EASTRANS

[AmericanUrbanDesigner]

Wow that's extraordinary. Are you associated at all with Knightdale? How long have you been in Charlotte? Have you had your hands in any other such projects?

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Thank you Norff. No, not all associated with K'dale anymore...at the time I was a political novice and Eastrans ruffled too many feathers. I recruited supporters for the project, from NCRR and NS to other local jurisdictions along the route. I got the project money for additional study, but at that point I lost my fight to continue leading Eastrans and was asked to leave. That was 2 years ago.

Other projects? Yep, I did a project back in 1996 for Hillsborough Street. The plan was in the N&O and on WRAL and then was "taken over" by the State DOT and City for "further study". My plan added traffic circles (only 2...one, at Pullen/Oberlin and Hillsborough - the entrance to NCSU; and another other, at Fairview/Gorman and Hillsborough - a new entrance to Meredith College). The plan also realigned Oberlin and Pullen Roads (to go behind Darryls) and turned the abandoned portion of Oberlin in front of Darryls to a pedestrian zone. The original plan restored Morgan Street to two-way movement and changed it's interface with Hillsborough Street to a "T" intersection with signal. Finally, the original plan would have restored street car service to Hillsborough Street from the Capitol to the Meredith College.

The original goal of the proposal was not to facilitate vehicular traffic specifically (the state has already improved Western Boulevard to facilitate the movement of cars into and out of the center and Wade Avenue also serves this puropse. As you know both Western and Wade parallel Hillsborough.) The original goal was to create for NC an historic, ceremonial boulevard, and to reduce the need for cars along the route by making the street more pedestrian friendly. The two traffic circles - not the most efficient for cars (but that wasn't the point) would serve as "exclamation points" and gateways.

The state and city's plan added 13(?) roundabouts but none of the other components.

Thank you for asking, Norff.

[ChiefJoJo]

Yep, I did a project back in 1996 for Hillsborough Street. The plan was in the N&O and on WRAL and then was "taken over" by the State DOT and City for "further study". My plan added traffic circles (only 2...one, at Pullen/Oberlin and Hillsborough - the entrance to NCSU; and another other, at Fairview/Gorman and Hillsborough - a new entrance to Meredith College). The plan also realigned Oberlin and Pullen Roads (to go behind Darryls) and turned the abandoned portion of Oberlin in front of Darryls to a pedestrian zone. The original plan restored Morgan Street to two-way movement and changed it's interface with Hillsborough Street to a "T" intersection with signal. Finally, the original plan would have restored street car service to Hillsborough Street from the Capitol to the Meredith College.

The original goal of the proposal was not to facilitate vehicular traffic specifically (the state has already improved Western Boulevard to facilitate the movement of cars into and out of the center and Wade Avenue also serves this puropse. As you know both Western and Wade parallel Hillsborough.) The original goal was to create for NC an historic, ceremonial boulevard, and to reduce the need for cars along the route by making the street more pedestrian friendly. The two traffic circles - not the most efficient for cars (but that wasn't the point) would serve as "exclamation points" and gateways.

I am familiar with that plan--well that is the one that exists today, including all the various roundabouts and utility work. I didn't know about the idea for reinsituting streetcar service (that used to exist WAY back in the 20s I think). GREAT IDEA. I applaud the work you have done, and i know how frustrating working with/in govt came be.

I'd like to see this streetcar idea (or something similar) incorporated along Glenwood Avenue and perhaps Six Forks/Wake Forest Rd. They could run along the existing corridors and connect Crabtree, Five Pts, and Glenwood South, along with N. Hills, and the Six Forks/WF Rd "node" and back DT. These would really tie in some big commercial centers in N and NW Raleigh to TTA and DT Raleigh.

[AmericanUrbanDesigner]

If you receive the N&O (7-days a week) you can do a search for "Hillsborough Street" and articles from 1996 - 1997. You see the plan there...

[AmericanUrbanDesigner]

EASTRANS...

The idea is to use existing rail corridors into Raleigh from Selma and Wilson to support and to encourage economic/residential development in the old (and often forgotten) railroad towns along these corridors...essentially, reviving life into the towns along the corridors.. (One corridor, to Selma, has already been improved by NCRR, Inc. to accomodate commuter, Amtrak, and freight trains between Raleigh and Selma).

The "Eastrans" corridors create an "arc" and run from Wilson to Raleigh to Selma.

The lines would have stops in historic "railroad" towns like Garner, Knightdale, Zebulon, Wendell, Wilson, and Selma bringing workers directly to Raleigh's Wake Medical Center, the NC Government Center and connect directly to TTA (Triangle Transit Authority) trains in central Raleigh for rail service to NC State University, Raleigh-Durham International Airport, the Research Triangle, Durham, Duke University, and eventually, Chapel Hill and the University of North Carolina.

The best part? No federal $ would be required for Eastrans. The whole project could get off the ground with local and state "discretionary" funds.

I'll be giving y'aw more when I get my files from my office....maps, summaries, findings, etc...

[JunktionFET]

Here's the map I ripped from the PDF on the Knightdale city website

[rooster8]

In the short term, I could see a justification for going out to Zebulon on the north side and Clayton on the south, but Wilson and Goldsboro would probably have to wait.

[urbanvb]

Here's the map I ripped from the PDF on the Knightdale city website

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How in the heck did you rip that off? I have tried a few times to cut , copy etc from a pdf but never would work.

[orulz]

How in the heck did you rip that off? I have tried a few times to cut , copy etc from a pdf but never would work.

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Method 1: Take a screenshot (printscreen) and then trim it down in Photoshop, etc.

Method 2: Open it up in Adobe Illustrator. That program does a great job at parsing both the raster and vector data of postscript-based files (including PDF).

[Jerseyman4]

EASTRANS should look into expanding the Raleigh-Goldsboro line eastward towards Kinston. It could likely spur economic growth to the Global Transpark area (and downtown Kinston).

[urbanvb]

Method 1: Take a screenshot (printscreen) and then trim it down in Photoshop, etc.

Method 2: Open it up in Adobe Illustrator. That program does a great job at parsing both the raster and vector data of postscript-based files (including PDF).

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Great. I saved this for later. Thanks for your help.

[atlrvr]

Am I the only one still thinking that discretionary funds in the eastern part of NC are sorely misused......TransPark????? Some of the bridges there???

While I don't think we should sit by and watch smaller cities die, it's time we develop a feasible economic strategy rather than throwing big dollars at pie in the sky projects such as this.

[orulz]

EASTRANS should look into expanding the Raleigh-Goldsboro line eastward towards Kinston. It could likely spur economic growth to the Global Transpark area (and downtown Kinston).

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Once you go past Goldsboro (or, arguably, once you go past Selma) population density drops off to a point where it ceases to be a commuter line and becomes an intercity line. While that is certainly not a bad thing, and commuter/intercity trains could provide complimentary service on the same line, that's outside the scope of the Eastrans project.

The NCRR has recently begun is already carrying out some upgrades between Raleigh and Pine Level (2 miles east of Selma) including sidings and CTC signals, allowing for 80mph operation. That would be great for Eastrans, but everywhere east of Pine Level is a 50mph, unsignalized line. While installing signals and sidings for the 20 miles between Pine Level and Goldsboro wouldn't break the bank, going to Kinston would more than double the required infrastructure investment.

That being said, it'd certainly be reasonable to see a Raleigh-Kinston train running some day. The corridor is state-owned after all. While you're at it, why not fully utilize the NCRR and run trains through New Bern and Havelock all the way to Morehead City? With limited stops and an average speed of 70mph (including stops - this track is straight as an arrow!) the trip could be made in roughly 2 hours. Compared to the Wilmington route, this would be a political walk in the park because (1) only one possible route exists so no controversy and no "imbys", (2) the corridor is state-owned, and (3) Norfolk Southern is already used to dealing with NCDOT.

[orulz]

Just found this image:

This is a rendering of what Union Station in Goldsboro would look like if it were restored. The rendering is taken from the Eastern North Carolina Railroad Alliance webpage.

Goldsboro Union Station would be the terminal for Eastrans on the NCRR, and a stop on the Raleigh-Wilmington intercity line, if either of those proposals ever gets off the ground.

[sax184]

Question for American Urban Designer: do you have a ballpark figure on what it cost Knightdale et al to do the study? I'm thinking that one of the ways to get more such projects on the horizon is, well, more studies.

[AmericanUrbanDesigner]

Question for American Urban Designer: do you have a ballpark figure on what it cost Knightdale et al to do the study?  I'm thinking that one of the ways to get more such projects on the horizon is, well, more studies.

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No MORE STUDIES!!!!!

The study cost the Town about 75K in 2003. N/S and NCRR data showed that the costs were excellent inspite of initial ridership. The goal was to grow ridership...it wasn't based on existing demand. The goal was fashion zoning and building regulations to focus development in and adjacent to, existing, historic, town centers along the rail corridors to attract commuters to downtown Raleigh.

[urbanesq]

In the short term, I could see a justification for going out to Zebulon on the north side and Clayton on the south, but Wilson and Goldsboro would probably have to wait.

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I dunno. There are two people in our downtown Raleigh office who commute in from Wilson every day. It would seem the lack of jobs and affordability of housing in these cities make them commuter suburbs, even though they're an hour away. I think it's a great idea, and could be part of an overall strategy to restore economic vitality to the eastern past of the state while increasing mobility options into Raleigh.

[ChiefJoJo]

As a part of the SENC Passenger rail study--see first bullet item, the NCDOT Rail Division has said that the most likely trial for a commuter rail project will be the Selma to Raleigh corridor. Apparently, this can be done within a relatively short amount of time and reasonable amount of money--say 3 years of design/implementation and less than $80 million--once the funding could become available. Very promising for rail in NC!

[orulz]

A big reason why Raleigh-Selma commuter service could happen easily and quickly is that NCRR is already working on upgrades to the corridor. This press release says that they're already in the process of building three new sidings and adding CTC, which will allow for 80mph passenger trains. I might already have posted that link somewhere, but oh well.

Another thing on the NCRR between Raleigh and Selma that just bothers me is the old, single-track, open deck bridge over South Street. I'm hoping that they replace it when South and Lenoir are converted to 2-way traffic in the 2nd phase of the Fayetteville Street Renaissance. A new bridge there should be wide enough for two tracks - like the ones over Dawson/Lenoir, Mcdowell, and Martin Luther King. That could increase the capacity in the wye area by quite a bit. It would also eliminate the choke point in South Street - which is not a problem for one-way traffic, but might be an issue after the two-way conversion.