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smeagolsfree

The Gulch Projects

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The freeway topping park in Dallas is only 5 acres and cost $100 million, completed in 2012. (Some of that from privately raised funds.) This proposal is for a park of almost three times that in total acres. I think the total for this project would be well over $200 million. And I do not think Nashville has the deep pocketed philanthropists to pick up any substantial part of that cost. Color me skeptical, although I would LOVE for it to happen!

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They could sell air rights to defray the costs, perhaps commercial development at both ends if there was ever a LRT line going down Charlotte and 12th that would make the proximity to those stations command a premium. The air rights could also be for the new park"land" but work in a different way (a'la a land preservation trust or foundation park). I'm also quite skeptical that this would ever be done, not as much for the great cost (that wouldn't help) but because there would be a taxpayer's revolt. If the backlash for LRT was as great as it was, then the idea of spending any money 'just to pretty up' a freeway is bound to run into backlash from people who don't see anything beneficial to them. I can anticipate what their argument might be: that the riverfront park cost 'a fraction of that and NOBODY USES IT!' I can hear them now. 

 

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I LOVE the idea of capping the interstate! Whether a park or bringing future development into it would do wonders to connect our city but also create some really cool, new spaces. I agree that the amount of land we allocate to the massive amounts of cars moving around our city is down right insane! I am really impressed with the curriculum that VU has been doing with their engineering students. I attended the one at LP Building Products a week or two ago and they presented an affordable housing project above Music City Bus Terminal and was blown away!

That being said (and I say this without watching or attending the full event), $150 million would probably get us through maybe section 1 of this effort. If we were to factor the desire of air rights buildings on this, we are talking billions! The Big Dig in Boston (we all know what that project cost) was supposed to have structures built on top of the tunnel and they did integrate building foundations into the construction, but nothing has been built or is going to be in the near future. The ventilation of the tunnel would also have to be extensive and the parks on the surface would most certainly have ventilation buildings on them or they would have to be integrated into the new buildings.

METRO or potentially the state could incentivize prospective developers or companies into building over the highway by potentially subsidizing the cost of the deck (insane costs) but then most other subsidies would have to disappear to justify the costs. I would really hope that we can find creative ways to fund projects like this as it will benefit the city as a whole in the long run! And as @Mr_Bond affirmed, its all about starting these conversations now for the future of our city.

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^^ The Music City Central (bus terminal) was originally designed to have apartments above, something like 7 stories or so

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15 hours ago, LA_TN said:

^^ The Music City Central (bus terminal) was originally designed to have apartments above, something like 7 stories or so

Oh, man, I remember that. I was really sweating those apartments, the convenience of living right over the terminal would have been so very nice.

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2 minutes ago, DJBF1763 said:

DC actually is in the middle of capping a small portion of I-395 downtown with buildings and connecting some street network. The project is taking a considerable amount of time though, and I believe was quite costly. However, I know a large portion of this project has been paid for by the private company who wanted to build on top of the interstate. So there are definitely developers out there who would be interested. 

http://www.capitolcrossingdc.com

http://3rdsttunnel.com 

What "extra" do you have to do to build a skyscraper over an interstate?

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On 4/23/2019 at 4:00 PM, MLBrumby said:

They could sell air rights to defray the costs, perhaps commercial development at both ends if there was ever a LRT line going down Charlotte and 12th that would make the proximity to those stations command a premium. The air rights could also be for the new park"land" but work in a different way (a'la a land preservation trust or foundation park). I'm also quite skeptical that this would ever be done, not as much for the great cost (that wouldn't help) but because there would be a taxpayer's revolt. If the backlash for LRT was as great as it was, then the idea of spending any money 'just to pretty up' a freeway is bound to run into backlash from people who don't see anything beneficial to them. I can anticipate what their argument might be: that the riverfront park cost 'a fraction of that and NOBODY USES IT!' I can hear them now. 

 

Lots of good examples you've shown. I think that stretch of interstate being adjacent to the coveted Gulch and Midtown sections would make this idea especially feasible in a few years. I realize it's a stretch to assume that TDOT could get out of its own way, but if they could see the feasibility, they should start planning for that now. It would take 10-15 years to be a reality. I remember when the Robinson Humphrey's Financial Center was planned above GA400, and it took years to plan... and (surprisingly) not a long time to build in comparison. Of course, the funding for GA400 was all from tolls. 

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The Columbus project is pretty cool when I saw it. I thought how is it that Metro and TDOT cant get past their politics to make something like this happen here. The lawmakers in Podunk TN would be upset TDOT is spending money instead of all the roads to nowhere in those local counties where NOTHING is happening, and NOTHING likely will.

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1 hour ago, smeagolsfree said:

The Columbus project is pretty cool when I saw it. I thought how is it that Metro and TDOT cant get past their politics to make something like this happen here. The lawmakers in Podunk TN would be upset TDOT is spending money instead of all the roads to nowhere in those local counties where NOTHING is happening, and NOTHING likely will.

We should wall off those rural areas...or give them to GA, AL, KY, etc.  We don't need them. :rolleyes:

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25 minutes ago, titanhog said:

We should wall off those rural areas...or give them to GA, AL, KY, etc.  We don't need them. :rolleyes:

Kind of a big leap to assume someone saying 'transportation dollars are better spent in Nashville' actually meant 'screw all rural areas, we don't need em.'  Haha ;)

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39 minutes ago, BnaBreaker said:

Kind of a big leap to assume someone saying 'transportation dollars are better spent in Nashville' actually meant 'screw all rural areas, we don't need em.'  Haha ;)

It's an ongoing "talk" on this board that rural areas don't deserve much of the tax money they receive...nor the "pull" they have when it comes to state politics.  You know it.  Haha. ;)

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15 minutes ago, titanhog said:

It's an ongoing "talk" on this board that rural areas don't deserve much of the tax money they receive...nor the "pull" they have when it comes to state politics.  You know it.  Haha. ;)

There definitely is, and I understand the sensitivity people feel there, but that still doesn't mean that there was any truth to your implication that smeags was saying 'screw rural areas, we don't need them.'  Just because one thinks a we get more bang for our transportation buck when they're spent in a state's capital doesn't mean they think all rural areas should shrivel up and die.  There are many varying degrees to that debate, is all I'm saying.

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Y'all realize that food comes from rural areas (and not grocery stores), right? Those roads to rural areas do provide a valuable service for you, even if you never drive on them

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IIRC, one of the governors over the past 30 years actually made it a goal that every county would have a 4-lane divided route into/through it. 

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1 hour ago, BnaBreaker said:

Well, of course...  but again, varying degrees... I don't think anyone is opposed to having quality roads in rural areas, but having 'quality roads' doesn't necessarily mean that every county has to have a big network of divided four lane highways either, I think is what the argument is.  

And I absolutely agree with you on this. I can name a few roads, that have never heard of a traffic jam, which were expanded to 4 lanes because of politician xyz. On the other hand, I've seen a few 4-lane roads replace hilly curvy roads that had high death rates and accidents. I-840 cost more than what would be needed to 4-lane half the counties in the state; but, it was built to reduce truck traffic through Nashville. How did that turn out?

Why waste money capping an interstate? Or for golf courses? Or _____? Answer: because we waste money on politicians

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2 hours ago, MLBrumby said:

IIRC, one of the governors over the past 30 years actually made it a goal that every county would have a 4-lane divided route into/through it. 

I'm pretty sure that was Ned McWherter who himself was a country boy from West Tennessee.  I totally agree that every county deserves good, safe roads, but that doesn't mean they should be four-lane superhighways.

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