N&O Site

[Green_man]

8 hours ago, DwnTwnRaleighGuy said:

One Glenwood 

One Glenwood 

One Glenwood 

I think that I have made my point?

One Glenwood is the way that developers see a fast return on investment. It looks an awfully lot like an office building and parking deck built next door that you will find all up and down  Six Forks Rd.,  Falls of the Neuse Road etc. Nothing really special or different as even the height is par for the course. So yeah, I am expecting an office/apt building next door to a 6 or 7 story parking deck.... God, please prove me wrong! 

The property purchase cost for One Glenwood was much much lower than it was for N&O site.  Similar project built at N&O would not have a positive return on investment.   (It will be taller.  Much taller.)

[RiverwoodCLT]

For $22 Million if they do not build tall, they will loose money on this building to earn a good return on their investment.

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

2 hours ago, RiverwoodCLT said:

For $22 Million if they do not build tall, they will loose money on this building to earn a good return on their investment.

I’m not sure, while $22 million is a lot of money in general, it’s not a lot when you think how much land there really is available to utilize.

[Merthecat]

Has anyone ever noticed this?

 

[ctl]

Phoenix III of Raleigh LLC was created in February 2018. Incorporated in Nevada. Local address is the Lowry law firm. It is managed by another company, Acquisition
Group LLC, in southern California whose office address is of a law firm, too. 

[Merthecat]

Surely the two companies are related, since two of the Phoenix sites have the same southern California address.  The other has a Las Vegas mailing address.

[JeffC]

Seeing as this is out of town investment portfolio guys, I don't have high hopes for anything noteworthy on this site, unless Apple comes swooping in with an anchor tenant proposal for a landmark building...

[KJHburg]

This project looks great too 15 story office tower and residential and the California  developer who bought the site is partnering with Chapel Hill East West Partners. 

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/business/article226608164.html

Lets get some of these started 2nd phase of Peace, Glenwood South 2, the Fallon project 

 

Edited February 22, 2019 by KJHburg

[Justin6882]

15 stories and they paid $22 mil for the parcel??? Seems way too small. 

[KJHburg]

^^^ it says the site is 3 acres plus they are going to do residential there too.  I would put a 30-40 story tower but that is me. 

[rucker]

The height of 250 ft is maxed out so you can only get 15-16 stories of office in that space. 325k of office 400+ residential units and 250 hotel keys plus all the retail alongwith it will definitely justify that land price.  I really like how they are Opening up Salisbury st to Nash Square.

 

As to more height, For better or worse I wouldn’t expect to see many developers attempting rezonings of any kind with the current climate on this council. 

Edited February 22, 2019 by rucker

[InitialD]

The city council should have preemptively raised the height limit to 40 floors for this site (or, better yet, remove all height restrictions downtown). 15 floors  is such a disappointment for a site that deserves to be the new-tallest, especially after we saw ideas of what could be: 

Hopefully, a tower on the Nash square side of the project will be 30+.

[Green_man]

Here's another view of the rendering.  Includes a site plan inset that seems to show five future buildings?  (in white).  I agree a bit disappointed at just 15 floors, but fine with it, if lets them move forward with building out the whole block sooner rather than trying to get everything into one tower then waiting forever for the next phases.  The residential tower in the background facing the park seems much taller and I would hope has some interesting architectural features based on the architect selected.

[InitialD]

Yeah, at minimum a hotel/residential tower should be at least as tall as Skyhouse. At minimum. 

Edited February 22, 2019 by InitialD

[KJHburg]

Where is the area downtown where you can build as tall as you want or is it still limited to 40 stories or a certain height?   Is one block either side of Fayetteville Street or what?  

I agree this site should not be capped at 20 stories or whatever the cap  states.  

[rucker]

Fayetteville St is 40 stories, everything else is 20 stories or 250 feet, whichever comes first.

 

 

[ctl]

Go talk to the Raleigh Fire Department about high-rise limitations. My understanding is that they are strenuously opposed. Until/unless that changes, it's very difficult for the Council to override their concerns.

[InitialD]

48 minutes ago, ctl said:

Go talk to the Raleigh Fire Department about high-rise limitations. My understanding is that they are strenuously opposed. Until/unless that changes, it's very difficult for the Council to override their concerns.

They should go talk to Charlotte FD because it is of no issue to them. This is probably just another bargaining chip they want to use for more raises yet again.  Perhaps Council could pay to send them to Charlotte for a weekend for some remedial training. 

Edited February 22, 2019 by InitialD

[InitialD]

Someone on another forum found the Gensler renderings. Seeing the overall project I'm less disapointed that I was initially - two 20 floor residential towers, 15 floor office, and 12 floor hotel.  Nice pedestrian plaza, lots of retail. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 22, 2019 by InitialD

[nicholas]

4 hours ago, Green_man said:

Here's another view of the rendering.  Includes a site plan inset that seems to show five future buildings?  (in white).  I agree a bit disappointed at just 15 floors, but fine with it, if lets them move forward with building out the whole block sooner rather than trying to get everything into one tower then waiting forever for the next phases.  The residential tower in the background facing the park seems much taller and I would hope has some interesting architectural features based on the architect selected.

It’s a good-looking building that deserves to be much taller. 

[Merthecat]

20-story condo tower?  Yes, please!

[KJHburg]

Interesting about the fire department.  Of course Charlotte FD has no 875 foot ladder to reach the top of the BofA Corp Center but we evidently have tough rules.  WeWork was told in their first office in Charlotte that each "telephone booth" private phone like booth that each one had to have a sprinkler head.  WeWork told me around the globe including NYC they have never had to do that but the Charlotte FD insisted.  Plus before they got their permanent CO and fire alarm testing was done there was a firefighter stationed on each floor until the system was up.  This is in a brand new 19 story building.   Knock on wood and pray to the good Lord above there has not been a high rise fire in Charlotte.  But I can tell you this routinely there are fire drills in all of our uptown high rises.  The fire alarm went off  at the building I was working in and I successfully walked down 10 floors with a Krispy Kreme doughnut and my laptop all the way to the ground floor.  I had just arrived at the office so my laptop was ready to go.   But anyway it is all about preparation, safety and fire control systems and practice for who occupy the buildings.  

[ctl]

On 2/22/2019 at 10:36 AM, InitialD said:

They should go talk to Charlotte FD because it is of no issue to them. This is probably just another bargaining chip they want to use for more raises yet again.  Perhaps Council could pay to send them to Charlotte for a weekend for some remedial training. 

A bit cynical, I think. There could be truth in what you write, but I believe RFD has taken this position for a very long time.

On occasion there have been concerns that the water mains into downtown are at capacity already and that major upgrades (big bucks) are needed if downtown continues to go vertical. This might or might not be on the firefighters' minds, but it is a legitimate concern either way. CP&L/Progress/Duke faced the same issue with electricity supply into downtown, but at length they were able to build a new substation. 

I once fled a hotel fire from the 22nd floor. Not a pleasant experience.

Edited February 23, 2019 by ctl

[Spatula]

On 2/23/2019 at 10:55 AM, ctl said:

A bit cynical, I think. There could be truth in what you write, but I believe RFD has taken this position for a very long time.

Begs the question why were the 3 buildings >400 ft that we have allowed in the first place? Why were proposals for 400+ ft buildings accepted left and right leading up to 2008? What changed? Why is the limit at 20 instead of 30 floors?

[RALNATIVE]

5 hours ago, Spatula said:

Begs the question why were the 3 buildings >400 ft that we have allowed in the first place? Why were proposals for 400+ ft buildings accepted left and right leading up to 2008? What changed? Why is the limit at 20 instead of 30 floors?

All of these are very good questions. We've seen this before where developers proposed tall structures over 30 stories, only to scale it back later.