Manchester Development

[Brent114]

Fence is going up at the Plant Zero site.  3rd street is closed off for demo. 
 

Demo has been slow going here but it has been consistent.   Now the building will be gone this time next week  

[I miss RVA]

2 hours ago, Brent114 said:

Fence is going up at the Plant Zero site.  3rd street is closed off for demo. 
 

Demo has been slow going here but it has been consistent.   Now the building will be gone this time next week  

Coolness!!! Glad they're moving forward on this!

Speaking of (VERY) nearby demos - what's the progress so far on the silos?

[I miss RVA]

@RVABizSenseMikeis reporting in today's RBS that the owners of two large properties in the southeastern part of Manchester have filed for upzoning to TOD-1, which, no doubt, can be seen as the precursor to high-density residential development.

The parcels in question are the entire city block at 400 Stockton Street (bounded by E 4th, E 5th, Stockton & Everett streets) and 507 Marx Street, between E 5th and E 6th and along E 6th between Albany Avenue and Marx Street.

The southeastern part of Manchester -- particularly the Maury Street corridor -- looks primed to explode with development in the next few years.

• Tom Papa already planning an apartment building at 500 Maury
• A rezoning request for 600 Maury was approved in 2022
• Two two other sites - 301 Maury and 401 Maury and  - have been purchased by out-of-town developers
• Another site at Marx Street and Commerce Road is currently under consideration for upzoning.

Manchester and Scott's both continue to be red-hot (dare I say "white-hot"!!!)

From today's Richmond BizSense:

https://richmondbizsense.com/2023/05/15/two-manchester-sites-totaling-3-acres-up-for-rezoning-with-residential-in-mind/

[I miss RVA]

@RVABizSenseMikehas new reporting in today's RBS that the Richmond Planning Commission has voted to approve a request for upzoning to TOD-1 for three blocks of the four-city-block square campus of the former Overnite Transportation Company in Manchester. The current owner - TForce Freight put all four blocks - including Overnite's HQ building on Semmes Avenue - up for sale last year. Apparently the entire campus is still on the market, though it does not appear that a buyer has yet to materialize.

The only block not included in the upzoning request is the block that includes the small house on McDonough Street owned by the young realtor couple. The house and land at 1006 McDonough is the only parcel in the four square blocks that TForce does not own.  (Makes me wonder what will happen there and why TForce didn't also ask for upzoning for that block absent the property at 1006?)

What with the current owner filing for TOD-1 zoning, I wonder if that means they may pull the property off the market and develop it themselves - or - if this is simply a preliminary step to have TOD-1 zoning in place to sweeten the deal for any potential buyers? @wrldcoupe4and @upzoningisgood-- what are your thoughts?

The measure is expected to be voted on by City Council at their May 22 meeting.

I'm still holding out hope that this campus can be developed into something EPIC - with multiple large (read: buildings that reach double-digit stories) buildings, a great mix of residential, commercial, office -- even a hotel -- and ground-level grocery and retail -- in other words, create a legitimate "downtown Manchester" - and pack in the density, bring height, develop a good variety of uses. I'm guessing that B-4 zoning would have been out of the question? AND - I'm also guessing that once the land is rezoned to TOD-1, if developers wanted to go above 12 stories it wouldn't be too difficult to get an SUP approved, given the location likely wouldn't lend itself to all that much NIMBY pushback. Mind you, I'm also concerned that the fourth block wasn't included in the filing.

From today's Richmond BizSense:

https://richmondbizsense.com/2023/05/16/dormant-tforce-campus-gets-rezoning-nod-from-planning-commission/

 

Edited May 16, 2023 by I miss RVA

[wrldcoupe4]

I suspect they were being proactive on the rezoning to help with being attractive to developers. 

[I miss RVA]

2 hours ago, wrldcoupe4 said:

I suspect they were being proactive on the rezoning to help with being attractive to developers. 

Thanks, Coupe.

Makes sense to do it that way. Get ahead of the curve and sweeten the pot of gold, so to speak.

Another question: what do you make of them leaving the fourth - largely empty/undeveloped block (only that little house on the prairie sits there) out of the upzoning filing? Could they not have requested rezoning for all but the land where that house sit? Can you do anything with "air rights" -- or is that just either a myth or a NYC thing?

Edited May 16, 2023 by I miss RVA

[rjp212]

Here's a link to the listing.  I know this is only conceptual, but I hope whoever purchases it is a lot more creative than this.

[upzoningisgood]

1 hour ago, I miss RVA said:

Thanks, Coupe.

Makes sense to do it that way. Get ahead of the curve and sweeten the pot of gold, so to speak.

Another question: what do you make of them leaving the fourth - largely empty/undeveloped block (only that little house on the prairie sits there) out of the upzoning filing? Could they not have requested rezoning for all but the land where that house sit? Can you do anything with "air rights" -- or is that just either a myth or a NYC thing?

My guess is the holdout complicated rezoning that block. I assume the strategy is to wait for that owner to sell, buy the parcel, then rezone the whole block. Otherwise you’re wasting your time on the rezoning because TOD-type midrises need all the land they can get for the numbers to work, so the land would be worth much more if the whole block was rezoned as opposed to there being a cutout . Additionally, one holdout parcel can really screw with the architecture if it’s in the wrong place, and in the middle of the street is a tough spot. 

[I miss RVA]

2 hours ago, upzoningisgood said:

My guess is the holdout complicated rezoning that block. I assume the strategy is to wait for that owner to sell, buy the parcel, then rezone the whole block. Otherwise you’re wasting your time on the rezoning because TOD-type midrises need all the land they can get for the numbers to work, so the land would be worth much more if the whole block was rezoned as opposed to there being a cutout . Additionally, one holdout parcel can really screw with the architecture if it’s in the wrong place, and in the middle of the street is a tough spot. 

Thanks, @upzoningisgood-- that makes sense.

And to your final point - yeah... that little house is just about mid-block - couldn't ask for a worse location. 

[eandslee]

10 minutes ago, I miss RVA said:

Thanks, @upzoningisgood-- that makes sense.

And to your final point - yeah... that little house is just about mid-block - couldn't ask for a worse location. 

I think that the owners of that little house know it and I don't think they have any desire to sell...nor do I think they will take an offer...unfortunately.  

[I miss RVA]

3 hours ago, rjp212 said:

Here's a link to the listing.  I know this is only conceptual, but I hope whoever purchases it is a lot more creative than this.

This is a really good start for something conceptual - but I totally agree. We need a LOT more than just this. And what's with the three-story duplexes on the fourth block (that's the block where the couple and their little house are located)... Duplexes? Give me a break. Build around them if they won't sell. Hem them in with height and density. Since they're realtors, I'm sure they more or less know what they're doing. I just hope and pray they don't screw this thing up. A legit "downtown Manchester" could be EPIC.

[rjp212]

I was catching up on the Manchester Alliance minutes and noticed they again decided to "vehemently oppose" the Avery Hall project.   Exhausting!   However, it led me on a search to Avery Halls website and noticed a more detailed rendering.

[I miss RVA]

8 minutes ago, rjp212 said:

I was catching up on the Manchester Alliance minutes and noticed they again decided to "vehemently oppose" the Avery Hall project.   Exhausting!   However, it led me on a search to Avery Halls website and noticed a more detailed rendering.

This is simply gorgeous! Gorgeous! We SO need this built!

Re: M.A. - I'm sorry, but WTF is their major malfunction??? Do they give ANY kind of substantive reason for "vehemently" opposing this development? I swear to God... like you said - exhausting! (And in my case, deleterious to my blood pressure) ... Is it still the "Legends" factor - or have they just decided all of a sudden be "anti-growth"?

  We need to get this project built. This one - and Hourigan's epic tower on the Silos site - are THE game changers for Manchester! Couple these two projects with -- HOPEFULLY -- something epic on the site of the former Overnite Transportation campus - and I don't think it's that much of a stretch to say that Manchester will become THE premier section of Richmond, hands down, bar none - and this would give Manchester a measure of separation from Scott's from both a development/economic growth standpoint and a population growth standpoint.

Honestly, I don't think it's a reach that the neighborhood's transition from down-at-the-heel, drug and crime-laden poor neighborhood of mainly vacant lots, empty storefronts (Hull Street) and old, decrepit and in many cases empty industrial buildings and warehouses to a beacon of urbanism, a dazzling new high-density, high-impact urban core neighborhood with a huge population boom, huge construction boom, complete resurrection of Hull Street, influx of businesses, retail, and even its own distinctive skyline might actually attract national attention, particularly among urbanists/urbanologists, CRE folks, etc.

I could see various publications featuring "Richmond's Manchester - from Dog Town to Boom Town" on the cover with a gorgeous view of the MANCHESTER skyline taken from north of the river. Or maybe the same, only as a YouTube video. WOW... can you imagine?

Friends, this goal is within our reach! This is something that within the next decade can actually happen.

[whw53]

Whatever happened to the civic spirit of this country that  built and took pride in the evolution and expansion of urban form? It's amazing to look back on headlines from a hundred years ago - every groundbreaking was considered a triumph, a point of social pride. I think we have a lot of people now who are disconnected from the local economy or do not identify with the city who yet inhabit these neighborhoods. They don't care about the city in general, they already have it made - they just care about their own habitat and how to control it.

Edited May 17, 2023 by whw53

[I miss RVA]

2 hours ago, whw53 said:

Whatever happened to the civic spirit of this country that  built and took pride in the evolution and expansion of urban form? It's amazing to look back on headlines from a hundred years ago - every groundbreaking was considered a triumph, a point of social pride. I think we have a lot of people now who are disconnected from the local economy or do not identify with the city who yet inhabit these neighborhoods. They don't care about the city in general, they already have it made - they just care about their own habitat and how to control it.

 !!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS!!

You're right - every groundbreaking was a cause for celebration 100-plus years ago. It drew crowds. The news media (newspapers in those days) gathered. It was a big deal. As you said - every new development was a matter of civic pride. Every step forward that Richmond took was a matter civic pride. 

What you said - "the evolution and expansion of the urban form" - absolutely beautiful. And when you think about it, this is EXACTLY what's been happening in Richmond now for close to a decade.

I'm 100% of the believe that we HAVE to fight for this project. We can't ignore the NIMBYs on this one. They're obviously organized and we all know they can be relentless. Whatever it takes to get this project built - we have to do our parts, whether it's emailing or calling (or both) the Planning Commission and members of City Council, showing up for public hearings, standing up, speaking up, and going toe-to-toe if we have to with these NIMBYs. We MUST win on this one - because if we do, it's a HUGE win for Richmond.

Let's roll up our sleeves and get to work.

Edited May 17, 2023 by I miss RVA

[BigBobbyG]

8 hours ago, I miss RVA said:

 !!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS!!

You're right - every groundbreaking was a cause for celebration 100-plus years ago. It drew crowds. The news media (newspapers in those days) gathered. It was a big deal. As you said - every new development was a matter of civic pride. Every step forward that Richmond took was a matter civic pride. 

What you said - "the evolution and expansion of the urban form" - absolutely beautiful. And when you think about it, this is EXACTLY what's been happening in Richmond now for close to a decade.

I'm 100% of the believe that we HAVE to fight for this project. We can't ignore the NIMBYs on this one. They're obviously organized and we all know they can be relentless. Whatever it takes to get this project built - we have to do our parts, whether it's emailing or calling (or both) the Planning Commission and members of City Council, showing up for public hearings, standing up, speaking up, and going toe-to-toe if we have to with these NIMBYs. We MUST win on this one - because if we do, it's a HUGE win for Richmond.

Let's roll up our sleeves and get to work.

Do we currently know when the "big battles" for this one are? I want to get this on the radar of the RVA Yimbys group. They have been pretty vocal so far with things like parking minimums and that grove apartment building.

[rjp212]

This is pulled from the neighborhood minutes:

• SUP 301 W 6th Street “Avery Hall” - introduced to City council this week, going to planning commission on June 5th.  

  • Back in January we sent a letter opposing the SUP based on our 5 conditions.  Why is there a confusion on our position?  Asked many times and got no response, then sent a letter saying we’re opposed.  We are going to resend the letter saying we haven’t heard from AH and that there not meeting our conditions.  We want to be supportive of our neighborhood.  

  • Other communities are concerned about smaller buildings 

  • Concerns about people pushing certain comments and raising their voices 

  • Concerns about blocking the view of Legend, but also think of the precedent

  • Motion to vehemently oppose AH by the members

    • 19 members for this

    • 1 opposed 

    • 3 abstain

    • Can we also include that information in the letter to City Council

  • What’s the difference between a 12 story and a 17 story?  200 more units so we should be more focused on infrastructure. How do you alleviate the pressure on the roads, etc.?  

  • Many empty lots - what are protecting?  

  • Affordable housing - none 

  • Make it a livable community for everyone

I need to become more involved in the community. While the MA does a great job with civic outreach in the neighborhood, I don't see how they can write a letter in support of Silos but not this.    

[BigBobbyG]

30 minutes ago, rjp212 said:

This is pulled from the neighborhood minutes:

• SUP 301 W 6th Street “Avery Hall” - introduced to City council this week, going to planning commission on June 5th.  

  • Back in January we sent a letter opposing the SUP based on our 5 conditions.  Why is there a confusion on our position?  Asked many times and got no response, then sent a letter saying we’re opposed.  We are going to resend the letter saying we haven’t heard from AH and that there not meeting our conditions.  We want to be supportive of our neighborhood.  

  • Other communities are concerned about smaller buildings 

  • Concerns about people pushing certain comments and raising their voices 

  • Concerns about blocking the view of Legend, but also think of the precedent

  • Motion to vehemently oppose AH by the members

    • 19 members for this

    • 1 opposed 

    • 3 abstain

    • Can we also include that information in the letter to City Council

  • What’s the difference between a 12 story and a 17 story?  200 more units so we should be more focused on infrastructure. How do you alleviate the pressure on the roads, etc.?  

  • Many empty lots - what are protecting?  

  • Affordable housing - none 

  • Make it a livable community for everyone

I need to become more involved in the community. While the MA does a great job with civic outreach in the neighborhood, I don't see how they can write a letter in support of Silos but not this.    

Thanks for the info! I don't know the dynamics of the MA but this sounds like the owner of Legend going on a crusade to persuade the other members. The fact that "Concerns about blocking the view of Legend, but also think of the precedent" was placed so far down in the list is rich too considering (in my opinion) that's the main reason these people are up in arms.

Welp time to get writing emails of support and I will send this info over to that RVA Yimbys group!

[I miss RVA]

On 5/17/2023 at 8:24 AM, BigBobbyG said:

Do we currently know when the "big battles" for this one are? I want to get this on the radar of the RVA Yimbys group. They have been pretty vocal so far with things like parking minimums and that grove apartment building.

I'd definitely keep an eye on what M.A. is doing - see @rjp212's post. The big battles where the NIMBYs will be screeching like hyenas  would be: 1.)  public hearings before the Planning Commission (Avery Hall has filed for an SUP to exceed the height limit of the zoned land, which is at 13 stories (ironically - not sure how/why it's 13 & not 12 aside from the fact that I don't believe it's within a TOD-1 boundary), and 2.) the City Council meeting when the SUP request comes up for a vote for final approval.

@BigBobbyG--  so you know how to get in touch with the folks at YIMBY? AWESOME!! I'm on their email list and have checked out their website, but I don't see anywhere or any way in which to communicate with them directly. I want to reach out to them as well to get them to put this on their radar and to get UBER active about it - because we NEED YIMBY's involvement on this! Would you mind posting their contact info here in this thread so we can also reach out to them? It is CRITICAL that YIMBY be on board with this and add to the push to get this project approved.

Other ways we can fight for this project: In @rjp212's post about what M.A. is doing - they're drafting a letter to City Council. WE SHOULD DO THE SAME!! Not sure how we could/would do it as a community (perhaps YIMBY could handle that from a community level while we do it individually) - but we should write the council writ large - AND - we should make sure to communicate with BOTH your own specific council representative (if you reside in the city proper) - AND - the council rep for that district in Manchester (and we ALL can do that one!).

Who is the council rep for that district? Let's find out, post it, and start writing!

What's more - we need to be active in writing the Planning Commission in support of the project. Whether email or good, old-fashioned Pony Express (or both!) - but we need to communicate with them and put on as much of a pressure campaign ih support of the project as the NIMBYs will put on in opposition. Whether it's via letter, e-mail, phone calls - WE MUST COMMUNICATE OUR SUPPORT IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE! Y'all know DAMN well I'll have emails sent to both the Planning Commission and City Council by the end of today.

Friend, I firmly feel that THIS is the project that will be the "lynchpin" development that will set the tone for the future of both Manchester and Richmond. The reason the NIMBYs oppose it SO strongly is because it is a "big city" development. And by that, I DON'T mean because the developers are from NYC. Rather, this is the kind of development that larger cities - including our direct competitors in North Carolina as well as Austin, Nashville, etc. - and other bigger places like Atlanta - have long since been enjoying. This project - along with Hourigan's - is GAME CHANGING for Manchester and Richmond. To me the battle lines are clear and simple: the NIMBYs want to stop it because it will irrevocably change the development dynamic in Manchester and Richmond. A "big city" development - if it goes forward and is successful - will be the key that unlocks the treasure chest of MORE "big city" developments -- because no doubt, particularly national-level developers will see the success that an Avery Hall or a Hourigan has with a LEGITIMATELY large-scale residential project in Richmond - and they'll see ample opportunity to join the party, knowing there is plenty of money to be made - particularly if we land some heavy-hitting job-producing relo's.

This is EXACTLY what we want!! This is PRECISELY why it is absolutely CRITICAL that Avery Hall's project goes forward, gets built, and sets the stage for MUCH bigger things to come.

Maybe I'm pie-in-the-sky, being a layman not connected to the CRE industry - but I can't help but believe that the success of the Avery Hall towers - and of Hourigan's - will so alter the dynamic that it will positively impact what might get built on the four-block former Overnite campus, if for no other reason than success with Avery Hall and Hourigan will send out a bright beacon to other developers that RVA is a damn good place in which to do business - and - that Manchester in particular is a HOT commodity in terms of where to develop. I see GREAT things down the road for Manchester if Avery Hall builds.

This is a Rubicon that Richmond MUST cross. It's one that the NIMBYs are desperately trying to hold the line against, and in short, WE MUST WIN THIS ONE!

Guys, let's do everything we can to help get this project across the finish line! Let's find a way to get the folks at YIMBY on board. Let's call, write and communicate our support for this project with the Planning Commission and City Council.  LET'S MAKE THIS HAPPEN!!

Edited May 18, 2023 by I miss RVA

[I miss RVA]

.

20 hours ago, rjp212 said:

Here's a link to the listing.  I know this is only conceptual, but I hope whoever purchases it is a lot more creative than this.

 

I was just circling back to check comments in RBS, and Bruce dropped a VERY interesting dime. Check this out:

Bruce Milam

 30 minutes ago

This is ramming through the system quickly, apparently in preparation for a quick closing? I’ve heard some wonderful rumors about the future usage. Big things ahead for the City but especially Manchester!

@wrldcoupe4 - by chance have you been hearing any kind of yummy rumors as well?

[whw53]

RVA YIMBY has meeting scheduled this Saturday at 2pm at Hatch Local Food Hall. And ...they were crazy enough to make me a chapter lead. I'm still getting on boarded and there different types of descision makers as part of the group but i will take it on as a responsibilty of mine to relay information over here as needed. 

[I miss RVA]

9 minutes ago, whw53 said:

RVA YIMBY has meeting scheduled this Saturday at 2pm at Hatch Local Food Hall. And ...they were crazy enough to make me a chapter lead. I'm still getting on boarded and there different types of descision makers as part of the group but i will take it on as a responsibilty of mine to relay information over here as needed. 

THANK YOU!!! I can't say it loudly enough - THANK YOU for doing this!

Yes, by all means - PLEASE get them COMPLETELY on board with what's going on with the Avery Hall project. It's going before the Planning Commission on June 5th. M.A. has had a huge head start to organize and strategize - so we need the YIMBY folks to ramp up their efforts QUICKLY and take this on right away. Time is of the essence in getting some kind of organized support for this project out there - and to spread the word for all pro-development folks to jump on the band-wagon, fight back against the NIMBYs and to fight for the approval of this project!

Please push this project with YIMBY as hard as you can. Hopefully they're already aware of what's going on - but it's now the urgency of the matter that's in play.

[BigBobbyG]

I'm just spitballing here but another avenue of "attack" might be to send emails to some of the recent businesses that have opened and asking them to support this. I'm thinking of Hatch Local food hall, Benchtop Brewing, and Basic City Beer Company specifically. I feel like all of them would love the increased foot traffic that these apartment complexes would bring. Getting them to send emails of support might do a lot to counter MA on this.

What I don't know however, is whether they are already Manchester Alliance members, is there any way to find that out?

The reason I had this thought is that I saw that Sincero in Hatch Local is closing sadly, now I don't know if the lack of customers is why they are closing but it did cross my mind. I think (hope) that Hatch has come into it's own lately and more people are visiting but I have been in there on some days when it's pretty dead.

[I miss RVA]

4 hours ago, BigBobbyG said:

I'm just spitballing here but another avenue of "attack" might be to send emails to some of the recent businesses that have opened and asking them to support this. I'm thinking of Hatch Local food hall, Benchtop Brewing, and Basic City Beer Company specifically. I feel like all of them would love the increased foot traffic that these apartment complexes would bring. Getting them to send emails of support might do a lot to counter MA on this.

What I don't know however, is whether they are already Manchester Alliance members, is there any way to find that out?

The reason I had this thought is that I saw that Sincero in Hatch Local is closing sadly, now I don't know if the lack of customers is why they are closing but it did cross my mind. I think (hope) that Hatch has come into it's own lately and more people are visiting but I have been in there on some days when it's pretty dead.

Outstanding idea, @BigBobbyG. 

What's more - perhaps for anyone who lives in the neighborhood and would be willing to do so, a personal visit as well to these businesses to "press the flesh" so to speak and really tout the benefits in a personal, friendly, persuasive way. Man - this makes me wish I lived there right now because I'd gladly take up that mantle and pay visits to the local businesses pushing for their support - really applying a personal touch. 

Either way - getting the local businesses on board is a great idea.

There has to be a way to find out if any of them are M.A. members. Tbh - even if they are - a personal visit to said business to have good dialogue and conversation about the issue might bear a lot of good fruit.

Would YIMBY have the resources to also pursue this along with us?

Edited May 17, 2023 by I miss RVA

[eandslee]

It passed!

https://www.wric.com/news/local-news/richmond/richmond-rezones-two-blocks-of-parking-in-manchester-to-mixed-use-development/