Davidson Southeast: Antioch, Century Farms, East of Brentwood

[smeagolsfree]

8 hours ago, BnaBreaker said:

Man, I'm glad that WeHo is becoming such a hot neighborhood, but I've gotta say, I can't for the life of me figure out why it is, or what it has going for it aside from the fact that it is in Nashville.  Someone with more experience in that neighborhood please correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I can tell, there's damn near nothing in that neighborhood aside from a few blocks of lower-middle class single family housing from the 70's/80's, and some light industrial buildings.  

A major factor why the area is attractive or was... the price of homes and land  which is now a mute point. However, the location being so close to downtown is one of the key factors.

I do think the sidewalks will come here and in the Nations after the Mayors address which include 50 million in sidewalks.

 

In the words of realtors... Location... Location ... Location

[Flatrock]

8 hours ago, BnaBreaker said:

Man, I'm glad that WeHo is becoming such a hot neighborhood, but I've gotta say, I can't for the life of me figure out why it is, or what it has going for it aside from the fact that it is in Nashville.  Someone with more experience in that neighborhood please correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I can tell, there's damn near nothing in that neighborhood aside from a few blocks of lower-middle class single family housing from the 70's/80's, and some light industrial buildings.  

In addition to PaulChinetti's comment, I'd add that there are are several of Nashville's hottest art galleries: Zeitgeist,  David Lusk and Julia Martin. Not to mention a pretty amazing and active artisan/craftsman population working in maker spaces. Collaboratives in art and music also populate the area of Ft. Houston. We live in Woodbine 5 minutes south and head there regularly. 

[RonCamp]

2 hours ago, Flatrock said:

In addition to PaulChinetti's comment, I'd add that there are are several of Nashville's hottest art galleries: Zeitgeist,  David Lusk and Julia Martin. Not to mention a pretty amazing and active artisan/craftsman population working in maker spaces. Collaboratives in art and music also populate the area of Ft. Houston. We live in Woodbine 5 minutes south and head there regularly. 

Agreed - its a great area.  

But the rents for these micro apartments, if true, seem too high considering studios in Pine Street start at $1499 per month.  Though the apartments are similar in size, the Pine Street building includes gym, pool, and a location with many more walkable amenities.  

[PaulChinetti]

Agreed RonCamp the prices are crazy. I wonder if they are planning to be the live/work buildings like by Corsair in WeHo?

[Flatrock]

17 minutes ago, RonCamp said:

Agreed - its a great area.  

But the rents for these micro apartments, if true, seem too high considering studios in Pine Street start at $1499 per month.  Though the apartments are similar in size, the Pine Street building includes gym, pool, and a location with many more walkable amenities.  

RonCamp: yes - very high rents indeed. Although, I think those rents improbable, I would not be shocked that millennials would be willing to pay 'more for less'.  The neighborhood is hip - funnily enough - due to a confluence of counter-culture, non-hipsters. This attracts a certain type who want to be on the doorstep of downtown in a creative, vibey place, but not be pigeon-holed as a Gulch-ster or East Nashvillian (I really like both of those places, so please don't nail me for that). Improbable: yes. Impossible: no.

[RonCamp]

2 hours ago, Flatrock said:

RonCamp: yes - very high rents indeed. Although, I think those rents improbable, I would not be shocked that millennials would be willing to pay 'more for less'.  The neighborhood is hip - funnily enough - due to a confluence of counter-culture, non-hipsters. This attracts a certain type who want to be on the doorstep of downtown in a creative, vibey place, but not be pigeon-holed as a Gulch-ster or East Nashvillian (I really like both of those places, so please don't nail me for that). Improbable: yes. Impossible: no.

No disagreements here on your comments.  At the end of the day I guess I always think in terms of price psf, which is why I was surprised by the micro unit proforma rents.  But we'll see what the market will bear!

[BnaBreaker]

Thanks for the WeHo refresher guys!  Sounds like it is a much different neighborhood than it was the last time I went through there.  

[MLBrumby]

Just the latest announcement in the boomtown that is Nashvegas... WeHo... http://www.tennessean.com/story/money/real-estate/2016/05/17/mixed-use-project-eyed-wedgewood-houston-site/84507358/

 

[titanhog]

Do you guys think WeHo could become the next East Nashville or Germantown?  I'm not familiar enough with the area to know how much land WeHo encompasses...but it sure seems like things may be heating up over that way.

[PaulChinetti]

20 minutes ago, titanhog said:

Do you guys think WeHo could become the next East Nashville or Germantown?  I'm not familiar enough with the area to know how much land WeHo encompasses...but it sure seems like things may be heating up over that way.

It's much smaller than those neighborhoods and has some pretty hard borders, interstate to the west and fairgrounds to the south. 

Including Chestnut Hill, which goes to Trevecca to the east. Not sure how many blocks it would actually be. 

Edited May 17, 2016 by PaulChinetti

[MLBrumby]

I don't know enough about that section, but as I understand the way G'town was twenty years ago, if WeHo and Chestnut Hill and other areas have a significant stock of old factories and vacant land, it very well could become the next hot area.  Already, there appears to be a lot of money proposed for that area, but I believe it is larger and may need a "core" from which to grow outward.  Where would that be?  I think the fact that it is not limited by geographic barriers could be a positive, as it would lend the area to better transportation into and out of that section of town.  If these initial projects come to fruition, then that will put this area well on the way to becoming like G'town. Oh... and walkable streets... that's the key to getting new residential put into an older area. 

Edited May 17, 2016 by MLBrumby

[nashwatcher]

10 hours ago, MLBrumby said:

I don't know enough about that section, but as I understand the way G'town was twenty years ago, if WeHo and Chestnut Hill and other areas have a significant stock of old factories and vacant land, it very well could become the next hot area.  Already, there appears to be a lot of money proposed for that area, but I believe it is larger and may need a "core" from which to grow outward.  Where would that be?  I think the fact that it is not limited by geographic barriers could be a positive, as it would lend the area to better transportation into and out of that section of town.  If these initial projects come to fruition, then that will put this area well on the way to becoming like G'town. Oh... and walkable streets... that's the key to getting new residential put into an older area. 

Agree completely. This area could really become desirable/hot for several reasons. 

1. It's super close to downtown

2. It's got large parcels if it continues to grow through the Trevecca area and towards Murfreesboro Rd (Core Development is venturing into this area, you can buy industrial large buildings/lots at reasonable prices and convert them)

3. Industrial older buildings are unique and create a vibe in an area when converted. Something different than other cookie cutter neighborhoods.

Now to make this vision come to it's fullest fruition, some "ahead of time" thinking has to be utilized by Metro. As you say, the area needs to be walkable. SIDEWALK investment to draw in developers and future residents. Traffic needs to be able to flow. Connect Wedgewood with Fesslers.

With some intelligent investment/planning, we could have a really unique, vibey neighborhood grow up in the years to come.

[CenterHill]

On 5/17/2016 at 5:28 PM, MLBrumby said:

I don't know enough about that section, but as I understand the way G'town was twenty years ago, if WeHo and Chestnut Hill and other areas have a significant stock of old factories and vacant land, it very well could become the next hot area.  Already, there appears to be a lot of money proposed for that area, but I believe it is larger and may need a "core" from which to grow outward.  Where would that be?  I think the fact that it is not limited by geographic barriers could be a positive, as it would lend the area to better transportation into and out of that section of town.  If these initial projects come to fruition, then that will put this area well on the way to becoming like G'town. Oh... and walkable streets... that's the key to getting new residential put into an older area. 

The "core" would almost certainly be Chestnut St, I would think.   More specifically, the intersection of Chestnut and Houston St. and adjoining blocks.    

One accessibility issue that will become more pronounced as Wedgewood-Houston continues to grow in popularity, particularly after hours, are the CSX level crossings on Chestnut and on 4th Ave S.   When trains pass through, traffic on those two streets is stopped and can back up significantly.     There are a couple of creative ways to circumnavigate the crossings (Oak St. behind the City Cemetery or the Ensley St. tunnel), but only if you've thought of your "escape" route in sufficient time before getting boxed into traffic waiting at the crossings.    I don't know if there is a solution or if the solution is to simply embrace the crossings as one of the quirks of the neighborhood.     

 

[Rett]

A few photos of Lipscomb University's new engineering building under construction on the NW side of campous near Grandview and Belmont. These were taken May 8th. I got news yesterday that the houses at 3702, 3704, 3706, and 3710 on Belmont blvd will be demolished this summer for their expansion plans.

 

[rookzie]

On 5/18/2016 at 6:07 PM, CenterHill said:

The "core" would almost certainly be Chestnut St, I would think.   More specifically, the intersection of Chestnut and Houston St. and adjoining blocks.    

One accessibility issue that will become more pronounced as Wedgewood-Houston continues to grow in popularity, particularly after hours, are the CSX level crossings on Chestnut and on 4th Ave S.   When trains pass through, traffic on those two streets is stopped and can back up significantly.     There are a couple of creative ways to circumnavigate the crossings (Oak St. behind the City Cemetery or the Ensley St. tunnel), but only if you've thought of your "escape" route in sufficient time before getting boxed into traffic waiting at the crossings.    I don't know if there is a solution or if the solution is to simply embrace the crossings as one of the quirks of the neighborhood.     

 

 

The current mess of "rail-locked" territory at Chestnut and 4th, has been in force for over a hundred years, and even during the 1940s and '50s, trains along that former NC&St.L main-line were much more frequent than they are now, even though they were much shorter in length, being both freight and passenger.

It is typical Nashville old extents of the core grid, when the old city corporation limits were jaggedly bound just south of and parallel to Humphreys St. and including the northern tip of Rains Ave., that grid streets often ended or looped back along these boundaries, frequently, in the case of Nashville, in a fragmented misaligned array.  The Wedgewood-Houston (WeHo) district, in particular, evolved as the industrial SE edge of the town proper, over a half century prior to city-county consolidation.  Also as was typical of the South in general, of "small cities" with concentrations of rail-served industries, railroad tracks rarely were grade separated from intersecting urban streets, except at sites of gulches to accommodate terminal activity.  WeHo is one of those quintessential examples formed of "industrial wonderlands" of factories, water-towers, bulk silos, and train tracks of two separate Class-I railroads.

I would say that, just as with many other instances of lack of foresight, during the last 35 years of forgone opportunities, the city might have been able to rectify the inherently notorious compound-directional gridlock of the 4th Ave and Chestnut St. crossings, had it acquired the land formerly occupied by the Purina (Ralston) silos on the triangular area bound by 4th, Chestnut, and the railroad, following a tragic event in summer 1992, when one of several children playing in the area, climbed onto the top of one of the abandoned silo pods and fell into it to the bottom.  The structures were leveled soon after.  It might have been feasible to at least establish an under- or overpass at 4th without adversely affecting the Houston, Humphreys, and Rains roadways, even with a study of realignment of these to tie into 3rd Ave extended south, passing under or over the railroad to establish some level of sanity to that connectivity-deprived hodgepodge of short and obliquely joined streets, as with Houston, which is might appear adorable but which are dangerous to both pedestrians and motorists alike.  The city also could have coordinated that same effort with a plan to ease the chicanery in negotiating the Ensley - 2nd Ave narrow "race-track", which in part was built on the former Radnor streetcar line alignment.  Now it's become all but far too late, with that parcel now occupied by the recent Woodstock at Chestnut re-development.  The unique mix of railroad, old industrial adaptive reuse, and contemporary comprise a highly charming core urban district, but it only will become worse, since that railway path has become only more congested with overcapacity.  -==-

Edited May 21, 2016 by rookzie

[nashwatcher]

7 hours ago, rookzie said:

 

The current mess of "rail-locked" territory at Chestnut and 4th, has been in force for over a hundred years, and even during the 1940s and '50s, trains along that former NC&St.L main-line were much more frequent than they are now, even though they were much shorter in length, being both freight and passenger.

It is typical Nashville old extents of the core grid, when the old city corporation limits were jaggedly bound just south of and parallel to Humphreys St. and including the northern tip of Rains Ave., that grids streets often ended or looped back along these boundaries, frequently, in the case of Nashville, in a fragmented misaligned array.  The WeHo district, in particular, evolved as the industrial SE edge of the town proper, over a half century prior to city-county consolidation.  Also as was typical of the South in general, of "small cities" with concentrations of rail-served industries, railroad tracks rarely were grade separated from intersecting urban streets, except at sites of gulches to accommodate terminal activity.  WeHo is one of those quintessential examples formed of "industrial wonderlands" of factories, water-towers, bulk silos, and train tracks of one two separate Class-I railroads.

Really interesting to learn the history of this area. This whole industrial area from Wedgwood-Houston to Trevecca to Polk Ave should be developed into a cool, connected industrial urban core of sorts. As mentioned, it's so close to downtown and has so much potential long term as Nashville continues to grow up into an attractive, dynamic city.

Investors are clearly seeing the writing on the wall (Core Development sticking their toes into the water on Herron Dr). What options does the city have to connect the traffic flow long term so this area reaches it's full potential? It's perfect for affordable housing developments as well, to provide people who work downtown with apartments that aren't "luxury" like so many that are being built.

[PaulChinetti]

10 hours ago, rookzie said:

 

Great response rookzie!

There have been great strides (slowing traffic, revitalizing businesses along those streets) in taking one way streets and turning them into two way streets in other cities especially Louisville. I wonder if making 2nd and 4th would help alleviate some of the railroad crossing nonsense. 2nd already has an under pass, which would obviously need to be overhauled but it would be doable. 

http://www.planetizen.com/node/69354

Unfortunately as Nashville is, it's reactive instead of proactive, so I'm afraid it'll take someone else getting killed or something terrible to happen before they do anything about it.

I've been sitting at the crossing on 4th and seen an ambulance come down 4th Ave and have to turn off it's lights and stop, that can't be good for anyone... 

[markhollin]

Construction is now underway on a new building to house Tusculum Elementary School. Metro Schools has landed a permit, valued at about $15 million, for the project. The new school (pictured) will have an address of 440 McMurray Drive. R.G. Anderson Co. is the general contractor.  -Nashville Post

 

[rookzie]

8 hours ago, markhollin said:

Construction is now underway on a new building to house Tusculum Elementary School. Metro Schools has landed a permit, valued at about $15 million, for the project. The new school (pictured) will have an address of 440 McMurray Drive. R.G. Anderson Co. is the general contractor.  -Nashville Post

 

Not a second too soon, is not early enough for Tusculum ES.  Every time I pass it, I see a brick doghouse in the midst of a sea of portables.  Planning and past budget priorities did that school wrong way too long.

[nashwatcher]

http://www.nashvillepost.com/business/development/apartments/article/20781568/test

Trevecca investing in building an apartment building on the Murfreesboro Rd corridor. It will likely be workforce housing that will service downtown. This corridor is perfect for many more affordably priced units and buildings like this.

[Flatrock]

2 hours ago, nashwatcher said:

http://www.nashvillepost.com/business/development/apartments/article/20781568/test

Trevecca investing in building an apartment building on the Murfreesboro Rd corridor. It will likely be workforce housing that will service downtown. This corridor is perfect for many more affordably priced units and buildings like this.

Agreed. I'm so very eager for thoughtful development and re-purposing along Murfreesboro and  Nolensville Pikes. 

[markhollin]

Metro has twice made offers to buy the inner core of the former Hickory Hollow Mall, but was turned down by the owner both times.

http://www.tennessean.com/story/money/real-estate/2016/06/02/nashvilles-offers-twice-rejected-global-mall-owner/85303624/

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2016/06/03/metro-would-like-to-buy-the-former-hickory-hollow.html

 

[dmillsphoto]

Currently behind paywall, but the first residential piece of Century Farms is getting close.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2016/06/06/massive-antioch-project-gateway-to-the-city.html?ana=twt

[MLBrumby]

Antioch really is becoming like another city, already must be the densest part of Davidson County, and looks like no end in sight for the growth out there. Now it's popping up west of I-24. 

Edited June 6, 2016 by MLBrumby

[markhollin]

More info on the 216-unit Vintage Apartments at Century Farms in Antioch, as well as development of a new medical office building/restaurant/coffee shop at 5304 Cane Ridge Rd. nearby:

http://www.tennessean.com/story/money/real-estate/2016/06/06/medical-offices-eyed-shoneys-site-antioch/85503702/

The developer is the same as this complex in Murfreesboro, and apparently the Vintage Apartments will have a very similar look: