Haywood Mall Retail

[mallguy]

I don't see why you have such an axe to grind. From what I recall several years ago, and from what has been re-posted here, the information gsupstate posted was accurate. It did not assure that those stores would be at Magnolia Park Town Center, but it did state that those retailers were in negotiations with Menin. That was "insider info," and it was true. That was, of course, based on Magnolia Park Town Center actually being built as Menin promised it would be. It wasn't, so the retailers looked elsewhere. What's so difficult to understand about that?

I appreciate what you're saying, and your posts are great- they are interesting and well-informed.

If the posts I have an issue with instead had been along the line of, "There's an article in Shopping Center Business stating that Chain X is targeting the Upstate for a new store, and I understand that a lease has been signed for Magnolia Park for that store", that would be great. Then, if the center wasn't built, the posts would still be correct, and the posts would add value.

However, the posts I have an issue with are things that have sources that are always "insider information", and they make claims far beyond that- "Chain X definitely is coming", "my sources point to yes", "this will come to fruition", etc. If I claimed that something would definitely happen, but then it didn't, I wouldn't consider my claim correct, regardless of the reason why the item didn't happen. Some stores have indeed come to Magnolia Park, but just nothing like the ones the other poster promised were coming.

Edited December 6, 2010 by mallguy

[Greenville]

However, the posts I have an issue with are things that have sources that are always "insider information", and they make claims far beyond that- "Chain X definitely is coming", "my sources point to yes", "this will come to fruition", etc. If I claimed that something would definitely happen, but then it didn't, I wouldn't consider my claim correct, regardless of the reason why the item didn't happen. Some stores have indeed come to Magnolia Park, but just nothing like the ones the other poster promised were coming.

We can all agree with your last statement. I still think the problem was that Magnolia Park didn't get built as promised - not that those retailers weren't truly interested in being in Greenville. Most of the rumored retailers/restaurants have either located in Greenville already, are in the process of doing so, or plan to do so once the economy improves some.

[mallguy]

We can all agree with your last statement. I still think the problem was that Magnolia Park didn't get built as promised - not that those retailers weren't truly interested in being in Greenville. Most of the rumored retailers/restaurants have either located in Greenville already, are in the process of doing so, or plan to do so once the economy improves some.

Thanks- and great news. I agree with you. All of those stores are definitely stores that Greenville can get, so I look forward to hopefully seeing them in town soon!

[gs3]

I don't see why you have such an axe to grind. From what I recall several years ago, and from what has been re-posted here, the information gsupstate posted was accurate. It did not assure that those stores would be at Magnolia Park Town Center, but it did state that those retailers were in negotiations with Menin. That was "insider info," and it was true. That was, of course, based on Magnolia Park Town Center actually being built as Menin promised it would be. It wasn't, so the retailers looked elsewhere. What's so difficult to understand about that?

Yep.

[mallguy]

Breaking news: Von Maur is definitely coming to Haywood Mall. This will definitely come to fruition. It will definitely happen. My sources say yes. It's based on information that I learned from some sources who I know.

ETA: No caveats such as "although discussions are ongoing, there has not been a lease signed", "economic conditions could derail this", "Simon could always back out at the last minute", etc., since gsupstate's posts that I pointed out did not have caveats.

(If gsupstate's posts were correct, then this one is; I am taking knowledge that I have learned and am using gsupstate's exact words.)

Edited December 14, 2010 by mallguy

[gman430]

Breaking news: Von Maur is definitely coming to Haywood Mall. This will definitely come to fruition. It will definitely happen. My sources say yes. It's based on information that I learned from some sources who I know.

ETA: No caveats such as "although discussions are ongoing, there has not been a lease signed", "economic conditions could derail this", "Simon could always back out at the last minute", etc., since gsupstate's posts that I pointed out did not have caveats.

(If gsupstate's posts were correct, then this one is; I am taking knowledge that I have learned and am using gsupstate's exact words.)

What part of Haywood Mall are they going to? Is Sears finally leaving?

Edited December 14, 2010 by citylife

[mallguy]

What part of Haywood Mall are they going to? Is Sears finally leaving?

None.

There was an article in the Atlanta Journal-Constitution stating that Von Maur is thinking about expanding to the Carolinas (which I'd think would mean stores in cities along I-85, and where else in town would Von Maur go other than Haywood), which one of my real estate industry friends confirmed.

However, my post just used gsupstate's language of "this is definitely going to happen", period, when it's actually not definite, to prove a point.

Edited December 14, 2010 by mallguy

[Greenville]

None.

There was an article in the Atlanta Journal-Constitution stating that Von Maur is thinking about expanding to the Carolinas (which I'd think would mean stores in cities along I-85, and where else in town would Von Maur go other than Haywood), which one of my real estate industry friends confirmed.

However, my post just used gsupstate's language of "this is definitely going to happen", period, when it's actually not definite, to prove a point.

Do you work in the industry? Because gsupstate does. In fact, he was involved with the Magnolia Park Town Center project at one time. I have no reason to doubt that the info he posted was definite at the time he posted it. Things can obviously change, and they did. That doesn't make the information he posted inaccurate at that time.

I still don't understand why this is such a personal thing with you.

[mallguy]

Do you work in the industry? Because gsupstate does. In fact, he was involved with the Magnolia Park Town Center project at one time. I have no reason to doubt that the info he posted was definite at the time he posted it. Things can obviously change, and they did. That doesn't make the information he posted inaccurate at that time.

I still don't understand why this is such a personal thing with you.

I did commercial mortgage-backed securitizations for years, public securities reporting for one of gsupstate's former employers (a retain chain) and I am a real estate investor.

His posts in question did not speak to a specific time- they said that stores were "definitely coming" and "will come to fruition"- no ifs, ands or buts.

If he'd said, "as of now, it seems that stores X, Y and Z plan to come", "discussions are ongoing, and it looks like they'll result in a store locating here", or "as long as this project happens, the stores will come", that would have been fine, but he didn't say that.

Also, if the information that'd he posted about his former employer hadn't been flatly contradicted by what senior executives of the company reported to investors, I would have less of a reason to doubt him.

Not personal here, but gsupstate started up yet again with that post a few posts above.

Edited December 14, 2010 by mallguy

[greenvilleguy]

Will someone wake me up when this pissing match is over and someone has some REAL information about Haywood Mall?...since that is the topic of this forum. I couldn't care less if you two have a problem with each other but I'm personally tired of reading about it.

[mallguy]

Will someone wake me up when this pissing match is over and someone has some REAL information about Haywood Mall?...since that is the topic of this forum. I couldn't care less if you two have a problem with each other but I'm personally tired of reading about it.

Absolutely. Agreed, and I am tired of it as well.

No definite information about developments at Haywood here-I was curious so I looked through Simon's 10-Ks, 10-Qs and other reports and there have been no developments on the landlord's end that are material enough to report to investors.

[gs3]

Will someone wake me up when this pissing match is over and someone has some REAL information about Haywood Mall?...since that is the topic of this forum. I couldn't care less if you two have a problem with each other but I'm personally tired of reading about it.

Most of this "pissing match" was about MPTC not Haywood, so it should not even be in this thread. Maybe moderators can move.

Breaking news: Von Maur is definitely coming to Haywood Mall. This will definitely come to fruition. It will definitely happen. My sources say yes. It's based on information that I learned from some sources who I know.

ETA: No caveats such as "although discussions are ongoing, there has not been a lease signed", "economic conditions could derail this", "Simon could always back out at the last minute", etc., since gsupstate's posts that I pointed out did not have caveats.

(If gsupstate's posts were correct, then this one is; I am taking knowledge that I have learned and am using gsupstate's exact words.)

^ A pure flame post. Sad.

Back to Haywood.

[gs3]

Do you work in the industry? Because gsupstate does. In fact, he was involved with the Magnolia Park Town Center project at one time. I have no reason to doubt that the info he posted was definite at the time he posted it. Things can obviously change, and they did. That doesn't make the information he posted inaccurate at that time.

I still don't understand why this is such a personal thing with you.

I don't understand either, but I guess maybe I should be flattered that someone is so infatuated with me and my knowledge of Haywood and Greenville area retail?

Ignore button is now on.

[greenvilleguy]

OMG! Let it go! No one is "infatuated" with anyone. If your posts were at all accurate I would be shopping at Magnolia Park right now instead of looking at the big pile of dirt in the middle. Actually, I agreed with most of mallguy's posts until his last rant. Bottom line is if you don't know it AND can't show it on paper, DON'T SAY IT! I feel like I'm baby sitting except not getting paid...

Edited December 15, 2010 by greenvilleguy

[gman430]

Fight, fight, fight.

[gs3]

OMG! Let it go! No one is "infatuated" with anyone. If your posts were at all accurate I would be shopping at Magnolia Park right now instead of looking at the big pile of dirt in the middle. Actually, I agreed with most of mallguy's posts until his last rant. Bottom line is if you don't know it AND can't show it on paper, DON'T SAY IT! I feel like I'm baby sitting except not getting paid...

No. Lets get this VERY staight. My post were accurate that these people were in negotiations and many have now shown up elsewhere in GV. You would be shopping at MPTC if it had gotten built, which had nothing to do with who was in negotiations or my post. UNDERSTAND???????? AND, if you don't like my post.....don't read them. There is an easy ignore button.

Edited December 16, 2010 by gsupstate

[goodbye]

...I have no reason to doubt that the info he posted was definite at the time he posted it. Things can obviously change, and they did. That doesn't make the information he posted inaccurate at that time.

I don't understand why anyone reading an online forum like this would accept the information in every post as absolute fact. Most of the posts may be accurate, but since very few (if any) members here actually know who is writing what and why behind any given name, it is always safe to compare inside information and rumors similarly. I don't doubt the claims of everyone posting "inside information," but since we have only their words posted in an open online forum and nothing else, I can only hope they are trustworthy and realize that even if true at that moment, their information is subject to unforeseen limitations.

[Neo]

Ding, ding, ding. Calm down guys!

[mallguy]

Let's move on from this; I think that from the perspective of a reader, we can all agree that posts stating that discussions are happening at a particular time can be useful, and of course things change. However, as a poster, one needs to be careful not to overpromise, since when things that are just rumors or are just information about discussions that are happening at a particular time are hyped as outcomes and results that are set in stone and will definitely occur, it's misleading and reduces the utility of the board.

Greenvilleguy, my apologies as my rant about Von Maur was out of line. I appreciate your pointing that out.

Someone (maybe me) should create a master thread of links to commercial real estate publications (such as Southeast Real Estate Business, Shopping Center Business, etc.) and links to 8-Ks on the SEC website, since those sources are generally very reliable and can provide great sources of news; at least SEC materials aren't just rumors.

Back to Haywood...

[gman430]

Pino Gelato opening in March. I don't know where in the mall it will be located but I would guess either the food court or old Panera space.

Edited January 5, 2011 by citylife

[gman430]

It looks like Gifts By Sarah has closed. Not suprising seeing how it was only a temporary holiday store. Hopefully J. Crew expands into it or another high-end national retail tenant replaces it.

Also, I noticed Pottery Barn is closing several stores throughout the country including Nashville and Sacramento. Hopefully ours isn't on the chopping block. I doubt it is.

Edited January 6, 2011 by citylife

[chastogville]

It looks like Gifts By Sarah has closed. Not suprising seeing how it was only a temporary holiday store. Hopefully J. Crew expands into it or another high-end national retail tenant replaces it.

Also, I noticed Pottery Barn is closing several stores throughout the country including Nashville and Sacramento. Hopefully ours isn't on the chopping block. I doubt it is.

Our PB is not going anywhere... Sacramento is closing because of multiple stores in market and Nashville had no intention on closing, but rent went up. They will reopen in couple of years when lifestyle is built adjacent to greenhills mall.

[gman430]

Thanks for the info chastogville. Oh and opening in February: http://www.lovesac.com/ Another first for South Carolina.

Edited January 19, 2011 by citylife

[gs3]

Thanks for the info chastogville. Oh and opening in February: http://www.lovesac.com/ Another first for South Carolina.

Great addition as Haywood continues to evolve. Lovesac is mainly in upper end malls....Lenox, Mayfair, Garden State Plaza, King of Prussia, Dallas Galleria, Houston Galleria, Scottsdale Fashion Square.....nice company for Haywood to be keeping.

[StrangeCock]

Whoa...I saw the name "lovesac" and was picturing an entirely different kind of retailer.