The Plaza

[bulldogger]

I am pretty sure I heard this correctly from Marty Salt on Channel 9 that the Solaire auction prices just took a dive down to $100,000 starting bids. Can anyone verify? That's a big difference from 170k.

[Dale]

I'm just astonished at how soft the downtown market for highrise would up being, with over half the proposals shelved, and even the bellweather projects sucking wind.

[DowntownDarryl]

I am pretty sure I heard this correctly from Marty Salt on Channel 9 that the Solaire auction prices just took a dive down to $100,000 starting bids. Can anyone verify? That's a big difference from 170k.

I was told, nothing has changed, minimum bid is still 170k.

[Camillo Sitte]

I'm just astonished at how soft the downtown market for highrise would up being, with over half the proposals shelved, and even the bellweather projects sucking wind.

Why?

Look at an areal photo of downtown Orlando. Half the land area in downtown is still either surface-level parking or vacant land.

Orlando [city and metro] has a relatively low population density for a major metropolitan area and the median household income is only $43,900.

It is still quite easy to find decent 3/2 single family homes in "good" neighborhoods in the $250,000-$300,000 range within a 1-2 mile radius of downtown.

Just what about the above conditions would suggest there was/is a large market in downtown Orlando for a couple thousand new $400-$500/sf condos; a cigar bar and the promise of a downtown theater maybe

[bic]

It might come as a shock to some of the more ardent fan bois but as nice as Orlando is, there just isn

[FrigginGr8est]

Why?

Look at an areal photo of downtown Orlando. Half the land area in downtown is still either surface-level parking or vacant land.

Orlando [city and metro] has a relatively low population density for a major metropolitan area and the median household income is only $43,900.

It is still quite easy to find decent 3/2 single family homes in "good" neighborhoods in the $250,000-$300,000 range within a 1-2 mile radius of downtown.

Just what about the above conditions would suggest there was/is a large market in downtown Orlando for a couple thousand new $400-$500/sf condos; a cigar bar and the promise of a downtown theater maybe

[Dale]

Why?

Look at an areal photo of downtown Orlando. Half the land area in downtown is still either surface-level parking or vacant land.

Orlando [city and metro] has a relatively low population density for a major metropolitan area and the median household income is only $43,900.

It is still quite easy to find decent 3/2 single family homes in "good" neighborhoods in the $250,000-$300,000 range within a 1-2 mile radius of downtown.

Just what about the above conditions would suggest there was/is a large market in downtown Orlando for a couple thousand new $400-$500/sf condos; a cigar bar and the promise of a downtown theater maybe

[Camillo Sitte]

I've now become a 'fanboi' because I note that even the bellweather projects of this historic boom are sucking wind ?

No wonder they don't invite you to the parties anymore.

I've now become a 'fanboi' because I note that even the bellweather projects of this historic boom are sucking wind ?

No wonder they don't invite you to the parties anymore.

You must have either a guilty conscience or a persecution complex because I never said nor suggested that you were a "fanboi". In fact, when I wrote that I wasn't even thinking of anyone on the board specifically, just anyone "out there" in general who thinks that Orlando can somehow magically suspend the laws of economics and development demographics.

So

[spenser1058]

You must have either a guilty conscience or a persecution complex because I never said nor suggested that you were a "fanboi". In fact, when I wrote that I wasn't even thinking of anyone on the board specifically, just anyone "out there" in general who thinks that Orlando can somehow magically suspend the laws of economics and development demographics.

So

[Dale]

You must have either a guilty conscience or a persecution complex because I never said nor suggested that you were a "fanboi". In fact, when I wrote that I wasn't even thinking of anyone on the board specifically, just anyone "out there" in general who thinks that Orlando can somehow magically suspend the laws of economics and development demographics.

So

[Camillo Sitte]

No apology forthcoming, inasmuch as I'm fairly intuitive ... and because I rankle at the fey term 'fanboi.'

No prob - I knew you wouldn't sack up, that takes character...

[spenser1058]

No apology forthcoming, inasmuch as I'm fairly intuitive ... and because I rankle at the fey term 'fanboi.'

'fanboi' - not that there's anything wrong with that (with apologies to Seinfeld)

[downtowninvestor]

was the auction on sat?...how did it go?

[Whipp]

this is like watching frasier and niles crane get thrown into a free for all mud wrestling match.

[pip]

was the auction on sat?...how did it go?

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/custom...0,4882325.story

[JRS1]

30 units sold. bidders had to fork over $5k to bid. if they won a unit, they had to shell out something like $10k more while there. closing in 30 days. only serious bidders with resale or rent restrictions. bankers were there; realtors were there; everybody was there...

so, 30 new residable units just entered service in the CBD and were taken off the market. a couple of my friends bought on Saturday.

a success. so much for the downturn, b/c the prices they paid were comparable to the prices those units had way at the beginning of Solaire's life, so, early purchasers really didn't lose anything value wise compared to these new residents.

so, Solaire now will have like 240 resided units... not a bad percentage.

Edited March 3, 2008 by JRS1

[orlandonative]

Your right Camillo, anyone with a brain saw what was going to happen, thats why we got in early. At 27 the building in which the thread is titled did me very well.

My best year financially in the construction business was 2007. I'm projecting a 18% increase in 2008, that'l work. It's called staying diversified (one thing that Orlando is very good at as of late).

BTW we are already seeing design concepts for buildings planned for the next boom. Now that we know where the facilities (Arena, PAC, Rail, etc.) are going to be located the initiative is to exploit, for a lack of better term, those plots within close proximity.

Edited March 3, 2008 by orlandonative

[Go Gators]

No prob - I knew you wouldn't sack up, that takes character...

lol at the irony.

[Camillo Sitte]

lol at the irony.

I would suggest you look up the definition of 'irony' - seriously.

Where in my original post did I show a 'lack-of-character'?

In that post I did not mention or discuss in personal terms any person on this board - just the issues. The only way in which you should feel slighted is if you think of yourself, your being as it were, as in fact a "fan bois", in general.

But if that is the case then I suppose that we can no longer discuss democrats, republicans, teachers, or any other general group of people.

I have never responded to an individual here except to call them on their having first made a personal attack upon me.

That my thoughts and opinions may clash with others here does not show a lack of character on my part, just a mind unencumbered by groupthink.

As for the topic, the units that sold in fact went for a good deal less than expected

Edited March 3, 2008 by Camillo Sitte

[Go Gators]

^ You indirectly attacked people on this board by using "fanboi" generally. Just because you didnt call someone out by name doesnt mean you didnt do it. That term would apply to many on this board, even though you didnt call them out...directly.

And to say you dont attack anyone personally after saying Dale wont because it takes character. Well, you see the hypocrisy.

Im not going to go into a big debate into it like you would like me to get drawn into it. You've already convinced yourself that you're right. And I couldnt tell you that the sun was shining right now (which it is, here's proof: http://www.wesh.com/wxcam/1472282/detail.html ) if you told yourself it wasnt.

Edited March 3, 2008 by Go Gators

[Camillo Sitte]

You indirectly attacked people on this board by using "fanboi" generally. Just because you didnt call someone out by name doesnt mean you didnt do it. That term would apply to many on this board, even though you didnt call them out...directly.

So, like I said, we can no longer then discuss democrats, republican, teachers, [or one assumes] Florida alumns - because, wait for it, some on the boards might also be democrats, republicans, teachers, or Florida alumns.

And to say you dont attack anyone personally after saying Dale wont because it takes character. Well, you see the hypocrisy.

There is no hypocrisy. My statements are perfectly consistent.

Go back and read what I wrote. I wrote that I never respond personally until someone has first done so to me. The person in question accused me of attacking him personally where no such attack existed.

This person then responded that he would issue no apology because his "intuition" [the unknown subject of which he seems to want to dance around] told him I didn't deserve one, basically because of my character - to which I did then respond personally - which is completely consistent with what I have in the past said.

Cheers.

[solaricfission]

Wow, is this still going on?

[MAntoniazzi]

Can't we all just get along????

[Go Gators]

So, like I said, we can no longer then discuss democrats, republican, teachers, [or one assumes] Florida alumns - because, wait for it, some on the boards might also be democrats, republicans, teachers, or Florida alumns.

There is no hypocrisy. My statements are perfectly consistent.

Go back and read what I wrote. I wrote that I never respond personally until someone has first done so to me. The person in question accused me of attacking him personally where no such attack existed.

This person then responded that he would issue no apology because his "intuition" [the unknown subject of which he seems to want to dance around] told him I didn't deserve one, basically because of my character - to which I did then respond personally - which is completely consistent with what I have in the past said.

Cheers.

Oh, ok.

[Camillo Sitte]

Waaa Waaa Waaa. Just about every one of your posts is somehow negative about some facet of Orlando life. If you really don't like Orlando, maybe you should move, I hear Detroit is nice this time of year. So you think that a median household income of "only" $43.9K is low? Miami is $25.2K, New York City is $38.3K, Chicago is $38.6K, Nationally, it's 46.2K so I really don't get your point. Condo prices in Orlando are still lower than most major markets as is the cost of living. Home prices in Orlando have gone down less than the national average (pssst...... did you know that the real estate problem is national not confined to Orlando?). Yes, there was some speculator purchases (btw it was never a "majority" sold to speculators, nice try though) and an overly optimistic construction spurt DT, but, every one of those condos already built will be sold and occupied. More restaurants and shops are opening and downtown is packed on weekends with all that "surface parking" filled (Guess there's a need for it). The theatre will open as will the PAC and the new arena. I split my time between Manhattan and Orlando and I love the nightlife scene, resturants and the much more laid back lifestyle in Orlando. In Orlando, I don't have to make a reservation 2 months in advance to get a decent meal, nor do I pay $1400 HOA fees a month like in Manhattan or paid $900,000 for an 800 sq ft 1 bedroom unit. So, please, stop your whining about how bad Orlando is Mr. Chicken Little. Its going through growing pains which will work themselves out.

Oh yeah.....

Cheers

Waaa?

OK.

Hey, did you know that Orlando also has several 24-hour Wal-Marts.

Yea!

I know that my non sequitur doesn't rise to level of your little rant but I thought I would give it a try.

But again, seriously, why so personal? I just don't get it

Edited March 3, 2008 by Camillo Sitte