The Transportation and Mass Transit Megathread

[Neigeville2]

On 5/22/2018 at 12:26 PM, SoundScan said:

No, there will still need to be tons of parking, because middle/upper-middle/upper-class people from the suburbs will still view car ownership as a status symbol, which means even if it's autonomous they'll want to own their own. They're not going to subscribe to a car-share service for a multitude of reasons.

Really?  I would have thought the day when a car was a status symbol were long over.  Certainly the farther out in BFE you are the longer you'll have to wait for an autonomous taxi, and I would imagine the trailer parks of Hickman County will be rife with private car ownership, but the days of "ooh, they must be successful, they own a car"...?  No.

[MLBrumby]

33 minutes ago, Neigeville2 said:

Really?  I would have thought the day when a car was a status symbol were long over.  ...

Nope! 

Don't expect they'll be as long as there are Mercedes and Porsche autos... or even Dolce/Gabbana Gucci and Hermes.  Where else would people with bad taste know what to buy. I jest! I jest! 

[LA_TN]

6 hours ago, AronG said:

They require all riders to take a photo whenever they park now, and they've committed to moving improperly parked vehicles within two hours of reports. Metro should follow Austin's lead and pass light regulations requiring a permit and a small per vehicle fee to operate them. Then we should set aside some parking spots in areas where they're popular, accelerate our bike lane efforts, and see where this goes. Every person that gets around on one of these is one less car gumming up the roads.

Disagree. Some of these would Uber/Lyft or cab and some would walk 

[markhollin]

In an escalating legal fight with Nashville's new transportation fad, Metro government has asked a court to order the removal of all Bird scooters from sidewalks and other public spaces in the city, arguing the company has continued to violate several codes provisions despite warnings. 

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/2018/05/29/metro-asks-judge-order-removal-all-bird-scooters-sidewalks-parks-nashville/652932002/

[PaulChinetti]

http://gothamist.com/2018/05/25/citi_bike_fury_flashback.php

Some of these quotes are just outrageous, ha. 

[Guest]

I absolutely love the characterization of 'conservatives'! ha
Because these people beotching from Brooklyn, Tribeca, Murray Hill, the West F'ing Village....et al are of course conservatives....know hotbeds of conservative originalists.

A proper characterization would be - "out-of-touch liberals, socialists, country club Republicans and NIMBYs were frothing at the mouth over how Citi Bike would destroy everything good and beautiful about NYC.

Now here in Nashville, where there are actually conservatives...probably. 

1 hour ago, PaulChinetti said:

http://gothamist.com/2018/05/25/citi_bike_fury_flashback.php

Some of these quotes are just outrageous, ha. 

 

[PaulChinetti]

My guess is they were talking about the lady at the end of the article Dorothy Rabinowitz?

[samsonh]

4 hours ago, nashville_bound said:

I absolutely love the characterization of 'conservatives'! ha
Because these people beotching from Brooklyn, Tribeca, Murray Hill, the West F'ing Village....et al are of course conservatives....know hotbeds of conservative originalists.

A proper characterization would be - "out-of-touch liberals, socialists, country club Republicans and NIMBYs were frothing at the mouth over how Citi Bike would destroy everything good and beautiful about NYC.

Now here in Nashville, where there are actually conservatives...probably. 

 

Who are these liberals out of touch with? I mean, they live in the largest city in the country, seems like they would be in touch with quite a few people!

[MLBrumby]

Please let's not go there. Some of the most out of touch people I know are denizens of Manhattan. Suffice it to say, it's a very 'narrow' island. 

[samsonh]

12 minutes ago, MLBrumby said:

Please let's not go there. Some of the most out of touch people I know are denizens of Manhattan. Suffice it to say, it's a very 'narrow' island. 

Mind you I didn't go there, NashvilleBound did.

 

I understand what you are saying, but you could say the same for lots of cities/states/countries. And they would say the same of you. 

[markhollin]

More details on ordinance to control the scooters:

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2018/05/30/heres-how-metro-might-rein-in-nashvilles-newest.html

Full proposed ordinance here:

https://media.bizj.us/view/img/10924164/ordinance-elrod-dockless-scooters-and-bikes-v22.pdf

[PaulChinetti]

"F. All permitted operators shall have systems with service areas that do not exceed 340 bicycles per square mile."

This seems weird, so if too many accumulate downtown, Bird has to go in and clear some out?

"L. Any permitted vendors operating systems with more than 1,000 bicycles/scooters must include Nashville Promise Zones in 20% or more of their service area."

What is a Promise Zone??

[PruneTracy]

6 minutes ago, PaulChinetti said:

What is a Promise Zone??

https://www.nashville.gov/Mayors-Office/Promise-Zone/Basics.aspx

I'm not trying to start something but loading up ordinances with requirements like this one (as well as providing a plan for "equitable" bike sharing) is how you keep these services from sticking around. Especially with dockless bikes and scooters, if there is a demand for a service in any area then the bikes and scooters are going to end up there regardless of what the ordinance says.

[Pdt2f]

1 hour ago, MLBrumby said:

Please let's not go there. Some of the most out of touch people I know are denizens of Manhattan. Suffice it to say, it's a very 'narrow' island. 

I think any city (especially one with 8.5 million residents) that votes 85% for one party can be called narrow. I would actually call Nashville much more broad minded than NYC. Still love visiting Gotham, though. 

[volsfanwill]

Looks like someone is hoarding scooters! 

[donNdonelson2]

(Jail)Birds of a feather flock together 

[grilled_cheese]

53 minutes ago, volsfanwill said:

Looks like someone is hoarding scooters! 

Don't they have some sort of anti theft beeping noise?  If so.....turn em all on.

[markhollin]

TDOT considers rebuilding I-440 one segment at a time.

https://brentwoodhomepage.com/tdot-considers-rebuilding-i-440-one-segment-at-a-time/

[PaulChinetti]

The longer I've been on this board and the more I read, I'm constantly amazed how long it takes us to build things and how much it costs compared to other countries. 

I don't know how I feel about it being made 6 lanes though. 

[AronG]

1 hour ago, PaulChinetti said:

The longer I've been on this board and the more I read, I'm constantly amazed how long it takes us to build things and how much it costs compared to other countries. 

I don't know how I feel about it being made 6 lanes though. 

Not to be a broken record up in here, but adding interstate lanes in urban areas is a complete waste of time and money. Every marginal increase in capacity will induce a corresponding number of people to choose to live further away and commute further. The induced traffic quickly rises until the traffic jams return to the previous equilibrium, motivating people to prioritize living closer to where they work. In the meantime the enormous stretches of land paved over for interstate commuters will further isolate neighborhoods and makes the city more unpleasant to navigate by bike & foot.

[PaulChinetti]

Agreed 100% @AronG I'd much rather see them spend that money on other more helpful things. Because like you said, if they upgrade it to 6 lanes for 100k cars. Then 10 years from now they will want to upgrade it to 8 lanes for 150k cars. 

Hopefully they will realize that, one thing I would like them to fix is something like this cluster. But, I don't even know if that's possible. It takes up so much damn space and is such an eye sore. 

[AronG]

30 minutes ago, PaulChinetti said:

Agreed 100% @AronG I'd much rather see them spend that money on other more helpful things. Because like you said, if they upgrade it to 6 lanes for 100k cars. Then 10 years from now they will want to upgrade it to 8 lanes for 150k cars. 

Hopefully they will realize that, one thing I would like them to fix is something like this cluster. But, I don't even know if that's possible. It takes up so much damn space and is such an eye sore. 

Unfortunately I think that's a legacy of the 20th century urban interstate fetish that we'll be living with for many decades. They ripped up entire neighborhoods just to meet those sweet, sweet Interstate design standards. Gotta allow suburban commuters to shave every possible second to get in and out of the scary city center as fast as possible. People tried to resist the construction of 440 (here's where they lost their court case in 1981), but now it's been a fixture for 30 years and our land use has grown around it to the point that it's political suicide to bring up, say, converting it back to a surface route and reclaiming the 20 acres of land that are wasted on that turning radius. There are signs that some American cities have reached the point of questioning their downtown freeways, but so far the best examples (Boston and Seattle) spent billions to put them underground instead of just getting rid of them. Status quo's a b*tch.

Edited May 31, 2018 by AronG

[PaulChinetti]

Woof, imagine if they had went with alternatives then, Nashville would be a much different place. 

"Status quo's a b*tch."

HAHAHA

"Several alternatives to the proposed construction of I-440 suggested by workshop participants were analyzed. A report published by TDOT in February 1978 discussed those alternatives analyzed but not recommended for further study at the design level of detail. Alternatives studied by TDOT but found to have a low potential for satisfying the crosstown travel demand for the southern portion of Nashville included the following:

(a) Use of Woodmont and Woodlawn as a one-way pair;

(b) Relocation of the interstate loop near the Williamson County line; and 

(c) Transit Alternatives:

(1) Bus;

(2) Rail; and

(3) Dial-a-ride.

On the other hand, some alternatives which had undergone preliminary analysis were recommended for further development and study in the draft environmental impact statement. These were:

(1) I-440 with six through lanes and two to four auxiliary lanes where needed;

(2) A reduced facility freeway with four through lanes and auxiliary lanes where needed;

(3) A four-lane boulevard with at-grade, signalized intersections at major radial street junctions; and 

(4) The "no-build" alternative, or not constructing the facility, coupled with implementation of the approved Major Route Plan, which includes proposals for widening crosstown streets."

Edited May 31, 2018 by PaulChinetti

[PruneTracy]

18 hours ago, volsfanwill said:

Looks like someone is hoarding scooters! 

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/2018/05/31/bird-scooters-nashville-sweeps-remove-public-way/659745002/

[Bos2Nash]

3 hours ago, PaulChinetti said:

Agreed 100% @AronG I'd much rather see them spend that money on other more helpful things. Because like you said, if they upgrade it to 6 lanes for 100k cars. Then 10 years from now they will want to upgrade it to 8 lanes for 150k cars. 

Hopefully they will realize that, one thing I would like them to fix is something like this cluster. But, I don't even know if that's possible. It takes up so much damn space and is such an eye sore. 

I hate this interchange.... Also scares me in how much land it actually takes up.

 

"TDOT has placed the following stipulations on proposals for any segmented closures of I-440:

• Closures would occur in two segments, with only one segment being closed at any given time.
• The first segment includes I-440 East and West from the I-65 junction to the I-24 junction.
• The second segment includes I-440 East and West from the I-65 junction to the I-40 junction.
• The first segment closure could begin as early as January 2019, lasting for approximately three months.
• The second segment closure would follow, and would be required to be open to traffic by mid-November 2019.
• $400,000 per day penalties would be assessed against the contractor if the opening date is not met."

I am very happy to see such a penalty on missing deadlines. Hopefully that would keep the contractor on a very tight schedule. Infuriating that people within state agencies still believe that expanding highways are good for cities. I wonder how many of the notax4tracks people will be upset that half of this interstate will be closed for several months to expand their beloved highway.