Legacy Union (former Charlotte Observer redevelopment)

[Crucial_Infra]

1 hour ago, Hushpuppy321 said:

Gonna pass Charlotte in what?

Population, number and size of skyscrapers, economic clout. 

[RANYC]

49 minutes ago, CarolinaDaydreamin said:

That's the same situation as Atlanta, at some point, the growth will surpass that as a barrier to feeling big. I also think the surface lots caused a lot of that feeling and as soon as they are developed and other parts of the city have high rises,  we will quickly feel very large.

What kind of growth are we discussing here?  Charlotte should do everything it can to preserve its tree canopy, and anything else that makes a statement of authenticity and unique quality.  Probably wishful thinking, but I hope Charlotte doesn’t take lessons on growth from Atlanta.  

[Hushpuppy321]

1 hour ago, Crucial_Infra said:

Population, number and size of skyscrapers, economic clout. 

Oh - I feel you on that.  CLT City Population won’t ever be as high as Austin.  Texas Cities Just growing more than NC Cities.  Not so sure about the economic clout thing because CLT punches way above its weight being #2 in finance/banking.  I’m glad we outdo them in the Professional Sports Teams and Major Airport arena.  Austin will always play 3rd/4th fiddle to Houston, Dallas & San Antonio.  I like Charlotte’s claim to biggest in the Carolinas 

Edited December 26, 2019 by Hushpuppy321

[CLT_sc]

22 hours ago, Crucial_Infra said:

Austin’s gonna pass Charlotte within 10 years and never look back. Nashville will never catch either. 

Using current growth rates, assuming the drivers stay the same, metro Austin will still be smaller than CLT in a decade.  Nashville will still be materially smaller than CLT.

A Lot can change in 10 years, but there is no basis for this statement.

 

Edited December 26, 2019 by CLT_sc

[Guest]

My only real concern about Charlotte when stacked up with Nashville and Austin is Higher Education, and the fact they are State Capitals. 

[CLT_sc]

On 12/24/2019 at 8:16 PM, j-man said:

My statements have nothing to do with any iconic structures. If anything it’s just about the quality of all the structures. Just seems like they all look so underwhelming. Yes Charlotte is building what it needs I was just speaking to how far certain cities architecture seems and how average the new construction in Charlotte is in comparison. 

What do you mean? 

If anything Charlotte needs more attractions so hopefully there could be like a museum or something in one of those slots. Idk it’s been years since Charlotte added anything fun to Uptown.

The Mint, Bechtler, and others were added this decade.  I would love to see a large museum, aquarium or something else.  But, the stadium will take a lot of money to upgrade, that is where the discretionary funds will be directed.  Southend is also growing into downtown, so I see that playing a larger role in the “fun” category down the road.

[CLT_sc]

2 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

My only real concern about Charlotte when stacked up with Nashville and Austin is Higher Education, and the fact they are State Capitals. 

That is the biggest concern I have as well.  But, we have mitigating factors....1, CLT attracts grads from a pool of many schools to feed the growing employment sectors, 2, CLT attracts higher Ed and research to the city, and 3, higher ed can’t continue on the current growth pattern.  Around 2026, the number of kids entering college will start to flatline. 

CLT’s airport dwarfs Nashville and Austin.

Austin and Nashville are really cool towns, But, the current numbers don’t support Austin,  and especially Nashville, blowing past Charlotte as others stated  unless something happens that is unforeseen. At best, Austin will be the size of Charlotte around the early 2030’s using today’s metrics. 

I wish we could change the state capital issue, that won’t happen.

 

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, CLT_sc said:

The Mint, Bechtler, and others were added this decade.  I would love to see a large museum, aquarium or something else.  But, the stadium will take a lot of money to upgrade, that is where the discretionary funds will be directed.  Southend is also growing into downtown, so I see that playing a larger role in the “fun” category down the road.

Discovery Place has a plan to make it one of the the best Science Museums in the Nation and I fully support it. $400M built from scratch science museum, even more iconic looking than the Library. Only issue I see is, like you said, Panthers are going to want a lot of money soon.

Edited December 26, 2019 by Guest

[CLT_sc]

3 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Discovery Place has a plan to make it one of the the best Science Museums in the Nation and I fully support it. $400M built from scratch science museum, even more iconic looking than the Library. Only issue I see is, like you said, Panthers are going to want a lot of money soon.

When will this be shown?  Do they have a funding stream?  Would love to see this downtown.

[Crucial_Infra]

33 minutes ago, CLT_sc said:

Using current growth rates, assuming the drivers stay the same, metro Austin will still be smaller than CLT in a decade.  Nashville will still be materially smaller than CLT.

A Lot can change in 10 years, but there is no basis for this statement.

 

Austin is one MSA reclassification (like our recent one) from making a serious jump in metro population. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, CLT_sc said:

When will this be shown?  Do they have a funding stream?  Would love to see this downtown.

No clue. I saw it well over a year ago, and they are still just flirting with the media.

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2019/11/12/city-eyes-400m-overhaul-for-discovery-place-and.html

Edited December 26, 2019 by Guest

[CLT_sc]

1 minute ago, Crucial_Infra said:

Austin is one MSA reclassification (like our recent one) from making a serious jump in metro population. 

CLT’s metro may not stay the same either.

Most counties surrounding Austin Metro have populations in the 20k range, not sure you would ring out a large gain there.

Austin certainly is growing fast, but the numbers don’t support it blowing past CLT within 10 years or even in 15 years. And, I don’t think we have seen the full impact that Truist, Lowe’s, Honeywell and others will have in the city.  We certainly need improvement in areas like education.  But, some comments suggest we are more like Greenville SC than Charlotte. 

9 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

No clue. I saw it well over a year ago, and they are still just flirting with the media.

Would love to see Discovery and the library get large grants from the Duke Endowment and Foundation for the Carolinas to kick this off.  Then, hit up Tepper for a nice “welcome to Charlotte” contribution.  

[Crucial_Infra]

The biggest thing that annoys me about Charlotte’s metro population is that ~300k of it is in South Carolina. Not that I have a problem with South Carolina but I hate that Georgia is ahead of North Carolina in population!  If Uptown Charlotte were located 15 miles further north, NC would be ~150,000 residents bigger than GA. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by Crucial_Infra

[15895]

On 12/23/2019 at 12:25 PM, Hushpuppy321 said:

I don’t know about you guys but I’m pretty impressed with this picture of Nashville’s ‘Hot’ Neighborhoods.  Their growth is very decent and definitely rivals Charlotte’s growth in terms of sheer number of projects and construction dollars being spent. 

I like Charlotte’s continual growth in sheer terms of number of office and residential projects being built, I like Charlotte’s height and I like Charlotte Growth & Investment into rapid transit (Lightrail/BRT), etc.  

 

It's impressive until you look at the pedestrian atmosphere. It looks absolutely dreadful as a pedestrian.

 

Charlotte is throwing up really great, really good buildings all through uptown, NoDa and Yes SouthEnd. Yes, all those little stickbuilt podium things in SouthEnd  are amazing. It adds so much life and energy. SouthEnd is now much more energetic and vibrant than NoDa. Isn't that sad? Because NoDa has an awesome strip but the area is so rinky dink it's not even funny. Looking on a google map. It's peanuts even by Charlotte standards.

 

Now Uptown, like this, is throwing up really great quality buildings. Please, show many any city that is building skyscrapers that is fabulous at the base....

 

In London. Look how pretty:

 

Oh, but that entire area is DREADFUL and dead. Here's a picture of the base (but the entire area is blahhhhh)

 

Ya'll are looking at pictures of Glossy renderings for other cities and it's still new to see. Believe me. They are not throwing up better buildings.

 

 

DC is throwing up amazing, amazing high quality buildings everywhere. BUT. That's DC. Outside of NYC, DC and I assume, but I don't know, a few others like maybe Chicago and SF and LA.... Charlotte's projects are good. Great, even. Denver, Seattle, Nashville, Austin. I ain't buying the hype with their new projects. (Which btw I find it odd that downtown Nashville is building sooo many residential, yet Charlotte's uptown is someone adding more units and people now, last year and future projects. This was per a Local Downtown Nashville publication I don't feel like looking up right now).

 

I can't think of any bad buildings built recently in Charlotte. Clock Tower I guess. Embassy Suites. The rest are good to great. Especially compared to cities like Atlanta, Nashville, etc. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by AirNostrumMAD

[TheOneRJ]

4 hours ago, Hushpuppy321 said:

Gonna pass Charlotte in what?  

High-Rise Residential Construction in Charlotte has no chance ever of catching/surpassing Austin - But as far as Office Construction, CLT is & will hold it’s own against Austin.  Charlotte’s a vey business oriented city.

Nashville won’t catch either I’d agree too but does definitely has a more City feel & look because it’s a lot of the Center City Buildings are spread out and more visible across the flatter (less-tree canopied) landscape than CLT.  Also - Nashville has more Interstate highways and much more tourism too.  

There was an earlier conversation on the Highways thread about NC Metro’s feeling less urban than other States Metro’s But with NC actually being much larger overall.  The massive tree canopy throughout CLT and greater NC Metro areas does tend it to give off much less of a big city feel.

Charlotte leads Austin and Nashville in center city population and tourism. 
 

CBD Population
Charlotte - 30,000

Nashville - 12,000

Austin - 11,000

Annual Tourists

Charlotte - 28.3 million

Austin - 27.4 million

Nashville - 15.2 million

As I said, both are playing catch up. 

[15895]

^ To be fair,  that # is Uptown + Southend for population

 

Uptown is around 23K I believe in 2 Sq. Miles. Downtown Nashville is 2 Sq. Miles and I think the 12,000 is accurate from what I've seen.

 

Austin is 1 Sq. Mile. So it's density levels are around the same as uptown. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by AirNostrumMAD

[KJHburg]

Yall better never mention my little parking hut again as a thread de-railer  for this Nashville Austin CLT discussion tops my little hut and is a worthy discussion just probably not here.  Maybe a Charlotte Versus.....Thread should be started.   

anyway part of my  2020 predictions for Legacy would include a NON office tower.  Unless an anchor could be found which is still a possibility I think a hotel or apartment tower or maybe a combo of both gets underway in the 2nd Legacy block closer to the stadium.  

 

 

 

[Guest]

Just now, KJHburg said:

Yall better never mention my little parking hut again as a thread de-railer  for this Nashville Austin CLT discussion tops my little hut and is a worthy discussion just probably not here.  Maybe a Charlotte Versus.....Thread should be started.   

anyway part of my  2020 predictions for Legacy would include a NON office tower.  Unless an anchor could be found which is still a possibility I think a hotel or apartment tower or maybe a combo of both gets underway in the 2nd Legacy block closer to the stadium.  

 

 

 

I think the final future buildout will be 1 more office, one residential and two hotels. 

[Richhamleigh, DC]

5 hours ago, Crucial_Infra said:

Population, number and size of skyscrapers, economic clout. 

Edited...I just saw Ricky Davis say this too....Austin (and Nashville, and Atlanta....) has just two things Charlotte lacks.  A major research university and a state capital.   We can do something about #1 and unless the Carolinas merge, it's unlikely anything will change about #2. 

However, the fact that North Carolina has multiple centers of high growth puts us ahead of Georgia and Tennessee where all their eggs are going into one basket (so to speak).   NC has something GA and TN do not have...the highest mountains, and best beaches outside Florida, in the East.  NC should be focusing on intracity rail as well that can get tourists between our major airports and our business, education centers, and tourism destinations.  We also need to get "North Carolina" more prominently displayed at the end of films and TV shows filmed in the state.  Georgia learned from NC's film and TV mistakes and is milking all the free promotion and publicity these bring.  Filming locations in NC are just better.  Time to take it back.  Amazon can move it's film division into one of the new Legacy Towers, complete with signage.

Edited December 27, 2019 by Phillydog

[KJHburg]

Throwback Thursday  from KJ's vault of old photos from the ashes of the Charlotte Observer a new phoenix arises.

 

[SydneyCarton]

43 minutes ago, Phillydog said:

Edited...I just saw Ricky Davis say this too....Austin (and Nashville, and Atlanta....) has just two things Charlotte lacks.  A major research university and a state capital.   We can do something about #1 and unless the Carolinas merge, it's unlikely anything will change about #2. 

However, the fact that North Carolina has multiple centers of high growth puts us ahead of Georgia and Tennessee where all their eggs are going into one basket (so to speak).   NC has something GA and do not have...the highest mountains, and best beaches outside Florida, in the East.  NC should be focusing on intracity rail as well that can get tourists between our major airports and our business, education centers, and tourism destinations.  We also need to get "North Carolina" more prominently displayed at the end of films and TV shows filmed in the state.  Georgia learned from NC's film and TV mistakes and is milking all the free promotion and publicity these bring.  

I agree.  NC’s main cities are in a compact area.  Further, the economies of Charlotte and the Triangle really complement each other.

[Richhamleigh, DC]

7 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I agree.  NC’s main cities are in a compact area.  Further, the economies of Charlotte and the Triangle really complement each other.

That's exactly true!  Now, imagine you could go between these two cities in 1.5 hours via high-speed rail.  

Edited December 27, 2019 by Phillydog

[KJHburg]

Photos from Loopnet listing of the BOAT at Legacy since Highwoods bought it they are doing more marketing to get the rest of the space leased up which is not too much as it 85% leased.

https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/620-S-Tryon-St-Charlotte-NC/7137866/

1. Business in the day   2.  Party at night LOL

[SydneyCarton]

I honestly don't see the problem with this complex.  I think that it's beautiful.   

[Desert Power]

That garage looks so bad....