 in Spartanburg has a history strangely similar to I-185. It was orginally constructed as a new route for US-176 (US-176 originally followed what is now the Asheville Highway - SC-56). When the interstate system came into being the "new" US-176 was converted into a spur route and became I-585. Like I-185, it does not meet current interstate safety standards and is co-signed with US-176.

Interesting, neither I-185 or I-585 are regarded as pure interstates by their respective communities. They are both short in length, don't look much like freeways, and are co-signed with another route number. Most people in Greenville refer to I-185 and "29" and most people in Spartanburg refer to I-585 as "176".

I-185 was recently extended past I-85 when the Southern Connector toll road opened a few years ago. However, the I-185 designation is hardly mentioned when this freeway is discussed. Most people refer to it as the "Southern Connector".

Traffic on I-185 is rather light. Therefore, I don't see where the original section between the hospital and I-85 will be improved anytime in the near future.

So you're right. I-185 is an old highway that was converted into a freeway.

[gs3]

Thanks RS!

[Spartan]

I-585 in Spartanburg has a history strangely similar to I-185.  It was orginally constructed as a new route for US-176 (US-176 originally followed what is now the Asheville Highway - SC-56).  When the interstate system came into being the "new" US-176 was converted into a spur route and became I-585.  Like I-185, it does not meet current interstate safety standards and is co-signed with US-176. 

Interesting, neither I-185 or I-585 are regarded as pure interstates by their respective communities.  They are both short in length, don't look much like freeways, and are co-signed with another route number.  Most people in Greenville refer to I-185 and "29" and most people in Spartanburg refer to I-585 as "176".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is interesting stuff

Wasn't Pine St extended north about the same time they re-routed 176?

To add the second part- as a child, I didn't know that 585 existed as such until I was in High School. It was not out of ignorance, but out the fact that everyone called it 176 as roads-scholar said

This is why I would like to see it extended towards downtown. I would like 585 to become a recognized spur of the likes of 385 and 126.

[roads-scholar]

That is interesting stuff

Wasn't Pine St extended north about the same time they re-routed 176?

To add the second part- as a child, I didn't know that 585 existed as such until I was in High School. It was not out of ignorance, but out the fact that everyone called it 176 as roads-scholar said

This is why I would like to see it extended towards downtown. I would like 585 to become a recognized spur of the likes of 385 and 126.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pine Street was extended north at the same time (mid 1950's) when the new US-176 was constructed. It was intially named Byrnes Boulevard in honor of the former governor, Supreme Court Justice, statesman, and Spartanburg resident James F. Byrnes. Unfortunately for Mr. Byrnes, most people referred to the stretch of road between East Main Street and Pinewood as North Pine Street. For a number years a hard-to-read sign with BYRNES THRUWAY stood on southbound 585 near where Regional One's landing pad is now. Some twenty years ago the Spartanburg City Council decided to formally remove all references to Byrnes Boulevard and officially name the road North Pine Street.

I personally preferred Byrnes Boulevard because it was and remains to this day a boulevard with a landscaped median.

I don't see 585 being extended as a freeway into downtown. Don't get me wrong, I would love that to happen. However, that would require a significant acquisition of right-of-way to meet interstate highway requirements.

You mentioned 385 and 126 as spurs leading into downtown. Like 585, both of these freeways become surface streets before actually entering their respective downtowns.

What I would really like to see happen to 585 is (1) a high speed interchange linking I-85 with I-585, (2) a major upgrade with additional lanes between Business 85 and Pinewood, (3) a replacement overpass with a diamond interchange for California Avenue, (4) improvements to the US-221 / SC-9 interchange, and (5) improved overhead signage. SPATS has already allocated funding for #4 but no other improvements are in the pipeline. I do know that SPATS fought hard to keep the 585 designation in order to receive federal dollars for the it's continued improvements.

[Spartan]

I personally preferred Byrnes Boulevard because it was and remains to this day a boulevard with a landscaped median. 

What I would really like to see happen to 585 is (1) a high speed interchange linking I-85 with I-585, (2) a major upgrade with additional lanes between Business 85 and Pinewood, (3) a replacement overpass with a diamond interchange for California Avenue, (4) improvements to the US-221 / SC-9 interchange, and (5) improved overhead signage.  SPATS has already allocated funding for #4 but no other improvements are in the pipeline.  I do know that SPATS fought hard to keep the 585 designation in order to receive federal dollars for the it's continued improvements.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have to disagree. Though the "Boulevard" moniker would be more appropriate, it creates two different names for the same road. I hate it when this happens. It creates unnecessary confusion. For example- Ison St, Drayton Rd, Fernwood-Glendale Rd. Why not make the whole thing Dratyon-Glendale Rd? I just prefer simplicity in road naming.

This brings me to another point. Does it not bother anyone else that we have such long names for our roads? When people get roads named after them, their whole name is used. For example- W. O. Exell Blvd, John B White Sr. Blvd, Hudson L Barksdale Blvd.... What ever happened to using just the last name eg: Converse St, Dunbar St, etc... This is just something that I have always found confusing. Oh well

[krazeeboi]

This may be somewhat of a regional thing. I know Charlotte has W.T. Harris Blvd and J.M. Keynes Dr.

BTW Spartan, are you back in Spartanburg for the summer?

Edited May 11, 2005 by krazeeboi

[roads-scholar]

I have to disagree. Though the "Boulevard" moniker would be more appropriate, it creates two different names for the same road. I hate it when this happens. It creates unnecessary confusion. For example- Ison St, Drayton Rd, Fernwood-Glendale Rd. Why not make the whole thing Dratyon-Glendale Rd? I just prefer simplicity in road naming.

This brings me to another point. Does it not bother anyone else that we have such long names for our roads? When people get roads named after them, their whole name is used. For example- W. O. Exell Blvd, John B White Sr. Blvd, Hudson L Barksdale Blvd.... What ever happened to using just the last name eg: Converse St, Dunbar St, etc... This is just something that I have always found confusing. Oh well

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You make a pretty good point about the confusion. Back in the early 80's I recall that there was movement to make the street either Byrnes Blvd. or North Pine Street. Since most of the businesses along the route were already using North Pine Street in their advertising, it was decided to stick with North Pine Street and eliminate Byrnes Blvd.

Regarding the long names, you're right about that too. It is possible that in time the street name will evolve into the surname only. For instance, I haven't heard Hudson L. Barksdale Blvd. in a while. Only Barksdale. is heard nowadays.

[Spartan]

BTW Spartan, are you back in Spartanburg for the summer?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes.

edit: I most likely won't be returning to live in Columbia unless I get a job there.

Edited May 11, 2005 by Spartan

[Spartan]

This is sort of a random topic, but its transportation-related so here it goes:

This article from the HJ today is on skateboarders, and how those "darn kids" are always tearing things up with their boards, grinding all over the place and whatnot. Spartanburg has decided to build a public skate park- the first of its kind in the Upstate, and maybe even South Carolina. However, they have also banned skate boarding in the central business district. Landrum, on the other hand, has gone the opposite direction. They have banned skateboards from their parks outright. Chesnee, on the other hand, is also looking at building a skate park, so that the kids will have a place to go.

So with all of this in mind, do you think that banning skateboarding is a good idea?

I think its a bad idea to ban it. It sets a bad example because 1) you are discouraging exercise- which our kids need- and 2) you are discouraging alternate forms of transportation which to me is the most important aspect of skate boarding. As Spartanburg strives to become more bike and pedestrian friendly, we shouldn't be discouraging this type of transportation- even if they do tear things up a little.

[GvilleSC]

I agree that it's a bad idea to ban skateboarding, but I'm glad to see that Spartanburg is looking into building a public skate park. Sounds like a great venture, though I think it'd be good to have skateboarding in an organized place as well as anywhere else they want to go... It's good to have people mixing and if that means white collar workers downtown and skateboarding kids, then so be it.

[Spartan]

Exactly. In Landrum's case they were destroying public property, so there was justification for banning it- I just think they used the wrong approach. When has telling a teenager "no" ever accomplished anything? Why not provide a facility for them to use. These kids aren't bad, they just want something to do. Also, what about adults who skateboard? They do exist.

[breed]

Banning isn't really a good idea... if anything it only emboldens the more brazen skaters.

I think it is a better idea to replace anything damaged with mure durable versions of the same thing, perhaps with built-in anti-skating devices... interrupt long smooth expanses with indestructable artistic protusions. They do the job.

That and provide a place for that activity to take place. Spartanburg providing a skate park is a step in the right direction.

[Spartan]

I noticed hat the "bypass" around "downtown" Roebuck has been finished. I didn't realize it was going to be bridge over the rails. I'm glad that they went around Roebuck but that thing seems a bit like overkill to me.

[roads-scholar]

I noticed hat the "bypass" around "downtown" Roebuck has been finished. I didn't realize it was going to be bridge over the rails. I'm glad that they went around Roebuck but that thing seems a bit like overkill to me.

Sparta, SCDOT is doing the same with SC-290 in Moore, completely bypassing the "town" of Moore.

[Spartan]

I either forgot or never knew that Spartanburg County Council had adopted a resolution supporting Complete Streets. Either way its exciting to learn this fact. The proposed typical section for the Hwy 9 widening project will include bike lanes and sidewalk separated by a planting strip. Think of the Reidville Rd widening project (west of 26). I'm also glad that the HJ is relatively supportive of this concept because you can rest assured that most people around here won't understand the idea of trying to accommodate other types of traffic than cars.

Article

[Ezekiel]

Hi, I haven't posted in quite awhile and I'm not sure this is the right thread, but I remember some discussion at one point about the possibility of extending West Blackstock Rd. up to Fairforest Rd. or even I-85 Business Loop. I'd say with the advent of Costco, the Spartan 16 Cinema, Holiday Inn Express, and the new motel going up across the street, such an extension cannot come soon enough. It would make it easier for anyone from north of 85 to get to the mall and take some of the load off the Blackstock/29 intersection. Having driven the new SC 296 route through Roebuck, I'd like to see something similar over the railroad tracks in Arcadia.

[roads-scholar]

For some reason this is not on SPAT's radar. I was in the Westgate area Saturday and the traffic entering the mall via 29 was backed up to 26. Traffic flow in the area needs to be thought out better.

[Spartan]

Yeah its not on the SPATS 2025 plan. Its also the first I've heard of it. It would be a good connection though.

The fact that its not on the plan doesn't mean that it won't happen. The extension of Caldwell Drive to Reidville Rd wasn't in the plan either, but the County was still able to push for it.

[Ezekiel]

Thank you for reviving this thread. I re-read the posts from the beginning and would encourage others to do so, particularly those around #10 through 20. These concern the need to upgrade 85 Business Loop and the political necessity of re-designating it an "Interstate" to make it eligible for federal funds. The new federal stimulus bill consists largely of spending on infrastructure, and we certainly wouldn't want Spartanburg to miss out on its share.

To quote Roads Scholar from four years ago, concerning such a redesignation:

It can be done but it will require a concerted effort by the city, the county, the chamber, SPATS, Congressman Bob Inglis, and Senator Jim DeMint. The problem is SCDOT. For some reason, they don't want the highway redesignated. I really don't see what the problem is. Sure, Business 85 has some poorly designed interchanges but so do many other freeways around the country. Back in 2000 I proposed a long-term solution to the freeway. First, improve the exit ramps to I-585 / US-176. Second, tackle the Hearon Circle exit ramps. Third, construct a new diamond interchange at SC-295. Fourth, construct a new diamond interchange at SC-9. Finally, construct construct a concrete "Jersey Barriers" in the median.

What the people at SCDOT don't realize is that too many motorists and too many dollars are literally bypassing Spartanburg. Interstate motorists naturally follow the tri-color interstate signs to their destinations.

[roads-scholar]

Thank you for reviving this thread. I re-read the posts from the beginning and would encourage others to do so, particularly those around #10 through 20. These concern the need to upgrade 85 Business Loop and the political necessity of re-designating it an "Interstate" to make it eligible for federal funds. The new federal stimulus bill consists largely of spending on infrastructure, and we certainly wouldn't want Spartanburg to miss out on its share.

To quote Roads Scholar from four years ago, concerning such a redesignation:

Business 85 will continue to die due to (1) public apathy, (2) SCDOT's complete disinterest, (3) lack of interest from the "powers to be" in Spartanburg, and (4) lack of funding.

When, and only when Business 85 becomes enough of an eyesore for Spartanburg Community College, USC-Upstate, and Milliken to complain will something be done. Nine years ago a group that included me proposed that SCDOT redesignate the highway Interstate 685. The justification behind this proposal was that motorists and their dollars were bypassing Spartanburg. The remaining commercial businesses were dying due to a lack of customers. The Spartanburg Herald-Journal and USC-Upstate president John Stockdale enthusiastically supported the proposal. SCDOT, the local chamber of commerce, the county government, and to my surprise, a number of major businesses along the route, were totally disinterested.

Today, despite growing and impressive physical plants at both Spartanburg Community College and USC-Upstate, the highway continues it's slow decline. Blight is visible at nearly every exit. Meanwhile, motorists and their dollars speed past Spartanburg on the "new" six-lane I-85 every day.

Changing the designation to I-685 will do four things. One, motorists, familiar and comfortable with the tri-color interstate shield are more likely to choose it as an alternate to I-85. Second, more federal and state dollars will be available to upgrade the highway. Third, motorists are more apt to visit downtown Spartanburg. Fourth, with more traffic and dollars investment and reinvestment should follow.

I know that motorists, in general, believe that a route signed "Business 85" means stoplights and will avoid it. In fact, most interstate business routes in the US are just that - business routes with stoplights. In the US today there are only three interstate business routes that are freeways - one is Business 85 in Spartanburg. The others two are Business 40 in Winston-Salem and Business 80 in Sacramento, California.

Back in 2000 we did convince SCDOT to add "Freeway Loop" to the I-85 entrances to Business 85.

In my opinion changing the designation is a no brainer. Officially, before a a highway can be designated an interstate it must meet interstate standards. Those standards include wide medians and shoulders, safe bridge clearance, correct interchange geometry, etc. Admittedly, Business 85 doesn't meet those standards. However, it met the standards before it lost it's I-85 designation in the mid-90's. With a few basic improvements, Business 85 can easily meet the standards.

Getting dollars back into Spartanburg has been my primary motivation behind this initiative. Even with Business 85 redesignated, many motorists will continue to bypass our city. However, the tri-color interstate shield will attract motorists like bees to honey. And that will revitalize the corridor and bring more visitors to Spartanburg.

[Spartan]

I completely agree with everything you just said, except that I think in order to fix the interchange geometry, it will take more than some quick fixes.

[travey]

I completely agree with everything you just said, except that I think in order to fix the interchange geometry, it will take more than some quick fixes.

Hell , When I 'm coming home from Gaffney or charlotte... I get confused as to which is which..... Bring the money back to the BURG!!!!!!

[roads-scholar]

I completely agree with everything you just said, except that I think in order to fix the interchange geometry, it will take more than some quick fixes.

Agreed. No quick fixes but...improving the geometry and flow of the I-585 / Hearon Circle interchange would be the #1 priority followed by fixing the awful mess that is the Boiling Springs Road exit.

[Ezekiel]

Hopefully the vacancies and in some cases demolitions along this corridor might facilitate interchange upgrades. The old Budget Inn at Fairforest Rd. has been torn down, I believe the Howard Johnson's and much around it is vacant, Mrs. Smith's is idle, etc.

One thing I find interesting is that the bridge where New Cut Rd. passes over new 85 (although there's no freeway access there) is 4 lanes wide whereas New Cut itself is only 2 lanes wide. I wonder if they were planning ahead or if federal code simply requires that all new Interstate overpasses be a minimum of 4 lanes.

[roads-scholar]

Hopefully the vacancies and in some cases demolitions along this corridor might facilitate interchange upgrades. The old Budget Inn at Fairforest Rd. has been torn down, I believe the Howard Johnson's and much around it is vacant, Mrs. Smith's is idle, etc.

One thing I find interesting is that the bridge where New Cut Rd. passes over new 85 (although there's no freeway access there) is 4 lanes wide whereas New Cut itself is only 2 lanes wide. I wonder if they were planning ahead or if federal code simply requires that all new Interstate overpasses be a minimum of 4 lanes.

Funny, I've never noticed that overpass. I think it's because, when I merge onto I-85 northbound from westbound I-26 (which I often do), it's so close to the interchange I completely miss it.

The Howard Johnson's has been sitting vacant now for a number of years. It's a real eyesore. As is the Sun & Sand on 221, and a couple of other motels at highway 9. The Budget Inn at Fairforest Road met the wrecking ball and few years back and the aging Tower Motel burned to the ground.