AC Hotel on West Main

[spartanburgh]

I was just thinking of the new developments mentioned in the last couple of months for Downtown Spartanburg....

-New Limited service hotel behind the Marriott

-New Limited service hotel on the corner of Daniel Morgan and Main

-New Civic Center

-New County Courthouse

-Three new Main Street Challenge stores

-New restaurant at 307 W Main ST.

This makes a pretty good wish list, but which ones will actually happen?

[westsider28]

I didn't know there was a hotel proposal for the Daniel Morgan and Main corner.  Do you have any more info about that?  I would LOVE to see something like that there.  That's a prime corner.

 

It's definitely an exciting time with all the proposed developments!  It would be nice to see one the major projects get underway, though (or even just a rendering / site plan).  The hotel behind the Marriott seems likely to be the first to start, I guess?

[roads-scholar]

I was just thinking of the new developments mentioned in the last couple of months for Downtown Spartanburg....

-New Limited service hotel behind the Marriott

-New Limited service hotel on the corner of Daniel Morgan and Main

-New Civic Center

-New County Courthouse

-Three new Main Street Challenge stores

-New restaurant at 307 W Main ST.

This makes a pretty good wish list, but which ones will actually happen?

Some of these are just in the preliminary "talking" stage (new civic center and county courthouse) and this is the first time I've heard of a "limited service hotel" at the corner of D. Morgan and Main. 

[spartanburgh]

That information came from an upstate business editor a couple of months ago. It was about the time the project behind the Marriott was announced. I would think that it might be delayed or abandoned based on the Marriott anouncement. Apparently, Johnson Development has purchased the Event Rentals building and the editor said, one was in the works for that corner. No official anouncement, just a person in the know that should have reliable information.....

I think it may be an even better location than behind Marriott, if they could quieten the train crossing!!

[Sparkleman]

Can we get any confirmation on that purchase of the event rentals building & property? I don't see any change in ownership on the tax records online and they are usually pretty prompt in updating new purchases.

[spartanburgh]

The County Map does show that the Herald Journal site, the parking lot behind it and the parking lot behind Event rentals has already

been recorded into South Phifer-Johnson Development ownership. They already own the site that used to be a dry cleaner directly across from Rockers. He has them surrounded!!! It may be a matter of time before the other shows up or it may be that the Herald site would be razed to make room for the hotel. IMO that would make a better site. The paper would have to go into another building if that happend.

[westsider28]

I agree that section of West Main has a lot of potential, and I'd love to see some development there.  But I see a few issues that may make developers reluctant to build there.  A minor issue is the separation (physical & psychological) from Morgan Square / Grain District created by the railroad tracks, Wakefield, and the creek/kudzu valley.  The bigger issue is the Miracle Hill Rescue Mission and the Soup Kitchen, both on Forest Street.  That pretty much creates a homeless thoroughfare along Forest, which is not the best environment for development.  That said, I hope those issues can be overcome someday (either by relocating those facilities or simply insatiable development demand).

[spartanburgh]

The old hotel on N Church St. across from Wofford is coming down too. A lot of demo at one time, I'm ready to see a lot of

construction at one time now......

[westsider28]

A sort of misleading article in the paper today said that South Phifer Properties (Johnson Development) bought all those West Main lots.  But it says there are no immediate plans to redevelop the property.  They just wanted to demolish the ugly buildings and grass the lots for now to make that gateway to downtown a bit more attractive. 

 

They own quite a few properties downtown (particularly the western part).  I hope they'll do something with them someday.  Like you, spartanburgh, I'm ready to see a lot of construction soon.

[Spartan]

I agree that section of West Main has a lot of potential, and I'd love to see some development there.  But I see a few issues that may make developers reluctant to build there.  A minor issue is the separation (physical & psychological) from Morgan Square / Grain District created by the railroad tracks, Wakefield, and the creek/kudzu valley.  The bigger issue is the Miracle Hill Rescue Mission and the Soup Kitchen, both on Forest Street.  That pretty much creates a homeless thoroughfare along Forest, which is not the best environment for development.  That said, I hope those issues can be overcome someday (either by relocating those facilities or simply insatiable development demand).

 

Agreed. I've always thought that area had a lot of potential. Good skyline views and pretty well connected to the rest of downtown (aside from the railroad tracks). I've also said for years that they need to put a part where the creek/kudzu patch is - basically the entire block between W Main, Forest Dr, Henry St, and the NS tracks. It's not very many parcels, and most of it is in a floodplain anyway so you can't build on it. Tear down the 3-4 buildings in that block and you have a great park parcel. The only building I would keep is the old car dealership with the roof parking area... that would be a great restaurant to overlook the park.

 

First they need to rename the creek (called Greenville Branch) to something else. My vote would be something more geographically appropriate like Spartan Branch or Spartan Creek (in honor of the mill). Then the thing could be dammed up at Henry St to create a nice pond.

[spartanburgh]

I heard from a pretty reliable source that they were looking to locate a limited service hotel there a few months back. It was the same time that Jimmy Gibbs group was looking at a similar hotel behind the Marriott. I wonder if thats why we haven't heard any more about the hotel behind the Marriott? Maybe they don't think the City could support both and their waiting to see who will actually commit to build.

[westsider28]

I talked to someone from the City a few months ago, and they mentioned in passing that GDJ was upset with them.  I hope the City doesn't feel obligated to support the Gibbs group (at the expense of the GDJ group) because of the land deal the City gave them. 

 

As long as it has a good urban design, I would prefer a hotel at the West Main site.  It would be a better location for people staying in town and a better location for supporting DT businesses. 

 

If we can only support one additional DT hotel, I would hope that having "competition" would spur both groups to move faster.  To me, the first group to get a hotel chain on board and get dirt moving would/should "win".

[spartanburgh]

It seems there is a little shake up in the quest to build the next hotel in Downtown. The latest news on the street is that Jimmy Gibbs and

the Marriott group will not build a hotel. However, George Dean Johnsons OTO group will move their plans from the vacant lot across from

Cribbs to the Herald Journal site. I'm not sure where the Herald Journal will relocate to when their building is torn down to make way

for the Hilton Product that will be built there, but its a better site for the Hotel........

[clemsonfn]

Would be a great place for a Hilton Garden Inn.

[roads-scholar]

The H-J building opened in 1970.  Its now a prime spot for a hotel.  I'm sure the newspaper can find new digs somewhere else. 

[Sparkleman]

The H-J already has more space that it needs ever since the moved the printing presses and other machinery out off Bryant Rd. I figure they could set up shop about anywhere. According to their webpage of contacts, they employ 86 folks and probably have another 10-15 around as well. That's a pretty good size operation, but could probably be housed in a current GDJ facility or maybe they could be the ones to make the push for the Montgomery Building.

[westsider28]

I agree with you guys that the Herald-Journal site is excellent for a hotel.  As mentioned, the H-J can easily find office space elsewhere.  Hilton brands I could see being possible here would be Hilton Garden Inn (as clemsonfn suggested), Hampton Inn, Homewood Suites, and maybe DoubleTree.  Of those, I'd put my money on a Hampton Inn (no info, just a guess). 

 

Anyway, I love the idea of a hotel on Morgan Square, and I think it would be a sure-fire success.  Hope this plan gets traction and moves forward.

[roads-scholar]

I agree with you guys that the Herald-Journal site is excellent for a hotel.  As mentioned, the H-J can easily find office space elsewhere.  Hilton brands I could see being possible here would be Hilton Garden Inn (as clemsonfn suggested), Hampton Inn, Homewood Suites, and maybe DoubleTree.  Of those, I'd put my money on a Hampton Inn (no info, just a guess). 

 

Anyway, I love the idea of a hotel on Morgan Square, and I think it would be a sure-fire success.  Hope this plan gets traction and moves forward.

Perhaps we can see the Event Rentals location and it's adjacent [empty] lot developed as well.  And, while we're at it, maybe development will spread to the Grain District and city hall areas.  No doubt this is exciting!  Fingers are crossed.

[Sparkleman]

Don't you all figure it would have to be some kind of boutique style hotel in the spirit of an Aloft or Indigo? I certainly don't think we need anything near the size of the Marriot. It really needs to have a cool factor to it similar to the Aloft in Asheville.

[westsider28]

I was just going off spartanburgh's claim of a Hilton brand.  They don't really have a boutique brand (maybe the new Canopy brand, but not likely here).  I agree it doesn't need to be nearly as large as the Marriott.  I'd guess 4-6 stories (depending on how much of the lot is used), 80-120 rooms (compared to 240 at Marriott), and likely a traditional, brick-heavy design (but high-quality) since it's GDJ.  I just hope for some ground-floor retail spots, which I think is required by the Urban Code.

[spartanburgh]

Isn't there a special section of the new urban code that prevents any building over 4 stories to built on the old Main St.

section of DT 6?

[gman430]

Bummer that the hotel next to the Marriott is dead. I'll be surprised if this one gets built.

[westsider28]

Isn't there a special section of the new urban code that prevents any building over 4 stories to built on the old Main St.

section of DT 6?

 

It's asinine (for various reasons including historical precedent, but I digress), but yes.  Specifically, it limits buildings to 4-stories within 60 feet of Main, which presumably means you could have a setback close to Broad that was taller.  Plus I'm sure they'd waive the limit if GDJ wants to go higher.  If they used the whole block though, 4-stories would probably be enough.

 

Any particular reason, gman430?  I have much more confidence in GDJ delivering than Gibbs & Co.  Plus it's a better site.

[Spartan]

Isn't there a special section of the new urban code that prevents any building over 4 stories to built on the old Main St.

section of DT 6?

 

DT-6 allows for 10 stories, and up to 16 stories if certain conditions are met. There is an overlay for parcels fronting  Main Street between Daniel Morgan Ave and Convere St. The overlay restricts height to 60ft height restriction which is probably closer to 5 floors assuming 12ft per floor.

 

So, if the rumored hotel were to be located west of Danial Morgan Ave, there is ample space to go vertical. The HJ site would have those restrictions, but I think the reality is a boutique hotel in Spartanburg would not likely need too much height.

[spartanburgh]

That's incorrect Spartan. The code prevents buildings over 4 stories within 60' of Main St. It also requires the building to have shop front the

entire length of the building fronting on Main St. which may not be the most ideal design for a hotel.

I have to agree with Westsider and declare that part of the code asinine. There are other parts that are asinine as well, but that's the only

part that would apply to this site.