SunRail

[jack]

I believe that is a lightly used line though for freight, right? If all of the freight is banned during the rush hours, I think they should be willing to work together. This is also a shorter line with slower speeds (top proposed speed is 60mph), so it may be more compatible with freight. I believe they're waiting on this line to make sure SunRail is really approved and will only pursue it then...

Isn't freight going to be re-routed for SunRail? That line may increse as a result.

[codypet]

Isn't freight going to be re-routed for SunRail? That line may increse as a result.

Not in its present condition. Most of the at grade crossings don't have lights or gates. I'm pretty sure they were going much further west.

[cwetteland]

Isn't freight going to be re-routed for SunRail? That line may increse as a result.

The rerouted freight avoids pretty much the entire greater orlando area including the Eustis Mt Dora area ... it pretty much does a steight shot from about Ocala to Lakeland. Far west of anything mentioned for the outlying spurs.

[bic]

Here we go again...

Scott Delays SunRail Decision Until July

[prahaboheme]

Clearly he is delaying the decision to let some of the political heat from the high speed rail decision die off, at which time he will cut this project out of the budget as well. Anyone who thinks otherwise is in denial. This man is a fascist pr*@k.

Edited March 11, 2011 by prahaboheme

[alex]

"This action was taken to give me additional time for a review of the costs and public concerns about this project," Scott said in a statement. "During the months ahead, I will complete a thorough review of the financial impact this project could have on Florida's taxpayers." You mean like how he did such a good job reviewing HSR? Oh... wait.

But I'm glad the Sentinel is actually citing numbers instead of opinions for once: SunRail has been projected to create almost 4,200 construction jobs in Orange, Seminole, Volusia and Osceola counties. And that's not counting permanent maintenance jobs.

[Jernigan]

The optimistic viewpoint: SunRail is a COMPLETELY different project than High Speed Rail. It's riders already truly exist from the ones sitting in I4 traffic to the ones who take a LYNX bus from Orange City to Downtown every day. The private sector investment is already in the works at most of the stations (unlike anything that we heard about at OIA or really even in Tampa or Lakeland around the stations) and it is not built on a fallacy like trying to utilize high speeds over a very very short distance.

The pessimistic viewpoint: Scott seems anti-public transit and didn't care to see any numbers for High Speed Rail.

This will be interesting, but I'm not overly optimistic.

[jack]

Clearly he is delaying the decision to let some of the political heat from the high speed rail decision die off, at which time he will cut this project out of the budget as well. Anyone who thinks otherwise is in denial. This man is a fascist pr*@k.

I am pretty sure he has not seized control of any industries or promoted state controlled industries. Governor Rick Scott is a man whp toes the line, if not crosses it, in regards to the separation of powers. He is a go it alone without regards to anyone else. But he had better be careful when it comes to SunRail.

[frankthetank]

I usually don't get involved in politics but our new governor is going to set the state back decades in terms of mass transportation.

http://www.postonpolitics.com/2011/03/more-train-hi-jinks-scott-puts-brakes-on-sunrail/

So I am asking for you all to please contact the governor and ask him not to kill Sunrail.

http://www.flgov.com/contact-gov-scott/

He has already killed one rail system, lets not let him kill another.

[bic]

Scuttling SunRail Would Cost Millions

[gibby]

Reading the comments on the Sentinel website is always one of the most depressing things you can do.

[FLClarkKent]

Reading the comments on the Sentinel website is always one of the most depressing things you can do.

I know I shouldn't read the comments, but I can't help myself. Glutton for punishment, I suppose.

But, I have noticed that there's been a significant increase in pro-rail comments...a surprising increase...especially when it comes to SunRail.

While I have no doubt that Rick Scott will scuttle the project, I think the public outcry will be far greater than the outcry following the derailment of high speed rail.

Cities up and down the I-4 corridor have made considerable investments (at least in the planning stages) for SunRail stations, which have been viewed not just has a new form of transportation, but as new conduits for development (i.e., new revenue). And these cities are excited about these plans. Same for businesses along the route, most notably Florida Hospital and Orlando Regional. It's become easy to visualize a live-work environment near many of these stations in the near future.

More of the public seems to understand the potential benefit of SunRail, too. Live in Lake Mary and work downtown? A train ride seems a lot more appealing than a long commute (and the price of renting a parking space). Especially if the price of gas continues to increase.

Rick Scott will kill it. Again, of this I have no doubt. He has to. He's following the tea leaves of his most ardent supporters - many of whom don't live in our area. His ultimate Achille's heal, however, will be his lack of politically savvy. Simply put: You can't piss off the I-4 corridor and win election in Florida.

Don't give up hope, my urbanist friends. He's only going to be around for another 3.5 years...but the Tea Party craze will dwindle away much sooner than that, and his influence will wane, too. Political movements founded upon anger never last long, as it's quite difficult to stay angry at just about everything for long periods of time.

[steve_o]

As SunRail is not directly and VERY publically linked to Obama and Democrats, I still think it has a chance. The Tea Party is not threatening to oust Scott of a future based on this project as they did the other. I personally still think it has strong legs. May be wishful thinking, though...

[codypet]

As a sidenote: anyone been to Charlotte and visited the light rail that was supposed to be in Orlando? Did you notice they named it Lynx? Their buses aren't Lynx in Charlotte, and I thought Lynx was gonna run that light rail in Orlando. Is that Charlotte's little way of saying thank you for the train Orlando? If so will Cali's train be called Florida High Speed rail?

I do fear Sunrail will die. You don't proposed to widen I-4 in Orange County with the High Speed Rail money unless you're planning on killing Sunrail too. Its sad just sad. I'd like to have 5 mins with Mr Scott right about now.

[bulldogger]

codypet, it doesn't take 5 minutes to get a shot off.

[Jernigan]

As we head into this time of uncertainty regarding SunRail, I'm VERY concerned that this will not happen due to a lack of advocacy or marketing.

I get it - government project, they can't advocate for it themselves or market it without probably causing more harm than good. It's the world we live in.

But part of marketing is education - and to this day, I hear/read people say "I thought the Governor already killed SunRail and rejected the money." or "I won't ride SunRail - Tampa is too close."

So folks don't even know the route.

Which means they probably do not realize some other VERY important things:

1) The differences in inconvenience between SunRail and freight or Amtrak - in the case of freight - anyone who has had to sit waiting forever for a train to pass knows this is not a good commercial for the future of Central Florida transportation. Of course, those who have followed, know that SunRail would take less time than a normal redlight at a major intersection. The noise would also be different. In the case of Amtrak - the boarding process would be easier.

2) What's going on with the station plans. For me, personally, the development around the stations are more important than the train itself. I want great places to visit and in a few years when I have a family - I don't want to have to live downtown to enjoy a walkable neighborhood. And who knows, I might even have to work out in one of these cities. We've all seen how successful these areas have been like Baldwin Park, Winter Park, Celebration - but I don't see any kind of marketing approach that connects this with SunRail. Not to mention these places would deliver a "work here, live here, play here" that the existing areas can not. Work may not be "here" but it wouldn't require a car trip.

3) Feeder systems - this is more complicated because in some cases, they might just not be there - but the most common argument I hear or read is "what do I do when I get off the train" I don't see enough hype about LYNX' plans, Orlando's carsharing plans etc.

4) Just to note - Tampa has actually put some groups together. It certainly didn't help them as they failed their votes for funding last November, but I can't say how effective they were outside of Facebook. Here is what they did:

http://www.facebook.com/TampaBayonTrack

http://www.facebook.com/transitiontampabay

- I'd love to see some kind of mass marketing approach championed by the groups that can (non-govt) push for this. Tons of companies saying "they want this" and others that need it (Ustler, hospitals) - where is the love?

Rick Scott can beat a bunch of politicans any day. But he can't ignore a fired up region.

[prahaboheme]

Perhaps we could start a facebook group dedicated to Sun-Rail advocacy? Invite hospitals and companies with interest in it's benefits to join, and then get the word out there through media?

[alex]

I completely agree! SunRail needs something community-driven, let them know we want it. As thorough as their site, it's very static. For example, the last news update was in December. Also, there's no interaction/social media going on. There is the Let's find 10,000 Floridians who support SunRail Facebook page, but maybe we need something more connected to the community. Let's be honest, most nurses, government employees, and elderly people who will be the first to ride the SunRail don't scour the Internet for urban planning updates... ;-)

PS: However, I did find they updated their Transit-Oriented Development Principals in February, but it was kind of buried on the page.

[bulldogger]

These posts yesterday and today inspired me to write the Governor telling him to support SunRail and a few reasons why I do. I am going to start doing this frequently.

[alex]

A couple interesting news stories from the past two weeks (sorry if these have already been posted somewhere):

Now hiring: Doctors wanted

"...Hospital executives last week derided Gov. Rick Scott's decision to kill high-speed rail and potentially pull the plug on the SunRail commuter train.

While a number of Nemours' jobs will offer big salaries, Oxendale said, a lot of workers as well as patients will rely on public transportation.

Lake Nona officials are especially interested in improving public transit because the development in Southeast Orlando is still far-flung from many of the region's population bases.The proposed high-speed and commuter rail routes don't include Lake Nona, but there is hope that if they are built will one day expand to the development..."

SunRail costs up by almost $5 million because of Scott's delay

Also on Wednesday, Orange County Mayor Teresa Jacobs spent a half hour with the governor in Tallahassee lobbying him about SunRail. She said afterward that she still sees him as undecided on the project.

Thusday's Buzz: Will Rick Scott kill SunRail this summer?

Some think hes just using the rail line for leverage during this legislative session. Others think hes giving it a thorough look and is being deliberate in his decision. Still others wonder how the governor is getting away with delaying a project that was approved by the Legislature and the governor in 2009. What do you think? Will Rick Scott give SunRail the go-ahead?

[Jernigan]

DeBary's economy, SunRail future in limbo‎ - CFN13 April 11, 2011

DeBary, Deltona to Gov. Scott: We back SunRail - DBNJ April 8, 2011

Economist: SunRail Commuter Rail Will Transform Central Florida - Globest.com April 6, 2011

Flagler officials pledge support for SunRail - DBNJ April 5, 2011

[prahaboheme]

It is becoming more and more difficult to read these articles as time creeps on and Scott continues to hold this project under political hostage.

[Jernigan]

The Never-Ending Florida Rail Battle

Scott’s (eventual) response: “With regards to SunRail, what we’re doing with that is making sure that the local communities are committed to it … and making sure the local communities understand that the way it works under the public transportation [rules] in our state that monies … that it comes out of their district money and that they understand, on a state level, what our commitment is for seven years [and] at the end of that timeframe, the local communities are responsible.”

[Jernigan]

I think this is significant.

Scott has changed his purpose for delaying SunRail from the "reviewing the contracts" to "makin sure the communities know what they are getting."

I think he is going to try to get us to destroy it from within so that he doesn't come across as killing it like he did HSR.

That said - who would budge? Winter Park is the best bet, but would Dilhalla be able to sway everyone else?

Even if Winter Park opted out, it shouldn't mean the project gets scrapped - just that it wouldn't stop in WP.

That aside, shouldn't this read as a "Project is a go?" From everything I've read by and large most municipalities are outright eager to get this up and running.

I don't think he can force a popular vote, can he? If so, I'm worried about the lack of education in the area.

[prahaboheme]

Scott has already proven that he will say or do anything in person and change face in private, so his response to Brown (who, by the way, is the only one in front of SunRail right now and for that reason she deserves credit) seemed to me a way out of the room.

The difference between high speed rail and SunRail: SunRail is not revolutionary. It is not shrouded in confusion. It's benefits are tried and tested. Orlando isn't the first to setup commuter trains, it wont be the last. Investment in commuter trains has a proven track record.

Ultimately, Scott knows this. So, if after the "review" he was brought up to speed on these facts and he is now betting on the ignorance of Central Floridians to implode the project, he is probably on to something. After all, it was Floridians who voted this crook into office to begin with.