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Carolina Place Mall

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I'm sort of jumping back a few posts, but I want to clarify about what I as talking about in my post. I'm not in any way suggesting that Carolina Place is on the verge of closing. I was simply saying that if I was told to close or move one Charlotte area mall it would probably be Carolina Place. Good points about the Barnes and Noble and REI, but Northlake has an REI across the street, near Target, and Southpark has a Barnes and Noble nearby as well. I think Northlake will remain sort of pseudo-suburban, but Southpark is quickly and deliberately becoming more walkable, soon the Barnes and Noble, and Morrocroft Village (with the Harris Teeter) will become a quick walk, not a short drive, from the mall itself. 

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The Macy's at Carolina Place is going to be replaced by a Dick's Sporting Goods (the one across 51 is going to move).

So they will have JCPenny, Dillard's, Belk, and Sears as traditional department stores anchors and Barnes & Noble, REI, H&M, and Dick's as junior anchors. In addition, the Dave & Buster's is going to be opening next to the Dillard's in the Fall of 2017.

Is it a luxury mall, no. But a good fit for the area and captures people from Fort Mill and Rock Hill as well and the stores are a good fit for middle class families in the area.

Macy's closing is a reflection on Macy's and their inability to compete / differentiate in the market. They are closing all over the country, including in some of the most successful malls, it they own the building and can unload it for cash. 

Edited by CLT2014

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^^ Is Dicks taking the whole store?

I don't go the one across the street in Pineville often, but when I do it always feels like a zoo (compared to the SP location which is typically dead...but a nice place to park). Or maybe it's just because I am in at the Pineville location the day before my daughters youth sports practice starts like everyone else :tw_grimace:

 

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11 minutes ago, InSouthPark said:

^^ Is Dicks taking the whole store?

I don't go the one across the street in Pineville often, but when I do it always feels like a zoo (compared to the SP location which is typically dead...but a nice place to park). Or maybe it's just because I am in at the Pineville location the day before my daughters youth sports practice starts like everyone else :tw_grimace:

I'm not sure... GGP announced the plans for the Macy's at Carolina Place in their quarterly results conference call. I would not be surprised if they demolish the Macy's and do a ground up-build of a new Dick's on the pad that looks more like the SP Dick's.

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All Macys stores in NC were legacy Thalhimers or Hecht's.  Anyway Costar is reporting the Macys spot at Carolina Place will be a new Dicks Sporting goods store I am guessing relocation from their free standing existing store across the street. http://www.costar.com/News/Article/Macys-Sells-Five-Stores-to-GGP-Offers-Potential-Clues-to-Future-Store-Closures/186250

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On 1/18/2017 at 8:34 AM, KJHburg said:

We have been talking about this since Nov. 2016 now the Charlotte Observer "announces" Dicks to take over Macys space at the mall. http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/business/biz-columns-blogs/whats-in-store/article127167589.html

I wonder what will become of their location on the other side of 51.  That site shares an entrance with Office Depot, who has been closing stores as well.  I wonder if the parcels are tied together and possibly could be eventually converted to housing or maybe medial with its proximity to Carolina HealthCare.

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33 minutes ago, cjd5050 said:

I wonder what will become of their location on the other side of 51.  That site shares an entrance with Office Depot, who has been closing stores as well.  I wonder if the parcels are tied together and possibly could be eventually converted to housing or maybe medial with its proximity to Carolina HealthCare.

The two parcels have different owners at the moment, but the two sites would certainly be more efficient combined. The Dick's being tucked back behind other stores gives it a weak street presence as well. 

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Sounds like the Sears bankruptcy is finally gonna happen. If the Carolina Place store doesn’t make it through a reorg (I am doubtful any stores will), what do you guys think might replace the anchor slot? How healthy is CP these days?

Isn’t there still a Kmart around here too?

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21 minutes ago, kermit said:

Sounds like the Sears bankruptcy is finally gonna happen. If the Carolina Place store doesn’t make it through a reorg (I am doubtful any stores will), what do you guys think might replace the anchor slot? How healthy is CP these days?

Isn’t there still a Kmart around here too?

If Sear's closes, Carolina Place will have JCPenny, Dillard's, and Belk as traditional department store anchors. The Macy's that closed is being replaced by Dick's Sporting Goods. Other smaller anchors are Barnes and Noble, REI, and Dave & Buster's. 

The bottom level of the mall is 95%+ occupied (just three small spots open). Level 2 also has 3 small spots open, but a bigger open spot next to Buckle so I'd guess around 92% occupied. 

Kmart is long gong  in the Centrum and the TJMaxx closed as well. That shopping center is going to struggle IMO due to the congestion in that area and lack of housing right near it. None of the stores are really worth the drive. 

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I think the Centrum is already dead. The only thing there that's worth anything is Home Depot, which is a sort of "point to point" store... you go to Home Depot when you need something, and then go back home to use the thing you needed. (There's also Patel Brothers in the outparcels, but I don't really count that as part of the shopping center.)

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The Centrum is a good opportunity for Pineville to partner with the owner of the shopping center and a developer in creating a more walkable community at the entrance to their town, but I don't think the town has the right vision in place to make it happen. It they had a light rail stop (that they fought from happening) that area would be getting redeveloped instead of a graveyard of closed Kmarts.

The Best Buy and the Stein Mart are next to go at Centrum. I wouldn't be surprised if Home Depot looked for a better location in that area. 

Edited by CLT2014

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1 hour ago, kermit said:

Sounds like the Sears bankruptcy is finally gonna happen. If the Carolina Place store doesn’t make it through a reorg (I am doubtful any stores will), what do you guys think might replace the anchor slot? How healthy is CP these days?

Isn’t there still a Kmart around here too?

No the K-Mart closed a couple years ago.  I’ll tell you what though that Patel Brothers is always packed!  Maybe they should continue to target more international vendors since the area is diversifying.  

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27 minutes ago, Temeteron said:

No the K-Mart closed a couple years ago.  I’ll tell you what though that Patel Brothers is always packed!  Maybe they should continue to target more international vendors since the area is diversifying.  

Was the Patel Brothers up by Harbor Freight a while ago?

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1 hour ago, CLT2014 said:

The Centrum is a good opportunity for Pineville to partner with the owner of the shopping center and a developer in creating a more walkable community at the entrance to their town, but I don't think the town has the right vision in place to make it happen. It they had a light rail stop (that they fought from happening) that area would be getting redeveloped instead of a graveyard of closed Kmarts.

The Best Buy and the Stein Mart are next to go at Centrum. I wouldn't be surprised if Home Depot looked for a better location in that area. 

Centrum has ZERO visibility from 485 and certainly not from 51.  Trim the trees

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1 hour ago, kickazzz2000 said:

Centrum has ZERO visibility from 485 and certainly not from 51.  Trim the trees

I will disagree with you 150%.  You can see Sears and JCPenny from 485 bright as can be and they are the slowest stores at the mall.  Has nothing to do with visibility. People use the internet. It’s 2018.

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56 minutes ago, Temeteron said:

I will disagree with you 150%.  You can see Sears and JCPenny from 485 bright as can be and they are the slowest stores at the mall.  Has nothing to do with visibility. People use the internet. It’s 2018.

Centrum is the shopping center across from the mall...  That's what the comment was in regards to.

Edited by SouthEndCLT811

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21 minutes ago, SouthEndCLT811 said:

Yes I’m aware. Still same idea though.  

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1 hour ago, Temeteron said:

Yes I’m aware. Still same idea though.  

Clearly you were not aware.  There is a significant difference in visibility between Carolina Place, which you thought I was talking about, and The Centrum, which I was referring to in my response to the comment above.  

Furthermore, if you’ve ever been involved  in commercial real estate, one of the key features you look for in a property (and is almost always mentioned in listings) is road frontage and visibility.  Is the the ONLY factor for success of a business/tenant?  Of course not; nobody is arguing that.  It does, however play a role and is one of my key criticisms of development in CLT in general.  Trees are great, but a lot of first time visitors think we’re in a damn forest when I’m bringing around town.  

Not that we would still have Kmart.

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21 minutes ago, kickazzz2000 said:

Clearly you were not aware.  There is a significant difference in visibility between Carolina Place, which you thought I was talking about, and The Centrum, which I was referring to in my response to the comment above.  

Furthermore, if you’ve ever been involved  in commercial real estate, one of the key features you look for in a property (and is almost always mentioned in listings) is road frontage and visibility.  Is the the ONLY factor for success of a business/tenant?  Of course not; nobody is arguing that.  It does, however play a role and is one of my key criticisms of development in CLT in general.  Trees are great, but a lot of first time visitors think we’re in a damn forest when I’m bringing around town.  

Not that we would still have Kmart.

There are trees all around Southpark Mall and it seems to do just fine. I guess when these old people that don’t know how to use google die away, we won’t have to chop down all these poor beautiful trees. SMH

Edited by Temeteron

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13 minutes ago, Temeteron said:

There are trees all around Southpark Mall and it seems to do just fine. I guess when these old people that don’t know how to use google die away, we won’t have to chop down all these poor beautiful trees. SMH

Ok, whatever you say temetro.m.  

SMH

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11 hours ago, CLT2014 said:

The Centrum is a good opportunity for Pineville to partner with the owner of the shopping center and a developer in creating a more walkable community at the entrance to their town, but I don't think the town has the right vision in place to make it happen. It they had a light rail stop (that they fought from happening) that area would be getting redeveloped instead of a graveyard of closed Kmarts.

The Best Buy and the Stein Mart are next to go at Centrum. I wouldn't be surprised if Home Depot looked for a better location in that area. 

I could see Best Buy leaving the Centrum and going to Carolina Place once Sears closes. Reminds me how the old Best Buy at University Place dipped to Concord Mills once the other anchors relocated or closed shop. 

The Centrum is going have to be redeveloped at some point since that shopping center is eventually is going to become blight with all the tenants gone. Mixed used development and pushing for a an extension of the Blue Line would be ideal for that area, IMO. 

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Carolina Place is close enough to the affluent neighborhoods of Ballantyne to attract shoppers if it had better offerings.  Replace Sears with the still lacking Saks and invest money into cosmetic renovations for the entire mall. Otherwise it's another Eastland waiting to happen.

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