Tallahassee Performing Arts Center

[Florida]

FSU received millions in donations that were lost due to not making enough progress on a PAC for FSU.

Where did I say the Civic Center belonged to FSU?  Or that FSU should be given anything?  I said "joint"...which implies "joint" payment and "joint" sharing of space.  You are making huge leaps here...and not off of what I am saying.

What does FAMU have to do with it?  They haven't indicated they want a joint PAC...if they did...great, the COT needs to break up the cost.  But if they don't...why should they be a part of it?  You pay for it...you own a piece of it.  Thus "joint".

The COT simply cannot afford to spend over $100 million on a PAC.  They need to find other means of find money for this.  If they do not, it is just one huge political turkey which as a taxpayer I find offense.  They can't afford this.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

^Please pardon me if I made it seem as if you said the civic center belongs to FSU. I merely don't like the thought of FSU being so tightly jointed with the civic center if they have no plans to own it. Tallahassee has several parties interested in the center's useage, namely FAMU. As an FSU student myself it doesn't bother me to see FSU step up its involvement with the civic center, but as a Tallahassean I realize this is our only civic center, and we've got several institutions vying for it.

The performing arts center will be funded in large part by a new bed tax recently created here in Leon county. Additionally money from the downtown CRA, and federal grants for the arts will be sought to lighten the load. See www.onwiththeshow.com for more details on who wants to partner in this venture.

[stjoe]

" I merely don't like the thought of FSU being so tightly jointed with the civic center if they have no plans to own it. Tallahassee has several parties interested in the center's useage, namely FAMU. As an FSU student myself it doesn't bother me to see FSU step up its involvement with the civic center, but as a Tallahassean I realize this is our only civic center, and we've got several institutions vying for it."

I can see this different ways, but overall I differ from you on this here is why.

The last usage percentage I have seen showed that FSU used the civic center 80% of the time. Now there are two ways of looking at it.

From how you write, you make it seem like FSU is keeping someone else from using it. That isn't the case. The civic center NEEDS more folks using it. It isn't a case of FSU taking usage time from someone else. It is a case of the Civic Center has to pay the bills and they are lucky enough that FSU is using it and thus they can pay there mortage. Otherwise...the Civic Center goes in the red and the COT is screwed. FYI, the LCCC is one of the few civic centers in the state in the black.

So FSU uses the center 80% of the time, but only had about 20% of the committee vote until recently.

Now you can argue this different ways, but let me point out something similar...Innovation Park (IP). IP was started with a gift of 208 acres from FSU to the COT, with the stated mission of stimulation research in the area. Since, FSU pays $1.5 Million a year for rent in buildings they built on land they gave away, IP board has not done SQUAT in that area, and FSU only has as many votes as FAMU on the board and less than the COT. The board has abandoned it's mission of stimulating research and mearly collects rent off of land given to it from FSU.

The Civic Center is for the community. But with FSU using it 80% of the time....it IS the community...the center needs to be mainly suited for it's needs because it is the one using. You don't spend 50% of your resources on someone using it 1% of the time.

IP is an example of how sharing regardless of common sense has blown up in the cities face. You have to bring reality into the equation.

[Florida]

You make a strong point and from where you see this I can understand what you mean. I just hope we don't loose focus here in Tallahassee that we are made of many ingredients and not just one. Could it be FSU is 80% usage of the Civic Center because the center itself is rarely used outside of FSU Men's and Women's Basketball games, the occasional tradeshow, concert, play, and sometime graduations. Im sure looking back to the 1990s that figure would be drastically different as the Civic Center was in use by the Tigersharks, and the Tallahassee Thunder for their events as well. I do commend FSU on paying off the Civic Center's debt last year which allows us to now boast of being in the positive.

As far as IP is concerned, I'd support the idea of University Park if it were back on the drawing boards and leaders were serious about implementation as you have many times pointed out. I truly wait for the day when we can say our 2 major industries (education and government) have spun off into several, I believe we truly have that potential.

[stjoe]

You make a strong point and from where you see this I can understand what you mean. I just hope we don't loose focus here in Tallahassee that we are made of many ingredients and not just one. Could it be FSU is 80% usage of the Civic Center because the center itself is rarely used outside of FSU Men's and Women's Basketball games, the occasional tradeshow, concert, play, and sometime graduations. Im sure looking back to the 1990s that figure would be drastically different as the Civic Center was in use by the Tigersharks, and the Tallahassee Thunder for their events as well. I do commend FSU on paying off the Civic Center's debt last year which allows us to now boast of being in the positive.

As far as IP is concerned, I'd support the idea of University Park if it were back on the drawing boards and leaders were serious about implementation as you have many times pointed out. I truly wait for the day when we can say our 2 major industries (education and government) have spun off into several, I believe we truly have that potential.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Whatever the usage...it is the only kind the Civic Center can sell. FAMU doens't use it much (cost too much money), Tigersharks went out of business. The TLCCC is stuck with FSU as their client 80% of the time. They are and should be grateful, and FSU is grateful to have the TLCCC. It is a mutual relationship.

FYI, FSU has not paid off the debt. But FSU did sink $25 Million into the TLCCC in the last major renovations. Which is another reason I think FSU has an argument for itself.

The issue with IP is nobody in town knows one thing about research except for FAMU and FSU. And FAMU is not considered a success in research, the have 1/3 the research money that FSU has and about 1/100000 the research revenue of FSU. But the players at IP would rather be in a power with something that fails than to have FSU running the show with something sucessful. It is a shame.

[stjoe]

TaureanJ,

Just wanted to say, you post some great info on this board....good job.

[Urban_Legend]

^I agree, he's already up to 350 posts, and all of them are relevant!

[Florida]

Whatever the usage...it is the only kind the Civic Center can sell.

[bobliocatt]

TaureanJ,

Just wanted to say, you post some great info on this board....good job.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes....I know we have our disagreements sometimes, but you are doing a great job of keeping us informed of whats going on in the Capitol City. Keep up the good work.

[Florida]

^ SpankYou! That means alot coming from you Lakelander... buddy!

[stjoe]

as part of the agreement with the Civic Center Authority, in exchange for more seats on the board, FSU did pay off the debt of the civic center.

btw... thanks for the kind words! I can't say how much UP means to me now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Read this...

http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/democrat/ne...cal/8961086.htm

"Florida State University got the Civic Center board but not the debt.

Under a bill signed Thursday by Gov. Jeb Bush, FSU gets majority representation on the Tallahassee-Leon County Civic Center Authority. But FSU isn't taking over $18 million in Civic Center debt as some Leon County commissioners say they were promised."

"John Carnaghi, FSU's senior vice president for finance and administration, said the university didn't promise to take over the debt.

"That is absolutely, positively wrong," he said. FSU agreed to take over the city and county's joint responsibility of up to $250,000 a year for future operating losses, Carnaghi said."

"Commissioner Tony Grippa said he didn't recall FSU promising to take over the debt.

"What they agreed to do is release the city and county taxpayers of any future responsibility" for operating losses, he said.

Regardless of the disagreement, Carnaghi said the public should see no difference in how the Civic Center is operated.

"It is not an FSU facility," he said. "It will still be the Tallahassee-Leon County Civic Center Authority board."

[Florida]

I had not realize FSU backed out of the original deal, the one I and Im sure the local commissioners supported when they voted to authorize their support. But I do think it important to note... as said right above...

"It is not an FSU facility," Grippa said. "It will still be the Tallahassee-Leon County Civic Center..."

[stjoe]

I had not realize FSU backed out of the original deal, the one I and Im sure the local commissioners supported when they voted to authorize their support. But I do think it important to note... as said right above...

"It is not an FSU facility," Grippa said. "It will still be the Tallahassee-Leon County Civic Center..."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Taurean,

You make a MAJOR assumptions with your quote. You assume that FSU made a deal to pay off the debt. As the article noted (and a commissioner even said), whether that was the agreement or not is debatable. Yet you assume FSU is wrong here.

[Florida]

I don't like to assume... but I think it is only responsible that the notion that they would pay off the debt as the article described be cleared up before any agreement is inked. I'll call it misleading.

[stjoe]

I don't like to assume... but I think it is only responsible that the notion that they would pay off the debt as the article described be cleared up before any agreement is inked. I'll call it misleading.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You assume FSU mislead. Perhaps the COT just misunderstood. You have two commissioners with the opposite opinion of the agreement, perhaps the ones not happy didn't read the material...or are not smart. Not FSU's job to hand hold. To assume either way is wrong.

[Florida]

Well I assume the Leon County Commission, the Associated Press, the Democrat® Staff Writer, WCTV6, and WTXL all misunderstood, as that deal was a major draw of attention. Now I see why they have to take a step backwards with the financing of the parking garage which now has the Hotel hanging in limbo. With the debt paid off the civic center authority was talking about how its ability to finance the parking garage would be much better and therefore get this project underway.

[stjoe]

Some info that might or might not be interesting to you...

"Q: When you talk about overhead costs, how does the Tucker Center (formerly the Civic Center) factor in?

A: We budget nearly $350,000 just to utilize the Tucker Center annually. A few years ago, because the Tucker Center didn

[Florida]

Cool info. Was the whole $24 Million spent on skyboxes and seats?

[stjoe]

Cool info. Was the whole $24 Million spent on skyboxes and seats?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Most of it. It took quite a bit of structural change to make it happen. Not cheap. But skyboxes is where the money is.

[Florida]

Alright People!!!!! The secret is out... FSU has designed itself a Concert-Opera Hall. Here's what they've paid for.

and a look at the inside...

[cityboy05]

An opera house omg! Tallahassee is defenitely on the roll to becoming a music city. Can you see people dressed up to go see "Carmen." I can really see Tallahassee becoming a place like Vienna, Paris, or New Orleans. A place where there is a established culture. I love the design for the building but a few things "gots to go". Like the roof. I think it should either be a dark brown like the civic center or a dark red. The roof could probaly be all tile like Leon high. I think for this building red should be it's primary color. Everything else is decent. This is pretty nice.

[Florida]

tru tru... Im feelin your musical city thing.

[stjoe]

TaureanJ,

You are the master at digging up info...props to you.

Questions...

*I thought FSU gave up on an FSU PAC.

*Where would this one go?

*Is this a recent proposal or some old one that died?

*Any other info on this?

*Is is a joint project...with the COT?

[stjoe]

http://www.fsu.edu/~fstime/FS-Times/Volume...sue2/Music.html

"So it's no surprise that when she decided FSU -- and Tallahassee -- should have a performing-arts center, she did something to get it started.

Last December she gave $2 million of her own money, which was matched by $2 million from the state, to launch the campaign to build a $20-million concert hall on the FSU campus.

After years of efforts by city commissioners, arts lovers and educators to locate the center in one place or another, Housewright has settled the argument: It will be built, and it will be located at FSU. It is planned for the proposed "Corner on the Arts," a collection of campus fine-arts classroom buildings, museums and stages.

"All those nights when I couldn't sleep, I would lie in bed and think about this," said Housewright, the wife of Wiley Housewright, dean emeritus of the music school. "When the voters voted it down by just a few votes, I knew it would be up to private interests. We just thought it was time."

Another note of interest.

[Florida]

I like this article... looks like you yourself are an expert at diggin up the good articles.

[Florida]

TaureanJ,

You are the master at digging up info...props to you.

Questions...

*I thought FSU gave up on an FSU PAC.

*Where would this one go?

*Is this a recent proposal or some old one that died?

*Any other info on this?

*Is is a joint project...with the COT?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This rendering was recently completed which leads me to think they are still moving forward with their plans. This also lends to the notion that the community performing arts venue will be the Option 2 (Mid-sized hall, and large hall, without the opera hall included).

To be completed in the year 2006, this 1200 seat concert hall and opera house will include an opera rehearsal studio and donor reception spaces. The project has been designed to complement the existing historic Jacobean Revival/Tudor context, and to reduce the impact of the stagehouse by taking advantage of a steeply sloped site.

"Founded in 1910, the FSU School of Music is one of the most comprehensive and most respected programs in the country. With over 1,000 students, it is also the third largest. It was ranked 5th among public universities by US World and News Report. Last year, the School put on over 400 concerts and recitals. Neither the University nor the City of Tallahassee currently has a large performance hall with acoustical or theatrical attributes in which to stage orchestral or operatic performances. The new acoustically superior building will integrate the music school into a "Corner on the Arts District" as an important community and university center."