Brightline Trains

[HankStrong]

5 minutes ago, shardoon said:

Why didn't the GOAA make the intermodal center flexible for multiple types of train service. Heck, in fact, the intermodal center was designed when only Florida High Speed Rail and Sunrail were planned. How did it get to being obly able to be build out for Virgin Trains? What am I missing? 

It was designed for All Aboard Florida, not the Florida High Speed Rail that was killed in 2011.  AAF become Brightline which became Virgin Trains USA.

I believe the station is designed for 3 uses: Virgin, SunRail, and the defunct Maglev.  However, the 2 others will just be empty areas until something is built.

As well as cars, taxis, buses, and the people mover.

[codypet]

People mover/VT/Maglev.  Sunrail was unofficially there too .  You can see it faintly coming from the south (As well as another south rail).  (From Baker Barrios's website)

[spenser1058]

Disney and Brightline acknowledge talks:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-ne-virgin-disney-station-confirmed-20191217-reqxbclhmve3xjsdayx77rt5vq-story.html

From the Sentinel

[dcluley98]

RFQ for the Virgin Trains Aventura Station is out. Plans call for new stations in Aventura, Boca Raton, and Port Miami to open in 2020. 

Aventura station is: 

• An approximately 10,000 square-foot single-story station building,
• Two vertical circulation towers,
•  Rail infrastructure coordination (active management of construction of rail infrastructure not included in this scope),
• An 860 foot-long platform located within the FECR right-of-way,
• An elevated pedestrian bridge crossing Dixie Highway connecting the station to the platform via the two vertical circulation towers, and
• An approximate 250-space surface parking lot which will include support facilities for a County bus stop, kiss & drop, electric vehicle charging stations, and bike racks.
• LEED Silver Certified or higher
• Estimated Construction Cost of approximately $30,000,000

The Station and parking lot facilities noted above will be located on an approximate 3-acre parcel of vacant land located at 19700 West Dixie Highway and 19825 NE 26th Avenue.

This location is directly across Dixie Highway from the Aventura Mall (hence Pedestrian Bridge) , approximately 1.5 Miles south of the Gulfstream Park  Racing and Casino complex, and approximately 3 Miles north of Oleta River State Park. 

Edited December 18, 2019 by dcluley98

[HankStrong]

 

20 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

An elevated pedestrian bridge crossing Dixie Highway connecting the station to the platform via the two vertical circulation towers, and

I hope this connects to the mall across the street!  The bus terminal is directly across Biscayne Blvd from the train station in the parking garage.

[HankStrong]

Unrelated side note.  I saw a new member today named "I Like Trains" sadly, this is not my secret alter-ego.  If it was "I Love Trains" then I might be wondering if I joined again in my sleep.

[spenser1058]

More delays on Orlando - Tampa plans:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-ne-brightline-virgin-lease-talks-extended-20191227-oeqfxbimrndorbi6bbu745ukwy-story.html

From the Sentinel 

Among other things, the state reminds Brightline of I4 corridor issues due to Beyond the Ultimate and Tampa Bay Next construction m.

[prahaboheme]

Can we go back to the future when Orlando /Tampa had federal funding for a legitimate high speed rail? 

[aent]

1 hour ago, prahaboheme said:

Can we go back to the future when Orlando /Tampa had federal funding for a legitimate high speed rail? 

Why? For a couple miles per hour for a much greater expense? And its pretty clear the upper class service from Brightline being offered today is much higher quality then what was proposed under the previous HSR project. We dodged a real bullet and made out a lot better.

That article was likely not really a delay... Brightline won't start construction on the Tampa route until the Miami one is done, so we got at least 2 years, and also FDOT just asked for more detailed plans outlining exactly the land they need... thats likely why Brightline started pushing forward stronger and harder with Disney, and perhaps even went public with Disney about the negotiations, because when Brightline  gets the lease for the land on I-4 we'll know exactly where that stations gotta be.

[IAmFloridaBorn]

On 12/28/2019 at 9:04 PM, prahaboheme said:

Can we go back to the future when Orlando /Tampa had federal funding for a legitimate high speed rail? 

I'm wihh you. I don't like this bright line thing at all. 

[dcluley98]

Thing is, with the private vs. public thing, the service evolved into more of a luxury item than a utilitarian item. 

I would rather have it subsidized by our government and more accessible to "regular" people as an alternative to highways.  People always bring up the potential losses associated with running it publicly, but as has been pointed out in many discussions and studies, this is not different than subsidizing car-based infrastructure. 

I agree with Prahaboheme and IAFB. 

[stevenycer1]

Christmas Eve 2019 / MCO Intermodal Construction:

 

Facing South

Facing east

 

Edited January 2, 2020 by stevenycer1

[HankStrong]

Welcome!  Great pix

[stevenycer1]

 Thank you! Long time reader / first time poster. Here are a few more. 

[AmIReal]

"Why the US Still Doesn't Have High Speed Trains"

"A decade ago, the US was promised high-speed rail—so where is it?"

A fairly long article and if you're into this stuff you probably know all these details (and more). But this is worth a read just for this specific part;

"Certain conservatives, including the commentator George Will, see trains (and public transit more generally) as having the secondary goal of “diminishing Americans’ individualism in order to make them more amenable to collectivism.” Writing in Newsweek, Will applauds the theoretical freedom enabled by automobiles, which “go hither and yon, wherever and whenever the driver desires, without timetables,” Trains, meanwhile, requite “deference” to the will of the community and when it is most convenient for its members to travel—not to mention its financial support."

As the article points out, when OH and WI said no to their funds it left a tremendous windfall to be sent directly to FL and... "Rick Scott, the newly-elected Florida governor, shocked many by moving to kill the proposal and reject more than $2 billion in federal funding. " Its particularly funny that back then Scott was worried about Federal deficits and "spending beyond our means".

The article includes a bit about "farebox" or how much of the costs is paid for by passengers. It notes the Sunrail is at 6% (which is very low), but they don't indicate where those numbers come from or when so things may have changed.

In the end, roughly 150 projects were completed using the ARRA money.

https://qz.com/1761495/this-is-why-the-us-still-doesnt-have-high-speed-trains/

[stevenycer1]

"Brightline, the high-speed South Florida rail service, surpassed the one million ridership mark for 2019, a spokesman said Monday, placing it on path to reach a goal of serving nearly 3 million customers by the end of 2021, its third full year of service... Although the company has yet to formally publish its financial results for December and the full year, spokesman Michael Hicks said Brightline nearly doubled its ridership year over year on the strength of "back-to-back" record months in November and December... 'We look forward to continuing to connect South Florida, bring Orlando online in 2022 and launching three new South Florida stations this year," Hicks said, referring to the Boca Raton, Aventura and PortMiami stops the company intends to build."

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/business/fl-bz-brightline-november-ridership-20200107-vll5dgbhgjcelpfyrwrp3g2334-story.html

 

[aent]

12 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

Thing is, with the private vs. public thing, the service evolved into more of a luxury item than a utilitarian item. 

I would rather have it subsidized by our government and more accessible to "regular" people as an alternative to highways.  People always bring up the potential losses associated with running it publicly, but as has been pointed out in many discussions and studies, this is not different than subsidizing car-based infrastructure. 

I agree with Prahaboheme and IAFB. 

How is Brightline inaccessible to regular people in South Florida? The whole idea of the train system is to move a bunch of people at once. Brightline's goal is to do that. They offer different classes, and yes the stations and vehicles are much, much nicer then any public option, but its hardly out of each for any working person. And its designed to get people of all classes to actually want to ride the train, rather then it just being a choice because you can't afford anything else. Why do people here seriously oppose the train being nice and enjoyable and something people of all classes can enjoy?

And as Sunrail has shown us, when the public government operates it, they can barely even do it. I think Orlando's shown demand, at the very least, to have Sunrail operating whenever their is a weekend event. People seem to want it to operate throughout the day as well, even if the service is only hourly, and when it doesn't, and there's a 2.5 hour wait between trains in the middle of the day, it scares people from using it at all. The trains are no frills, the stations are no frills, little is done to get people to want to ride it, so it has low ridership with lots of expense... and its fairly obviously politically they don't know how to fund it once the state drops it. It seems completely unrealistic that they expand service, and likely they drop the level of service when the state and grant monies run out.

Even if Sunrail were to get really popular, as say, Tri Rail in South Florida, lets look at what they did: they had the perfect storm for success on Tri Rail, gas prices went over $4/gallon and traffic congestion even worsening on I-95, and people took notice... the trains started filling up... almost every one of them all day was standing room only. So what does the public option do? They literally CUT train service, how's that for making it more accessible to "regular" people? Or was the concept that if we make trains less convenient and push out people who can afford other options, that then there'd be room for the type of "regular" people those on this forum want to be who the service is built for?

Even on ticket prices: with the proposed stops, any "regular" person should end up saving money by using Brightline given the ticket prices they've had in South Florida. The "local" stop is a transfer to Sunrail (which is the weakest part of the whole thing, as that thing barely operates), but if any locals board the train at that stop to go anywhere, they're going to save money: parking at MCO in the garage is $19/day. Parking at Disney is $25/day.  The closest trip length in South Florida costs $12 (which is double the length, Ft Lauderdale to Miami) with kids riding free, and a current BOGO promotion, So currently, a family of 4 with 2 kids under 13 can literally take the train to Disney for less then the cost of parking, or again, same thing for any flight out of the airport (presumably you will need at least 2 nights). Even without the promotions they have, its apparent the cost should be similar to the cost of driving (accounting for gas/wear/tear/tolls/etc), and thats for a "luxury" service.

[Urban Mail Carrier]

If you’ve been following Sunrail news, service has actually been increased. Also I don’t quite agree when u say that the public government can barely operate Sunrail. The state has been operating Sunrail vía Bombardier since 1 May 2014. The public government will get its first shot in May 2021 to operate. Then maybe u can constructively criticize. But as of now the state pays for the operating budget. They call the shots. What I find amazing is the improvements accomplished on a shoestring budget. This gives me hope because if this can be accomplished with a limited budget then imagine the possibility with a dedicated funding source.

[Jernigan]

Driving is 59 cents per mile...if regular folk don’t think about maintenance etc it doesn’t mean they aren’t still paying it 

[spenser1058]

https://youtu.be/lycEvp8fCvw

A look at OIA’s Brightline station

[Jerry95]

First tracks for Virgin Trains USA installed at OIA 

https://www.wftv.com/news/local/orange-county/first-tracks-virgin-trains-usa-installed-oia/6HU3VRNZTVF3TA5OVBTQEHV7IY/

[codypet]

I have to hand it to the PR people for VT.  They do a good job staying in the news.  I hear a piece about once a month.

[HankStrong]

1 hour ago, codypet said:

I have to hand it to the PR people for VT.  They do a good job staying in the news.  I hear a piece about once a month.

They really do.

[Jernigan]

On 12/19/2019 at 10:34 AM, HankStrong said:

Unrelated side note.  I saw a new member today named "I Like Trains" sadly, this is not my secret alter-ego.  If it was "I Love Trains" then I might be wondering if I joined again in my sleep.

It’s Randall Toole 

[spenser1058]

Taking Brightline from WPB to Miami:

https://youtu.be/BxgwzTF7rAc