Butterworth Dump err Landfill

[GRDadof3]

It looks like this is actually happening, maybe finished and operational as early as next Summer:

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2015/08/solar_panels_renewable_energy.html

 

[GR8scott]

It looks like this is actually happening, maybe finished and operational as early as next Summer:

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2015/08/solar_panels_renewable_energy.html

 

Good to see and its in a highly visible location that apparently can not be used for anything. I would like to see a large windmill there are well, what a great PR thing and also cost savings. I would also be nice to better utilize the riverfront there and better connect Millennium park to downtown 

[GRDadof3]

Good to see and its in a highly visible location that apparently can not be used for anything. I would like to see a large windmill there are well, what a great PR thing and also cost savings. I would also be nice to better utilize the riverfront there and better connect Millennium park to downtown 

There's probably at least some portion of all that land that isn't capped landfill, where they could do a few wind turbines.

[arcturus]

' The Butterworth Solar Project is expected to be up and running before the end of 2016.'  Hope they're on track, would hate to see them lose out on those gloriously sunny months of December and January.  

http://www.grbj.com/articles/84077-citys-butterworth-solar-project-receives-final-approval

[GRDadof3]

4 hours ago, arcturus said:

' The Butterworth Solar Project is expected to be up and running before the end of 2016.'  Hope they're on track, would hate to see them lose out on those gloriously sunny months of December and January.  

http://www.grbj.com/articles/84077-citys-butterworth-solar-project-receives-final-approval

I drove by this the other day and wondered what the holdup was. 

[arcturus]

Guess we got our answer.  

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/02/solar_company_working_on_forme.html#incart_river_index

The area's experience with anything solar hasn't been exactly stellar but at least the Chinese converted the United Solar Ovonic facility into alloy wheel manufacturing.  FYI the building uses conventional power sources.

[GRDadof3]

13 hours ago, arcturus said:

Guess we got our answer.  

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/02/solar_company_working_on_forme.html#incart_river_index

The area's experience with anything solar hasn't been exactly stellar but at least the Chinese converted the United Solar Ovonic facility into alloy wheel manufacturing.  FYI the building uses conventional power sources.

That is interesting. I guess Haris Alibasic at the city of GR's Office of Sustainability who was spearheading this project, left for another job in Florida:

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/01/grand_rapids_city_manager_shuf.html

[joeDowntown]

I hope they take this opportunity to rethink the property. While a solar array would be awesome, Grand Action is looking to build a soccer complex (not the stadium). To me, this is a perfect spot. Soccer fields would not break through the cap, the only thing they'd need to do is figure out a spot for restrooms, maybe adjacent to the actual landfill. 

Can parking be placed on the cap? Soccer tournaments require a lot of parking (in and out traffic between games). It would be a nice little (or not so little) economic boost for area hotels (probably not downtown as they are not an affordable option for travel soccer clubs). I would see the Rivertown area hotels benefiting most in the short term.

Anecdotally, I spent last weekend in Ft. Wayne at a "small" soccer tournament  with me indoor 11v11 field with 25 teams  figure about 16 rooms per team, 2 night stay plus dining and entertainment. That's 800 room nights for a one field tournament. Imagine a 20 field tournament, 3 times a year. And other than the cost of parking, restrooms, irrigation and getting he fields ready (flat, seeding, goals for each field), it's a tiny capital outlay. 

Second on my list for soccer facilities is the superfund site at 4 mile and East Beltline. It's a bit smaller but it think I calculated 14 full size fields on that site. 

And field space is at a premium  it's hard for clubs to handle their growth with the lack of available fields.

I hope Grand Action or the Sports Commission are looking at these options  land acquisition would have to be the biggest cost. Also, US Soccer has contributed money in the past to cities cleaning up superfund sites for soccer fields. 

Joe

 

[GRDadof3]

10 minutes ago, joeDowntown said:

I hope they take this opportunity to rethink the property. While a solar array would be awesome, Grand Action is looking to build a soccer complex (not the stadium). To me, this is a perfect spot. Soccer fields would not break through the cap, the only thing they'd need to do is figure out a spot for restrooms, maybe adjacent to the actual landfill. 

Can parking be placed on the cap? Soccer tournaments require a lot of parking (in and out traffic between games). It would be a nice little (or not so little) economic boost for area hotels (probably not downtown as they are not an affordable option for travel soccer clubs). I would see the Rivertown area hotels benefiting most in the short term.

Anecdotally, I spent last weekend in Ft. Wayne at a "small" soccer tournament  with me indoor 11v11 field with 25 teams  figure about 16 rooms per team, 2 night stay plus dining and entertainment. That's 800 room nights for a one field tournament. Imagine a 20 field tournament, 3 times a year. And other than the cost of parking, restrooms, irrigation and getting he fields ready (flat, seeding, goals for each field), it's a tiny capital outlay. 

Second on my list for soccer facilities is the superfund site at 4 mile and East Beltline. It's a bit smaller but it think I calculated 14 full size fields on that site. 

And field space is at a premium  it's hard for clubs to handle their growth with the lack of available fields.

I hope Grand Action or the Sports Commission are looking at these options  land acquisition would have to be the biggest cost. Also, US Soccer has contributed money in the past to cities cleaning up superfund sites for soccer fields. 

Joe

 

 

According to the article, since the solar company seems to have disappeared, they're looking at a much smaller scale solar project here. 

I'm no expert, but the cap is clay, which would mean that you'd have to bring in fill over top of it to build a parking lot that didn't become a big mud bowl. You could even do it in gravel I would think. Same with the fields I would think, fill and then topsoil then seed or sod. As far as the bathroom goes, I don't really see a problem. You could do it slab-on-grade and have the waste go to an above ground tank maybe? Not rocket science.

[arcturus]

4 hours ago, GRDadof3 said:

That is interesting. I guess Haris Alibasic at the city of GR's Office of Sustainability who was spearheading this project, left for another job in Florida:

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/01/grand_rapids_city_manager_shuf.html

Is the office still around?  The web site is active but still links that dude for contact info.  No mention of a successor and the article suggests possible consolidation.  Probably a wise move based on the current political environment.

[JoeSchmo]

Bump.

Just out of curiousity, does anybody know if there has been anything about the future of this site? 

(It seems like this has been off the radar for a long while now?)

[metrogrkid]

Could all the City slow-dragging/hand-wringing about finding a spot to relocate all the ugly Public Works facilities on Market Street be alleviated with the Butterworth dump site?  I mean the  201 Market/Flaherty & Collins proposal coupled with its nearby Studio Park sister would be a definitive WOW for South Downtown; heck all the current ugliness would seem to be ideal for maximizing a dump that no one will miss.  Egad. Tic tic tic . . . . 

[joeDowntown]

7 hours ago, metrogrkid said:

Could all the City slow-dragging/hand-wringing about finding a spot to relocate all the ugly Public Works facilities on Market Street be alleviated with the Butterworth dump site?  I mean the  201 Market/Flaherty & Collins proposal coupled with its nearby Studio Park sister would be a definitive WOW for South Downtown; heck all the current ugliness would seem to be ideal for maximizing a dump that no one will miss.  Egad. Tic tic tic . . . . 

I don’t think anything substantial (or even small) can be built on that site because of the toxic waste in the ground. Heck, I don’t even think they can plant trees. 

The solar panel array seemed like an interesting use. I also think a soccer facility where they could host tournaments would be nice. 

Joe

[GRDadof3]

2 hours ago, joeDowntown said:

I don’t think anything substantial (or even small) can be built on that site because of the toxic waste in the ground. Heck, I don’t even think they can plant trees. 

The solar panel array seemed like an interesting use. I also think a soccer facility where they could host tournaments would be nice. 

Joe

I believe even the solar array was going to sit on concrete slabs that weren't anchored into the ground. It's an EPA disaster site and you can't penetrate the clay cap for anything. When the environmental guy at the city left a few years ago though, it seems the solar project left with him (he was championing it). 

[cstonesparty]

Could public works buildings go there if they're on slabs?  Could do solar on top of those?  

[GRDadof3]

20 hours ago, cstonesparty said:

Could public works buildings go there if they're on slabs?  Could do solar on top of those?  

Uhh no. Not slab on grade with footers, literally slabs sitting on top of the ground. You can't park vehicles on them, especially heavy vehicles. They also can't hold the weight of garage type structures on top of them. 

The solar array was a great idea. Wonder if it's revivable. 

 

[Raildude's dad]

15 hours ago, GRDadof3 said:

Uhh no. Not slab on grade with footers, literally slabs sitting on top of the ground. You can't park vehicles on them, especially heavy vehicles. They also can't hold the weight of garage type structures on top of them. 

The solar array was a great idea. Wonder if it's revivable. 

 

Not so. The buildings on Turner, east side, north of the Ann Street off ramp north of United Rental are all built on the HB Brown Superfund site.  It is  a capped site, vapor barriers under the floors (I'm pretty sure)  etc. They are all warehouses, heavy floor loads. If you're near there you will small signs in the front ares that say "don't dig here - epa site" or something like that. It can be done and apparently makes money for the builder / owner.

[JoeSchmo]

https://cumulis.epa.gov/supercpad/SiteProfiles/index.cfm?fuseaction=second.schedule&id=0502576

According to the above link, the "site is ready for re-use and redevelopment" as of 2014.  This was about when the solar project was being considered.  I dont know what re-use and redevelopment allows for specifically.

EDIT: Going to the redevelopment tab on the EPA site, it looks like the only development that was discussed with the EPA was in regards very specifically to the solar project.

Edited June 27, 2019 by JoeSchmo

[Guest]

I was under the impression that old landfills couldn't be built on due to settling/decomposition/moving of garbage.  I also believe they emit a lot of methane as a byproduct of decomposition.  Still I wonder if they site could be built on at SOME point.  I wonder the same thing about the dump at 5 Mile/Beltline.  They could at least put a park there or a disc golf course or something.   

Butterworth dump would be perfect for a bunch of soccer fields for travelling soccer leagues.  That area by 196 (not sure if that's still part of the dump) has some great views of DT.

It's also worth noting the site is right across the river from the crap plant...

[Raildude's dad]

Turner north of the RR tracks on the east side is all old city dump. The United Wholesale Grocery on the SE corner of Ann is all aluminum construction to lighten the building load. It has a concrete slab floor. Slabs can be strengthened to prevent differential settlement .

[GRDadof3]

19 hours ago, Raildude's dad said:

Not so. The buildings on Turner, east side, north of the Ann Street off ramp north of United Rental are all built on the HB Brown Superfund site.  It is  a capped site, vapor barriers under the floors (I'm pretty sure)  etc. They are all warehouses, heavy floor loads. If you're near there you will small signs in the front ares that say "don't dig here - epa site" or something like that. It can be done and apparently makes money for the builder / owner.

Since the beginning of time I've been told the Butterworth dump site couldn't be built on with any kind of buildings. It might be one of those urban myths like "you can't add rapids to the Grand River downtown because there are too many contaminants you'll dig up." 

[Raildude's dad]

There may be such a restriction on the Butterworth site.  But I do know there are a couple landfill sites around that have buildings on the land albeit with a no digging restriction. 

[Guest]

Am I the only one that would love to dig through the dump?  According to my quick google search it was operational from 1950 to 1967.  There's gotta be some treasures buried in there (toxins too of course)

I guess while I'm on the subject, does anyone know of any dumping sites in Kent county that one could explore?

[joeDowntown]

3 hours ago, Floyd_Z said:

Am I the only one that would love to dig through the dump?  According to my quick google search it was operational from 1950 to 1967.  There's gotta be some treasures buried in there (toxins too of course)

I guess while I'm on the subject, does anyone know of any dumping sites in Kent county that one could explore?

There are a lot of dumpsites up in Rockford with barrels, but I wouldn’t touch them with a 20 foot pole at this point.  

Joe

[Allison Slater]

Perhaps the clay cap at Butterworth is thinner, adding extra restriction as to what could be done with it? Or maybe its sheer size affects that?

I would love to see that solar array. I wonder how it could be revived?