The Plaza

[JRS1]

I don't like the term fanboi b/c it carries with it a connotation that being positive about an issue is naively [sic] abnormal or ignorant in light of facts.

I said it once and I'll say it again... the glass can be half empty, but it can also be half full. I prefer the later point of view, and there is nothing wrong with that.

you can be like the media, or you can see the positive in every situation.

now, I spoke with some more individuals related to the auction on 3/1/08 and the Wood Partners people were 1) pleased that they sold 30 units; 2) for the most part pleased at the prices they sold for. Units for $170 went for over $220; units at $250 went in the mid-300's or above. Those units went for comparable amounts that the first cropping of buyers paid in 2005. 30 units just left the market.

I don't see what's negative about that.

And as far as the "product" Orlando has downtown... I say bullsh*t that it's not a good product demanding high prices. Are you kidding me? Newsflash: the neighborhoods to the north, east, and south are awesome neighborhoods. Commuting has been taken out of the equation. Lake Eola Park is one of the better downtown parks for a similar-sized city in the country. Since when has downtown not been a desireable place to live? I'm in downtown every day and every one of my out-of-town guests that comes here (from places like Chicago & NYC) is impressed with downtown. I'm not saying it's the best in the world, only, that it's pretty darn nice.

So, I see the need for some of these upper end units-- maybe not as many as the developers expected, but many nevertheless. There's a good vibe here; I go to many of the social downtown functions here and see what's going on at the individual level and it is good.

...and that's my >$.02 on that.

[orlandonative]

Solaire auction: What do you expect the auction group to say, "Damn we made mad loot"? Woods Group kept a dozen to put on the MLS- leads me to believe that they still think they can sell.

There is a huge market for affordable units downtown, we know that. Unfortunately the margins on a 450 unit building ranging from $150k-400k are almost nill because almost everyones ripping a profit.

Since material escalation shows no signs of stopping and land values are holding the only way we can pursue affordable units downtown is by building higher. Breaking News: The Verde and TT would be halfway u/c if it was the same number of units were contained in one tall a$s tower, the money was and is there. The height limitations will become an issue within the next 5 years.

[neon9]

you can be like the media, or you can see the positive in every situation.

The media sees a story, which enables it to make a profit. When the positive was what we were buying, the Sentinel was all too willing to sell. You'll find just as many negative articles in the WEEKLY paper as in the daily about Pearlman, Kuhn and the 'venues deal'. If not more.

The Sentinel endorsed the 'Venues deal', amendment #1, and didn't have much negative to say about Pearlman or Kuhn (until recently at least).

Sorry, perhaps this reminds me a bit too much of how people cry about the 'liberal media' when they don't like the story of the day.

It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his job depends on not understanding it.

Upton Sinclair

I wish I could agree that the 'commute has been taken out of the equation' but I think it's a little early....at least wait until the Publix is done

[Camillo Sitte]

Solaire auction: What do you expect the auction group to say, "Damn we made mad loot"? Woods Group kept a dozen to put on the MLS- leads me to believe that they still think they can sell.

There is a huge market for affordable units downtown, we know that. Unfortunately the margins on a 450 unit building ranging from $150k-400k are almost nill because almost everyones ripping a profit.

Since material escalation shows no signs of stopping and land values are holding the only way we can pursue affordable units downtown is by building higher. Breaking News: The Verde and TT would be halfway u/c if it was the same number of units were contained in one tall a$s tower, the money was and is there. The height limitations will become an issue within the next 5 years.

All of which, were one being honest and looked through

[orlandonative]

Just be clear that my post had nothing to do with you nor was it directed in such manner. When it comes down to the realities of whats going on, I am and have always been overly skeptical of projects. Please dont ever mistake my outlook, im in the business, everyday that I have stepped into my office for the last year its been a gut check.

I would encourage you to continue to post, if it comes off brash to some folks, than f*ck em, thats life.

[Camillo Sitte]

Just be clear that my post had nothing to do with you nor was it directed in such manner. When it comes down to the realities of whats going on, I am and have always been overly skeptical of projects. Please dont ever mistake my outlook, im in the business, everyday that I have stepped into my office for the last year its been a gut check.

I would encourage you to continue to post, if it comes off brash to some folks, than f*ck em, thats life.

Looking at it now it does seem like my entire post was in response to yours - it was not, just the first, fourth, and fifth paras.

The rest was a meant as a post-in-general.

As for gut checks, I don't consider a project to be really "real" until I am swept up in the shotgun approach to post occupancy lawsuits because some structural engineer or glazing sub didn't do his job properly...

Edited March 4, 2008 by Camillo Sitte

[FLKP]

I have heard the name "Macys" mentioned several times. A reduced Urban version as in Honolulu. Any one else hear this?

[Cleaver5]

The guy at the auction told me that the movie theater is set to open memorial day...anyone else hear this? He said that he has been in there and that buildout continues in the nighttime. He also said that tenants such as Coldstone and NYPD Pizza are waiting to open until the theater opens. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

[FLKP]

BURRITO Place seems ready to open.

I love Bento

[spenser1058]

I have heard the name "Macys" mentioned several times. A reduced Urban version as in Honolulu. Any one else hear this?

Macy's of late has been closing some of their urban stores (I am thinking of the Lazarus stores closing in downtown Columbus, Cincinnati and Pittsburgh for example, and there has been talk even the State St. former Marshall Field flagship in Chicago may not be long for this world), and given Macy's precarious finances of late, I would be quite surprised if it happened. Having said that, I sooooo wish that I am totally wrong. :

[orlandonative]

The guy at the auction told me that the movie theater is set to open memorial day...anyone else hear this? He said that he has been in there and that buildout continues in the nighttime. He also said that tenants such as Coldstone and NYPD Pizza are waiting to open until the theater opens. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Makes since, NYPD can continue to make money in their curent location, and we'll coldstone- whats the harm in waiting until Memorial Day. I'm sure that they, like us would like to see the theater come to fruition before they get fully invested.

As for Bento: mehh. I wasn't impressed. The meat was good but other than that it was blah. Looks awesome inside though.

[codypet]

Makes since, NYPD can continue to make money in their curent location, and we'll coldstone- whats the harm in waiting until Memorial Day. I'm sure that they, like us would like to see the theater come to fruition before they get fully invested.

As for Bento: mehh. I wasn't impressed. The meat was good but other than that it was blah. Looks awesome inside though.

Where is NYPD? I thought it had been closed for years! The only one I know of is in Metrowest.

[orlandonative]

Oh snap, good catch. I believe that I might have been thinking of Midnight Pizza.

Bento still sucks though.

[jack]

Cool Blue Burrito opens Friday.

[JRS1]

Hey look, there is no denying that you guys have been successful in chasing off the boards just about everyone else that doesn

Edited March 5, 2008 by JRS1

[Camillo Sitte]

not that you're talking about me specifically, but I want to remind you that we might have had a tift or two a few years back, but I also defended you a short while back when some members were coming down on you.

my only point ever in being positive is that I remember who's on these boards and who has visited them in the past. b/c of that, I don't dwell on the negative b/c I believe it ultimately can affect the local market depending on who reads these things. and I don't want to spread negative sentiments for that reason-- only, not b/c I'm a cheerleader and ORL is my team. it's as simple as that. it's like siblings fighting in public and outsiders gossiping on how whacked their house is. there's a fine line that needs to be heeded when discussing neg. info, b/c repeating it does ultimately affect things to an extent (which is good news for UP b/c it means people read this stuff and more advertisers advertise).

in a nutshell. ps, we want to be informed... of course... but that fine line I think needs to be... you know what I'm trying to say.

OK - a couple of things:

[1] I just don't see my posts as "negative"; less than enthusiastic sometimes, coolly realistic, sure - but negative - no.

[2] I don't care who or how many people here have and express what I might see as hyperbolic or overly optimistic opinions; people can post what ever they want, I am arguing against censorship thru intimidation. But I get really bored with people who, instead of using facts rather than what they

[orlandonative]

I'm not our moderator, but I suggest for the sake of the good vibes i'm feeling that you guys please SHUT THE F*CK UP!

I'm playing, seriously its good discussion lets just keep it cool.

Anyone check out Corona yet? Are they open tonight? Or was it a temp. opening last week? I wouldn't mind smoking a blunt this evening

[i_cre8]

I'm not our moderator, but I suggest for the sake of the good vibes i'm feeling that you guys please SHUT THE F*CK UP!

I'm playing, seriously its good discussion lets just keep it cool.

Anyone check out Corona yet? Are they open tonight? Or was it a temp. opening last week? I wouldn't mind smoking a blunt this evening

Thanks, O'native!

A blunt... mmmm.

[DowntownDarryl]

I'm not our moderator, but I suggest for the sake of the good vibes i'm feeling that you guys please SHUT THE F*CK UP!

I'm playing, seriously its good discussion lets just keep it cool.

Anyone check out Corona yet? Are they open tonight? Or was it a temp. opening last week? I wouldn't mind smoking a blunt this evening

Corona is open, Definitely reminds me of Mexico Pavillion in Epcot. Very cool addition to The Plaza.

[surina777]

went to corona last weekend...definitely a nice place, love being able to sit outside and having plenty of outdoor seating vs there other locales, great people watching spot!

[JRS1]

I was Corona's first paying customer on Sunday afternoon (or last Sunday afternoon when that festival at Eola was going on). Had a Mojito [sic] at the bar. They will open officially in a month when they're able to serve food-- Cuban sandwiches and the like.

Great place... manager is cool; owner is cool; bar maids are hot... the other night, there were more people there than at Urban Flats... werd is getting around... great smell in the elevator shafts of the north tower too. great vibe... it's all about the vibe...

[orlandonative]

I agree there seems to be a really good energy at the ground level of this building.

[frankieb96]

I agree there seems to be a really good energy at the ground level of this building.

big +1 on that. . .thats exactly what i said last saturday just looking around in general.

[JRS1]

big +1 on that. . .thats exactly what i said last saturday just looking around in general.

and I've noticed that peds are increasingly favoring cutting thru the center between the Two Towers (Lord of the Rings reference ala Clerks II) by Bento when coming down Pine St. instead of staying on the sidewalk on Pine.

[FLheat]

and I've noticed that peds are increasingly favoring cutting thru the center between the Two Towers (Lord of the Rings reference ala Clerks II) by Bento when coming down Pine St. instead of staying on the sidewalk on Pine.

Yeah, I use that, but they could have designed it to be more inviting. Right now it has a back alley feel especially on the warm days when the dumpsters nearby ferment.