SunRail

[WAJAS]

36 minutes ago, orange87 said:

Is this where the new DeLand Sunrail Station will be?

Looks like its the right location.

DeLand-Station-Concept.pdf

DeLand Env Concept.indd (sunrail.com)

[AmIReal]

6 hours ago, Urban Mail Carrier said:

Gives Demings more time to identify a funding source.

Like a dedicated funding source...

Per OBJ, “Local control and dedicated funding for both SunRail and Lynx will allow local leaders to take ownership of transit improvements. Central Florida’s workforce needs more frequent bus service, and SunRail needs to be extended to the airport and service must be offered on weekends.”

Looks like they will try to do a penny tax referendum in 2022.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/02/04/orange-county-trasportation-tax.html

[Urban Mail Carrier]

A tax referendum in 2022 is risky.. Tax referendums are more inclined to pass during presidential elections. Osceola presented a tax referendum during a midterm election and it failed. 

[codypet]

Yea there's gonna be a big push for DeSantis's reelection campaign at that point.   I believe Marco is up for re-election too.  Oof, that's gonna be a whale of an election.

[Urban Mail Carrier]

Fingers crossed that the referendum passes. What are the other counties proposing to help fund transportation?? Like I said Osceola failed on their referendum any chance they may reintroduce another?

[WAJAS]

7 hours ago, Urban Mail Carrier said:

A tax referendum in 2022 is risky.. Tax referendums are more inclined to pass during presidential elections. Osceola presented a tax referendum during a midterm election and it failed. 

Does that still hold true when the Governorship and one Senate seat are up for re-election? Genuinely asking

[AmIReal]

Per the article Demings originally planned to place the referendum on the '20 ballot, but due to the pandemic and everyone's economic situation decided not to.  He has not committed to the '22 ballot, yet. 

It would be OC County wide, which swings pretty left, so even in an off year it would have a fairly good chance. Remember, Seminole County has passed transit taxes and even though they are leaning blue now it is not a hard lean. Also, I would suspect the Dems plan to try to drive big turnout in '22 based on trying to oust Desantis.

[EngineerNole]

On 1/20/2021 at 8:02 PM, WAJAS said:

While this doesn't go to downtown Deland, this is good that a decision has finally been made that the county is okay with.

On the possibility of a downtown Deland station: The track spur that leads to downtown Deland is actually just short of the current station on the mainline. In the future, the extension to downtown can be completed with the only sunk cost being the station itself, which is downsized in this proposal. Only a small section of track would become unused. Also, the most likely scenario is the original station stays to serve those that drive to the station because the downtown Deland station would likely have limited parking due to lack of available land.

That spur looks like it’s still in use.  Plus, they’d have to take out part of a neighborhood and possibly “The Deland House”.

[WAJAS]

1 hour ago, EngineerNole said:

That spur looks like it’s still in use.  Plus, they’d have to take out part of a neighborhood and possibly “The Deland House”.

The spur could still be in use and be used by Sunrail. CSX and other freight activities are already relegated to hours when Sunrail doesn't operate.

I don't know about "The Deland House." Maybe that's a deal breaker.

[AmIReal]

Not actually Sunrail, but it is mass transit oriented...

Ever hear of NUMTOTS? Me neither. New Urbanist Memes for Transit Oriented Teens is a FB group with over 200k members that fantasize about a world with no cars. 

As already mentioned here, "According to a University of Michigan study, the number of people under 30 with driver's licenses has been steadily declining."

It appears millennials, and their younger counterparts in Gen Z heart mass transit.

From NPR- https://www.npr.org/2021/02/05/963329938/one-thing-millennials-arent-killing-public-transportation

[smileguy]

21 hours ago, AmIReal said:

Not actually Sunrail, but it is mass transit oriented...

Ever hear of NUMTOTS? Me neither. New Urbanist Memes for Transit Oriented Teens is a FB group with over 200k members that fantasize about a world with no cars. 

As already mentioned here, "According to a University of Michigan study, the number of people under 30 with driver's licenses has been steadily declining."

It appears millennials, and their younger counterparts in Gen Z heart mass transit.

From NPR- https://www.npr.org/2021/02/05/963329938/one-thing-millennials-arent-killing-public-transportation

There's a local-ish spinoff group, too -- Infrequent Bus Service Memes for I-4 Corridor Teens

https://www.facebook.com/groups/383407475741579

Edited February 11, 2021 by smileguy

[Urban Mail Carrier]

20 hours ago, AmIReal said:

Not actually Sunrail, but it is mass transit oriented...

Ever hear of NUMTOTS? Me neither. New Urbanist Memes for Transit Oriented Teens is a FB group with over 200k members that fantasize about a world with no cars. 

As already mentioned here, "According to a University of Michigan study, the number of people under 30 with driver's licenses has been steadily declining."

It appears millennials, and their younger counterparts in Gen Z heart mass transit.

From NPR- https://www.npr.org/2021/02/05/963329938/one-thing-millennials-arent-killing-public-transportation

Hence a train station in UCF would be wildly popular. The ridership numbers would certainly increase.

[codypet]

1 hour ago, Urban Mail Carrier said:

Hence a train station in UCF would be wildly popular. The ridership numbers would certainly increase.

Enter the Drunk Train

[YimbyOrlando]

On 2/5/2021 at 7:58 AM, Urban Mail Carrier said:

A tax referendum in 2022 is risky.. Tax referendums are more inclined to pass during presidential elections. Osceola presented a tax referendum during a midterm election and it failed. 

Osceloa's tax referendum was actually on the ballot during the May primary in 2019 and had no real plan behind it, almost like they wanted it to fail. Hillsborough passed their sales tax in 2018 with 57% and they are more conservative than Orange county. I think the biggest issue is whether tourism demand returns by 2022; voters will probably be less inclined to increase taxes if the economy is not doing well, especially since low income  theme park workers are the largest group of transit riders in the area.

[HankStrong]

On 1/30/2021 at 5:21 PM, WAJAS said:

 

Let's get down to brass tax. If you all want a proper transit system, then you are not going to get it from Brightline's proposal and the generosity of the Florida/Federal governments alone.

In almost every successful modern area with transit, the region has a dedicated funding source that is above the current cost to operate the transit system.  This allows the excess funds to be used to study and (overtime) pay the capital necessary to expand and improve the system, and it also allows the transit provider to make decisions guided by yet not forced from a city or county government. This leads to smarter route selection that is not guided by politics.

If you want Orlando to have a proper transit system, then you need a dedicated funding source. I'll be sure to advocate when it comes up again in 2022 or 2024, but this is the reality of the "pipe dream" that many of us have.

Innovation Way is  a stop because its one of the only areas with residential anywhere along that portion of the route. It's also because the OCCC really likes the idea of Innovation Way becoming a thing, so its a better pitch. Also, none of the current stops (beside the obvious) are anywhere close to final.

It's also important to point out that a route like this makes no sense for commuter rail. It honestly should be light rail.

Don't start taxing my brass, I've got a band to keep on the road!

[WAJAS]

7 hours ago, HankStrong said:

Don't start taxing my brass, I've got a band to keep on the road!

I realized after posting that the phrase is actually "brass tacks." It's origin is unclear.

[gibby]

On 2/18/2021 at 12:14 AM, WAJAS said:

I realized after posting that the phrase is actually "brass tacks." It's origin is unclear.

This is going to be my favorite post, going forward.

[KnightBay]

On 2/17/2021 at 10:42 AM, YimbyOrlando said:

Osceloa's tax referendum was actually on the ballot during the May primary in 2019 and had no real plan behind it, almost like they wanted it to fail. Hillsborough passed their sales tax in 2018 with 57% and they are more conservative than Orange county. I think the biggest issue is whether tourism demand returns by 2022; voters will probably be less inclined to increase taxes if the economy is not doing well, especially since low income  theme park workers are the largest group of transit riders in the area.

The money being collected in Hillsborough can't legally be touched yet. It's being held up by an insane rural Republican commissioner's lawsuit. Literally hundreds of millions of dollars just sitting in escrow.  

[KnightBay]

On 2/19/2021 at 9:07 PM, KnightBay said:

The money being collected in Hillsborough can't legally be touched yet. It's being held up by an insane rural Republican commissioner's lawsuit. Literally hundreds of millions of dollars just sitting in escrow.  

Welp, the Florida Supreme Court just ruled against the All For Transportation sales tax today which means they ruled against the will of the people in favor of the governmental leadership. Sad day for the State. 

[prahaboheme]

22 minutes ago, KnightBay said:

Welp, the Florida Supreme Court just ruled against the All For Transportation sales tax today which means they ruled against the will of the people in favor of the governmental leadership. Sad day for the State. 

Central Florida (or maybe it’s Tallahassee) prefers the status quo so this will go over well. 

Edited February 25, 2021 by prahaboheme

[codypet]

2 hours ago, KnightBay said:

Welp, the Florida Supreme Court just ruled against the All For Transportation sales tax today which means they ruled against the will of the people in favor of the governmental leadership. Sad day for the State. 

So wait the Hillborough referendum passes, the legislative body doesn't agree with it and basically kills it after the voters approve it?  I guess throw it on the pile with:

• State High Speed Rail
• Reduced Classroom Size
• Voting Rights for Felons
• $15 minimum wage

[EngineerNole]

On 2/4/2021 at 9:27 PM, WAJAS said:

Looks like its the right location.

DeLand-Station-Concept.pdf 3.5 MB · 4 downloads

DeLand Env Concept.indd (sunrail.com)

That’s an old concept.  The parking lot won’t go back that far.  The amtrack station will be preserved.

[WAJAS]

1 hour ago, EngineerNole said:

That’s an old concept.  The parking lot won’t go back that far.  The amtrack station will be preserved.

Yeah, but that change happened after I posted that (kinda, it was voted on the same day). Either way, the location is still correct, which is why the reference was given in the first place.

[TRENCH]

On 2/11/2021 at 2:01 PM, Urban Mail Carrier said:

Hence a train station in UCF would be wildly popular. The ridership numbers would certainly increase.

I graduated in December but the last 3 years would been so much easier if there was rail all over the city , I would've riden the rail to school 

[AmIReal]

Deland hoping to be more like Sanford

https://beacononlinenews.com/2021/12/10/how-can-deland-make-sunrail-work-the-citys-southern-neighbor-may-have-an-idea/

What to do it you build your rail station in BFE.