2015 mayoral race public opinion polling has started

[Rockatansky]

I know the Nashville MSA generates nearly 35% of TN’s GDP despite being only 25% of the population.

[rookzie]

So far, so good here. Let's make sure it stays clean of attacks.

As the person who initiated this thread, I would like to humbly request that we keep the discussion focused specifically on Nashville's 2015 mayoral race, because that is the one that will affect us here in Nashville, not something that happens in other cities or other States or in Washington, DC. 

 

It is also noteworthy that Nashville's Mayoral and Council races are nonpartisan.  So we may guess that Karl Dean is a Democrat and, say, Charlie Tygard is a Republican, but nobody is going to run for Mayor of Nashville as a Democrat or a Republican, and so the Nashville Mayoral race doesn't have a ton of impact in a broader national party-line discussion. 

 

My perspective is that there are forward- and backward-looking Democrats and Republicans but painting with a broad brush is not often helpful in gaining and understanding of practical matters.  I'm more interested in what a candidate plans to do with the Fairgrounds or how they want to approach the TIF funds that apparently are still going to be needed to land the luxury hotels to support the Convention Center.

This previous (above) post has all but become petrified, due to its age, but as a last-moment rally to revive what Brett had attempted to channel by starting this discussion from the start, I would not have my feelings trampled, if we could revive this, now that the first day early voting has come to an end already. (wow! are we really ready to decide from what's on hand?)  This thread just sort of got overlooked (or shunned).

Please at least let's give some (non-partisan) opinion, if we can also focus on not killing each off other (getting warned or banned) and "waking up dead", in the aftermath.  I'm just "out of time...out of touch", with this.

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[CenterHill]

 

This previous (above) post has all but become petrified, due to its age, but as a last-moment rally to revive what Brett had attempted to channel by starting this discussion from the start, I would not have my feelings trampled, if we could revive this, now that the first day early voting has come to an end already. (wow! are we really ready to decide from what's on hand?)  This thread just sort of got overlooked (or shunned).

Please at least let's give some (non-partisan) opinion, if we can also focus on not killing each off other (getting warned or banned) and "waking up dead", in the aftermath.  I'm just "out of time...out of touch", with this.

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Thanks for resurrecting the thread, Rookzie.  Folks may be a little gun shy after the previous rounds, but I'll stick my neck out.    I'm all in for Megan Barry.   I've listened to her views and like where she stands on the big issues of growth, transit, schools, housing and fiscal responsibility.   With her experience on the council, she understands how city government works and what it takes to get things done.    There are some big challenges facing the next mayor and the solutions will require building consensus among the mayor's office, council and constituents.   Consensus building is possibly Megan's greatest strength.    For all of Karl's accomplishments, that trait was probably his Achilles (but this isn't about Karl).    No partisanship here, I'm just looking for the candidate that can best carry the city's momentum forward and can effectively work toward solutions on public transit, affordable housing and infrastructure.    

For vice mayor, David Briley.  

                 

[rookzie]

I'm hadn't come to any resolve before now.  It had been a draw for me between Barry and Bone, and for the same rationale on Barry, I have wanted to aim toward her.  I basically have had no clear-cut conclusive sentiment on any one of the candidates, and I have had to resort to sticking a wet finger into the wind, so to speak, to arrive at some sense of personal earnest on the matter (as if that were to sincerely help).  I say this based in part on the limited extent of negativity personally encountered on these two candidates (so far).  Nearly all other respondents on the mayoral issue seem to concur that it's been nothing but a challenge to make a comparative weighing-out of candidates from the stock on-hand.  The windsock outside Frank Nash's house early on was quick to point to Barry also (stated in his earlier post).  Thanks for the input.

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[fieldmarshaldj]

I'm hadn't come to any resolve before now.  It had been a draw for me between Barry and Bone, and for the same rationale on Barry, I have wanted to aim toward her. 

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*facepalm*

I think that after 127 years of one party in control of the Mayor's office, it's time for a drastic change. Almost none of the candidates have any appeal (and frankly are just degrees of awful). Miss Barry just about brings up the bottom on that, and a certain other free-spending candidate who doesn't have a clue about basic economics. At this point, we need a fiscally sound candidate to occupy the Mayor's office, since it has been a long time since we've had that, and that leaves only Mr. Fox.

[samsonh]

*facepalm*

I think that after 127 years of one party in control of the Mayor's office, it's time for a drastic change. Almost none of the candidates have any appeal (and frankly are just degrees of awful). Miss Barry just about brings up the bottom on that, and a certain other free-spending candidate who doesn't have a clue about basic economics. At this point, we need a fiscally sound candidate to occupy the Mayor's office, since it has been a long time since we've had that, and that leaves only Mr. Fox.

Yes, truly Nashville needs a new direction!! Also, Nashville is in an enviable position fiscally, where did this narrative that says otherwise come from?

[UTgrad09]

Mind you, this is a coffee house thread, so you are free to discuss your political views here, but as always, keep things civil. 

[fieldmarshaldj]

Yes, truly Nashville needs a new direction!! Also, Nashville is in an enviable position fiscally, where did this narrative that says otherwise come from?

Reality. BTW, you're the one who has made it plain that massive governmental debt and spending is of no particular interest and thoroughly unimportant to you. Just sayin'...

[samsonh]

Fmj,

there is a massive difference between federal and local debt. Again, show me some actual numbers pointing to Nashville being in a tough spot fiscally. An answer of "reality" will not cut it for me.

 

 

Also, I stick to my premise about federal deficits. Again, my narrative has borne itself out as correct through the long lasting US recovery( lowest jobless claims in four decades today!) and the fiscal austerity of Europe provides a case of what you want to see. It's certainly black and white for all to see

 

[fieldmarshaldj]

Yes, I'm well aware an answer of "reality" won't cut it for you. Adherents of the left don't reside in that place. As I said, you made it plain that massive government debt isn't an issue for you. It makes it very difficult to have a serious and productive discussion with you when you take that stance. As for our economic situation nationally, given the actual number of those not in the workforce makes any claims to having a "low" unemployment rate a ludicrous joke and should be rightfully met with derisive laughter.

Fox is the only candidate addressing this issue:

https://www.foxfornashville.com/2015/06/04/holding-down-debt-taxes/

[samsonh]

Yes, I'm well aware an answer of "reality" won't cut it for you. Adherents of the left don't reside in that place. As I said, you made it plain that massive government debt isn't an issue for you. It makes it very difficult to have a serious and productive discussion with you when you take that stance. As for our economic situation nationally, given the actual number of those not in the workforce makes any claims to having a "low" unemployment rate a ludicrous joke and should be rightfully met with derisive laughter.

Fox is the only candidate addressing this issue:

https://www.foxfornashville.com/2015/06/04/holding-down-debt-taxes/

This isn't a left or right issue. It is simply an economics issue. You are confused about the number I cited earlier, jobless claims ≠ unemployment number. We have had 64 straight months of private sector job growth, this length discusses more, http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/2015/02/best-private-sector-job-creation-ever.html

 

As to the Metro situation: Moody's downgraded Metro to Aa2(Rated as high quality and very low credit risk.) in Q1 2014. The reasons for the downgrade are listed here: https://www.moodys.com/research/Moodys-downgrades-Metropolitan-Government-of-Nashville-and-Davidson-County-TNs--PR_296184

http://www.nashville.gov/News-Media/News-Article/ID/3984/Fact-Sheet-Highlights-of-the-Fiscal-Year-2016-Budget

Take a look at that and let me know what seems scary. Please respond with numbers or something specific.

The market still wants Metro's debt, it is trading at terrific prices. I imagine you are one that believes in the wisdom of the market's correct? Are they wrong here?

 

To call the US debt massive relative to size of GDP is laughable. We have a shrinking deficit, and most importantly, the government is not a household and should not be managed like one. We have no inflation problem(although most people who share your views thought we would have hyperinflation), the dollar is extremely strong(so strong it is hurting corporate earnings), and interest rates are still within spitting distance of historic lows. If the market was worried about massive US debt these things would not be true. Please tell me how I am wrong here with specifics, or even a link to something.

 

I have responded with facts and numbers, I would appreciate it if you took the time to do the same instead of linking to an also ran candidate's page on finances. You find it difficult to have a discussion with me because I am quite specific about my points, and you cannot respond to those points with facts. I know my finances and economics.

 

 

 

[dmillsphoto]

So uh... maybe I missed it but where did you counter the argument by providing numbers that Nashville/Davidson County is in a "tough spot fiscally" thus requiring "drastic change"?

 

The link to Fox's site addresses public buildings being built (MCC, I imagine) adding to the debt... a debt that is being paid for not on the backs of the citizens of Davidson County, much like the original CC (which of course was paid off ahead of time, saving on interest). 

 

As for the pensions - I agree there (though it's exaggerated by $700M on Fox's site) however this is one of those thingsone political party often blames my generation for, which absolutely cracks me up and leaves me confused.

[samsonh]

So uh... maybe I missed it but where did you counter the argument by providing numbers that Nashville/Davidson County is in a "tough spot fiscally" thus requiring "drastic change"?

 

The link to Fox's site addresses public buildings being built (MCC, I imagine) adding to the debt... a debt that is being paid for not on the backs of the citizens of Davidson County, much like the original CC (which of course was paid off ahead of time, saving on interest). 

 

As for the pensions - I agree there (though it's exaggerated by $700M on Fox's site) however this is one of those thingsone political party often blames my generation for, which absolutely cracks me up and leaves me confused.

He never has shown that metro is in dire straights. How can I counter something that hasn't been proven? Just saying Metro is in tough shape is not an argument.

The pension deficit is simply too small to be called a problem, and the healthcare deficit can be dealt with easily, although that specific situation may require compromise from unions. The problem is that people are simply living longer and longer lives, although not necessarily higher quality and are requiring significantly more healthcare in their later years than in the past.

 

But if you want to give some examples of how metro is in rough shape, I will address those. FMJ? Dmills, it is up to him to prove this first, that is how debates work.

[fieldmarshaldj]

This isn't a left or right issue. It is simply an economics issue. You are confused about the number I cited earlier, jobless claims ≠ unemployment number. We have had 64 straight months of private sector job growth, this length discusses more, http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/2015/02/best-private-sector-job-creation-ever.html

 

As to the Metro situation: Moody's downgraded Metro to Aa2(Rated as high quality and very low credit risk.) in Q1 2014. The reasons for the downgrade are listed here: https://www.moodys.com/research/Moodys-downgrades-Metropolitan-Government-of-Nashville-and-Davidson-County-TNs--PR_296184

http://www.nashville.gov/News-Media/News-Article/ID/3984/Fact-Sheet-Highlights-of-the-Fiscal-Year-2016-Budget

Take a look at that and let me know what seems scary. Please respond with numbers or something specific.

The market still wants Metro's debt, it is trading at terrific prices. I imagine you are one that believes in the wisdom of the market's correct? Are they wrong here?

 

To call the US debt massive relative to size of GDP is laughable. We have a shrinking deficit, and most importantly, the government is not a household and should not be managed like one. We have no inflation problem(although most people who share your views thought we would have hyperinflation), the dollar is extremely strong(so strong it is hurting corporate earnings), and interest rates are still within spitting distance of historic lows. If the market was worried about massive US debt these things would not be true. Please tell me how I am wrong here with specifics, or even a link to something.

 

I have responded with facts and numbers, I would appreciate it if you took the time to do the same instead of linking to an also ran candidate's page on finances. You find it difficult to have a discussion with me because I am quite specific about my points, and you cannot respond to those points with facts. I know my finances and economics.

 

 

 

Of course it's a left vs. right issue. One is fiscally sound, the other is fiscally reckless. Actually, calling our debt massive is laughable. Massive would be what it was 40 years ago. There is no superlative word that can come close to what we find ourselves in now, and what has been added to it in the past 6 1/2 years. Obscene would not even begin to cover it. That unfunded liabilities are numerous times the nearly $20 trillion we're in now are what will be what ultimately destroys the country economically. When you state we have a "shrinking deficit" after said regime has added to the debt beyond all sense of reason, as if that is somehow a positive is a ludicrous comment. You and I are completely in different worlds when it comes to right and wrong on virtually every issue across the board. There's little point in my going and finding numbers or facts for you, since you've made it plain you think everything is fine and dandy. That we've allowed this country to fall into such a fiscal hole (indeed, with those people responsible for it who couldn't run a small business, let alone a massive government which shouldn't be massive in the first place) is nothing short of treasonous. The regime wants to destroy this country in order to begin again the new dystopian vision for the future, as he's been trained from childhood to accomplish.

As I said, we're not going to agree on the color of the sky. To get back to the thread discussion, Mr. Fox is the only one addressing the issue of debt while most of the others (Barry and Freeman especially) have not a clue as to basic economics and would go a long way into killing what we have at present (or would force the state legislature to step in to put a stop to their plans).

[dmillsphoto]

k. I guess I have my answer. Nashville needs drastic change because. 

[fieldmarshaldj]

Because 127 years of one-party rule and especially 40 years of ever-increasingly left-wing Mayors and their profligate spending needs to be brought to a halt. Time for fiscally sound leadership for a change.

[ruraljuror]

After 127 years, it's time for a responsible Republican Mayor for a change...

 

...make that Conservative.

Because 127 years of one-party rule and especially 40 years of ever-increasingly left-wing Mayors and their profligate spending needs to be brought to a halt. Time for fiscally sound leadership for a change.

Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with.

[samsonh]

We are one of the hottest cities in America. Who on this board wants to change that?

[fieldmarshaldj]

 

 

Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with.

Psychobabble response. It was an asked and answered point. Why do I support Fox and want a change from the regime ? Because of 127 years of the same one-party control and that it's time to have a fiscally responsible Mayor who will address our spending and debt issue.

[fieldmarshaldj]

We are one of the hottest cities in America. Who on this board wants to change that?

I want to change leadership and to put an end to fiscally reckless Mayors like Dean. It's doubtful (much like with Austin) we would be doing as well as we are if it weren't for the fact that the state is a draw. Were we in California, Illinois or Massachusetts, we would not be a success at all. Endless debt will not ensure our long-term success.

[rookzie]

Maybe I just should've left well enough alone, by not trying to revive this year-and-a-half-old topic.  I acknowledge all that has been detailed to this point, but I had hoped more of short op-eds on what it is felt which candidates can do best for the issues of foremost significance to the the residents of the Metro Nashville & Davidson Co., particularly with quality of life (safety, mobility, accessibility, infrastructure,...).  It just might have been too much for me to expect it to not become argumentative. particularly since UTgrad has stated that this thread is "wide open game" on politics.

dmills stated from the start,

"...My perspective is that there are forward- and backward-looking Democrats and Republicans but painting with a broad brush is not often helpful in gaining and understanding of practical matters.  I'm more interested in what a candidate plans to do with the Fairgrounds or how they want to approach the TIF funds that apparently are still going to be needed to land the luxury hotels to support the Convention Center."

As stated initially, none of the candidates seem to stand out decisively, while they all seem so be a subject of some negativity.  Would be beneficial to many, if this were less digressive in partisanship, if that were possible, since any type-casting of what the chessboard set has to offer, with what's on-hand to work with, cannot be decisive in discerning all viewpoints among the candidates.  This one fiscal; that one aligned to that or to another.  With the direction that it has progressed, my guess is that the point of his discussion basically is moot, as far as what the region is going to decide on its own is concerned (despite us few).  The time to vote is now, while early voting remains in effect, so perhaps I'm the single one whose been a bit selfish on the hopeful outcome of this dialog. (and I accept the badd)

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[ruraljuror]

Psychobabble response. It was an asked and answered point. Why do I support Fox and want a change from the regime ? Because of 127 years of the same one-party control and that it's time to have a fiscally responsible Mayor who will address our spending and debt issue.

FMDJ, I'll give you this, you're incredibly consistent at the very least.

First, I don't think 'psychobable' means what you apparently think it means.  As I understand it, psychobable refers to psychological jargon/theories, which have nothing at all to do with circular reasoning--a term used in philosophy, math, and logic.  

As for 'asked and answered' I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on the asked part, even though we're using a really broad definition of 'ask'.  On the other hand, the only answer I've seen from you ("There's little point in my going and finding numbers or facts for you, since you've made it plain you think everything is fine and dandy") is pretty flimsy to throw out an 'asked and answered' retort and consider the matter settled.  Samson provided you a thoughtful detailed response about Nashville's financial situation and you...went on a rant about the federal debt.  

Just my two cents, but feel free to carry on as you see fit.  

[fieldmarshaldj]

My purpose for being in this thread was to respond to our friend Ricky Rookzie's post about Mayoral candidates and whom to support. I voiced displeasure at two of his preferred choices, explained why and cited my choice. I didn't see much of any point in getting into a broad-based discussion of economics (debt, et al) with Samson, since we already did so in the past and his position on the issue and mine are utterly irreconcilable -- and I'll just be wasting his time and mine with a pointless back and forth.

There's no link posted or argument made to me that can justify the kind of government spending and debt, be it locally or nationally, and I sincerely believe those that wish us to remain on this course want this country and our way of life destroyed, because this cannot continue without apocalyptic (economic/cultural/social) consequences. I view it as a serious and premier moral issue. No government has the right to spend more than it takes in, and to saddle future generations with debt is bequeathing slavery and not freedom, and is pure evil.

[rookzie]

As before, thanks for all the comments from all, including yours fdJ ─ they are useful, in any event, and indeed are germane.  There certainly is no reason to bury our heads in the sand, as if nothing stated has not been of issue, and perhaps perennially.  To to so would be one contextual def. of insanity: doing the same while expecting different results.

All that has been expressed in this dialog so far, should be recorded and archived for reference ─ that's of tantamount importance to opinion.  Thanks again...

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[BnaBreaker]

Gotta love the popular refrain from the right that Democrats run cities into the ground when Democrats typically make up the vast majority of the population and the local government in nearly every major city in the country.  Unless you're making the argument that every city aside from Jacksonville, Oklahoma City and Topeka (and a handful of others) is a crap hole, then it really makes no logical sense to say something like that at all.  I mean, I realize that people have reputations to maintain and teams to play for, but I think we'd all benefit if drivel like that, which is completely made up, nonsensical and only serves to push some partisan agenda, was just eliminated from our discourse altogether.