Greenville County Square redevelopment

[GVLover]

1 minute ago, NewlyUpstate said:

The "fog" behind the governor's school is interesting in that picture. I wonder if they have artwork of the redeveloped county square in this picture laying around somewhere haha

I doubt it but would be really cool if such artwork were available. 

[NewlyUpstate]

Stream of council meeting btw

https://www.facebook.com/foxcarolinanews/videos/474933540064478/?app=fbl

 

Edited January 22, 2020 by NewlyUpstate

[GVLover]

Looks like it passed with one councilwoman voting against the project. 

Edited January 23, 2020 by GVLover

[gman430]

5 minutes ago, GVLover said:

Looks like it passed with one councilwoman voting against the project. 

Who’s the one? I’m definitely not voting for him or her. 

[NewlyUpstate]

4 minutes ago, gman430 said:

Who’s the one? I’m definitely not voting for him or her. 

The new councilwoman Dorothy Dowe. She asked a ton of questions during the meeting and seems like her main hesitations were affordable housing and adequate connectivity (bussing etc)

[GVLover]

17 minutes ago, NewlyUpstate said:

The new councilwoman Dorothy Dowe. She asked a ton of questions during the meeting and seems like her main hesitations were affordable housing and adequate connectivity (bussing etc)

I agreed with her closing remarks, although I also agree with getting this project passed as quickly as possible. 

[NewlyUpstate]

5 minutes ago, GVLover said:

I agreed with her closing remarks, although I also agree with getting this project passed as quickly as possible. 

Completely with you there. Zoning is just the broad foundation. An active local government can greatly influence the work as it goes if they are vigilant. 

No reason IMO to hold up the zoning conversation on details.

[GVLover]

Check out this article from Greenville News:

Greenville city approves $1B vision for redeveloping County Square in first of two votes

https://www.greenvilleonline.com/story/news/local/greenville/downtown/2020/01/22/greenville-city-council-poised-vote-county-square-project/4469105002/

[gman430]

The city's approval of the project was largely in line with what the city's planning commission recommended last fall — with buildings capped at 12 stories. But the City Council loosened some of the oversight that planning commissioners had recommended, namely that developers present a new traffic plan to their body after five years and also present a final development plan to them. City Council members agreed that oversight in these areas was best left at the staff level.

Phil Mays of RocaPoint Partners, the project's principal developer working with the county, said after the meeting that he felt the modifications were good but that he would still have to review whether the project as approved would work. Mays said the project could also proceed with no zoning changes. 

[apaladin]

So my understanding is they will vote again in February and decide then when to vote again? As it stands right now no tall buildings. I don't understand residents concerns over an 18-20 story building bit ok with a 12 story one? What diiference could that possibly mean to them?

 

FYI in March this thread will be 4 years old and not one shovel of dirt has been turned.   Anyone want to bet it will be 4 more years before one is turned?

Edited January 23, 2020 by apaladin

[distortedlogic]

10 hours ago, gman430 said:

The taller building in the first pic is not 12 stories though. You can clearly count 12 above the school. This must be a rendering for one of the 20 story buildings. So if the cap is just 12, it will be much shorter.

BTW, the architecture, though I'm sure just conceptual, looks vastly different than the ones put out last year. I hope they don't end up being this modern.

[vicupstate]

5 hours ago, apaladin said:

So my understanding is they will vote again in February and decide then when to vote again? As it stands right now no tall buildings. I don't understand residents concerns over  18-20 story building bit ok with a 12 story one? What diiference could that possibly mean to them?

 

The Feb vote is the last one required by the city .

Quote

FYI in March this thread will be 4 years old and not one shovel of dirt has been turned.   Anyone want to bet it will be 4 more years before one is turned?

Welcome to the real world.   It took 10 years to build something on the former CCI site in Columbia once it was in city hands. 

 

[gvegascple]

7 hours ago, distortedlogic said:

The taller building in the first pic is not 12 stories though. You can clearly count 12 above the school. This must be a rendering for one of the 20 story buildings. So if the cap is just 12, it will be much shorter.

BTW, the architecture, though I'm sure just conceptual, looks vastly different than the ones put out last year. I hope they don't end up being this modern.

 I count 12 above the school which is on the side of a hill.  The lower levels of the building arent obscured by the school by much if any, and to me the lowest floor is probably the lobby level based on its height compared to the others.  I have said this before that being on a hill makes it look taller from lower elevations.  Im ready for more modern too.  really tired of retreads on 20-50 year old designs and that is what I see mostly in the pic.  Greenville has reached a threshold of buildings like that such that it can support more modern designs peppered in. The new focal point of this development is modern and gorgeous.  it makes sense that some buidings around it borrow some of its architecture to blend in

Edited January 23, 2020 by gvegascple

[Den2Gvl]

https://greenvillejournal.com/news/city-moves-forward-on-county-square-project/

Another article.

[gvegascple]

3 hours ago, vicupstate said:

The Feb vote is the last one required by the city .

Welcome to the real world.   It took 10 years to build something on the former CCI site in Columbia once it was in city hands. 

 

I am ok with the delay if the project is great.  My fear before this recent design came along was that we would get something that looked like Magnolia park with a few 8 story structures  randomly dropped in.  This current one is something to be excited about. 

[GvilleSC]

34 minutes ago, Den2Gvl said:

https://greenvillejournal.com/news/city-moves-forward-on-county-square-project/

Another article.

I know this has turned into a complicated story, but the Greenville Journal has dropped the standard with which they reported 10 years ago. It's reporting like this that confuses the casual public and creates an uproar (It wasn't long ago when more than a few folks thought the County was spending $1 billion dollars in public funds to redevelop this site). This is factually incorrect:

Quote

County Council still needs to approve the funding mechanism to pay for the $33 million purchase of property on Halton Road near Haywood Mall, on which the proposed new county buildings will be erected.

Yes-- it's a minor error, but it is a trend that is not that difficult to just get right the first time. 

[gman430]

Sounds like everybody got mostly what they wanted. I imagine the county and RocaPoint can live with the height limit: 

 

“In the end, both sides made concessions on what was essentially a rezoning request for County Square and surrounding parcels along University Ridge. 

The city won on questions about scale, design and affordable housing. The project originally included 20-story buildings but is now capped at 12. The whole project is subject to downtown design guidelines. And the city has come up with a plan to include lower-cost apartments on the site. The county, meanwhile, will not have to take final development plans and traffic improvements back to the city planning commission for approval. And it still has a project that promises to attract up to $1 billion in investment and will fund a new county headquarters.”

Edited January 23, 2020 by gman430

[gvegascple]

1 hour ago, gman430 said:

Sounds like everybody got mostly what they wanted. I imagine the county and RocaPoint can live with the height limit: 

 

“In the end, both sides made concessions on what was essentially a rezoning request for County Square and surrounding parcels along University Ridge. 

The city won on questions about scale, design and affordable housing. The project originally included 20-story buildings but is now capped at 12. The whole project is subject to downtown design guidelines. And the city has come up with a plan to include lower-cost apartments on the site. The county, meanwhile, will not have to take final development plans and traffic improvements back to the city planning commission for approval. And it still has a project that promises to attract up to $1 billion in investment and will fund a new county headquarters.”

Alrighty, Now that we have this well on its way to being approved, lets break ground and move on to the Downtown Convention Center, 2 N Main, and the Innovation District along with two major corporate or university anchor tenants!

Edited January 23, 2020 by gvegascple

[gman430]

Anybody notice how the city gave a floor limit but not a height limit? The developer could make each floor 25 feet tall.  A 12 story building with that would be 300 feet tall. 

[apaladin]

That 12 story limit is absolutey silly if not downright stupid. 

[gman430]

8 minutes ago, apaladin said:

That 12 story limit is absolutey silly if not downright stupid. 

I agree but sadly the area residents opinion will always win out. 

[ingvegas]

I think the 12-story height limit is a wise decision at that particular site.  Some really smart and experienced urban planners would agree (Sasaki Associates, Inc., Downtown Greenville Master Plan page 41-42). To each his own, but the city made the right call. I think this will turn out very well.

Now, if we could just get a 30-story building built at the Gateway site....

[gvegascple]

9 minutes ago, ingvegas said:

 

Now, if we could just get a 30-story building built at the Gateway site....

or maybe a nice vegetable garden, my expectations have been going lower and lower over there 

[cabelagent]

2 minutes ago, gvegascple said:

or maybe a nice vegetable garden, my expectations have been going lower and lower over there 

Someone should erect a tall flag pole with a giant white surrender flag in the middle of the site. 

[GvilleSC]

22 minutes ago, ingvegas said:

Now, if we could just get a 30-story building built at the Gateway site....

I, too, would really like to see that site be a productive and beautiful entry for people to downtown. However, the site sits off by itself right now, and the center of downtown has drastically shifted south & west (and will be even more so with County Square's redevelopment). I think we need to lower our expectations, with a maximum height of 12 stories.