vdogg

Norfolk Off-Topic

Recommended Posts


https://pilotonline.com/news/government/local/norfolk-parking-garage-is-closed-and-might-not-reopen-after/article_154e0b32-1c55-563d-ac27-2a58c5447f7b.html

Norfolk is considering closing the City Hall garage for good, after chunks of concrete fall on cars.

Having been to that garage a few times, it seems very spread out. I would think that would become prime land for a new tower. The only issue I see is that it might be surrounded by the Interstate ramps, and therefore confined (For context, DMV Select is City Hall).

Screen Shot 2017-10-09 at 2.50.41 PM.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another high ranking from Travel+Leisure, this time Norfolk ranks #1 in a reader survey. 

https://pilotonline.com/life/travel/norfolk-is-more-popular-that-new-york-new-orleans-or/article_93c15ffb-bbc2-53d1-b3d0-cedeb106fd08.html

With these articles becoming more and more the norm, Norfolk has to get serious about improving schools and landing more companies.

Edited by BFG
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How long do you guys think it will be before MacArthur starts to decline? Coliseum and Newmarket are gone; Pembroke, Lynnhaven and Patrick Henry have under gone a lot of changes; Military Circle and Chesapeake Square are barely there anymore. It never seems as busy as it use to be.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a loaded question. I'm assuming that you want the property for highrise development?  In sum, the death of the mall is not a given or a universal phenomenon. Malls which repurpose, reinvent and reinvest in themselves have and will continue to survive. Especially those which attract unique, moderately upscale to  upscale tenants,  and also have a renewed emphasis on restaurant and entertainment.   Call it "experiential merchandising."

But as for MacArthur Center specifically, much depends on Starwood. How much are they willing to invest to re-purpose and to reinvent the mall?  They paid about $180 million for it, so they definitely have an incentive and adequate motivation to keep the place afloat. And not just afloat, but on the steady uptick.

There needs a mixed-use component on the third anchor pad,  with an emphasis on entertainment and restaurant.   Perhaps hotel and/or office. Starwood needs to aggressively pursue unique-to-the -market (and at least moderately upscale) tenants to replenish the turnover.

Additionally, should Nordstrom leave in 2018/19, the mall would be in a precarious position with only one anchor tenant. Although not as dire as it would've been 20 years ago in that same circumstance, it is still widely understood that the sweet spot for most malls is three anchor tenants. Two at the very least. And malls which have two or less do less well over the long term than those boasting three ...or more.

Locally, both Lynnhaven Mall and Pembroke Mall have seen a substantial infusion of cash and re-tenanting over the past several years. They are both definitely on the upswing. So it CAN be done. But after three years of ownership at MacArthur, Starwood has acconplished very little--at least from what we can tell from the outside.  

Meanwhile, Starwood is investing $50 million in Richmond's Stony Point, and  $50 million in a mall outside of Charlotte.  Both of which were also formally developed and owned by Taubman.

Time will tell. And time is also of the essence. The mall is approaching 20 years old, and it has been a rather unique experiment –-a suburban style upscale mall in a downtown urban setting-- with mixed results.  Ironically, Starwood has been marketing it as such lately. A unique American retail experiment. Interesting. 

Let's just hope that they actually do some of their own experimenting there based on solid research and with the backing of deep corporate pockets...and hard work. And very soon. 

Edited by baobabs727

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With Military Circle gasping for air, I would think Norfolk is going to do all it can to keep MacArthur successful, esp. since that sparked the rebirth of downtown. I don't think a makeover of its entrances would hurt, something sleek and glassy. Focus on getting more businesses to Military and convert that into a little business park.

As for MacArthur, I think now is the right time to explore that "midrise" option, with a store on the ground level. A two-story Target, with an 8- or 9-story apartment building on top would be awesome.

Or another hotel.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I definitely think an exterior makeover would do well in prolonging the life of Macarthur. With pedestrian activity on the rise in Downtown, it would be nice if the mall didn't seem so completely cut off from everything else. A modern  exterior design featuring glass and large transparent windows would do wonders in making the mall seem more inviting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have always liked the idea of turning the mall inside out, but the problem is that the mall's design will prohibit that to a large extent. Except for the two main anchors (Nordstrom & Dillards) and the three restaurant spaces fronting Monticello (Texas DB, CPK & former Max & Ermas), the vast majority of the exterior of that mall is wrapped by garages. But I do think that the "third anchor" pad would be a place where you could create something like you envision  within a mixed use concept . 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A quick Google search shows Starwood Capital group acquired the mall in 2014.  Now that property downtown is extremely hot and valuable makes me curious if they’ve ever looked into selling the lot for redevelopment. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, baobabs727 said:

I have always liked the idea of turning the mall inside out, but the problem is that the mall's design will prohibit that to a large extent. Except for the two main anchors (Nordstrom & Dillards) and the three restaurant spaces fronting Monticello (Texas DB, CPK & former Max & Ermas), the vast majority of the exterior of that mall is wrapped by garages. But I do think that the "third anchor" pad would be a place where you could create something like you envision  within a mixed use concept . 

Maybe instead of a true inside-out change, maybe instead they can actually open up the middle to the outside and create sort of a larger and urban version of Richmond's Short Pump Town Center? I'm sure that would be extremely costly though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, carolinaboy said:

Playing around with Sketchup and Google Earth. Just my vision for fun.

ORF.jpg

I would add the demolition of the Norfolk Public Schools building and redeveloping that land to include mix use, a garage, and a new NPS building on that site. I would also like to see the garage for Waterside to be torn down and redveloped. It could easily have retail on the first floor, a new parking garage with two towers on top of it. I like the idea of an urban district over by Waterside, at this point that would be more believable than SPQ being extended as an urban district.  Also the garage on Plume and Plume, the small garage, would be another great one to tear down and redevelop into a tower.

Looking at the Harbor Park development, I would go even further to include a development along the water with a new pier along it, plus the parking lot to the west of the stadium should also be a part of the development with a parking garage put in on the east side of the stadium.

Edited by urbanlife
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an urban Target store as part of a mixed-use development in Chapel Hill, NC. This type of Target would be great in downtown Norfolk.

 

Target Chapel Hill.JPG

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is an aerial showing a large arena footprint in downtown Norfolk. I took the actual (to scale) footprint of PNC arena in Raleigh and over-layed it onto an aerial photography of downtown Norfolk just to see where it could possibly fit. This is a large arena and as you can see, fits nicely on the large parking area north of downtown. There is room left over for public space or other mixed-use type development.

 

Wouldn't this be sweet?

NORFOLK ARENA.jpg

Option 2

NORFOLK ARENA 2.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure where to put this, but this is a exciting listen from the city council work session meeting held in OCT

city council meeting

 

Link above. starting at 38:16 min. mark.

Highlights: They are starting to look at the harbor area an dhow to transform it. They have and are actively seeking fed grants to study the area and gives a take on what they seek the area to be.  Key word, to make it more dense.. they have some conceptual designs with towers :tw_grin:, ideas to make the water accessible for fishing, kayaking, etc.. and a flood wall.......

 

Dt harbor park.JPG

Edited by brikkman
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, urbanlife said:

You mean like the 20 years they have already taken?

Touche lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to this article, Newton's Creek (adjacent to Harbor Park) did not get any funding from the National Disaster Resilience Competition, but Ohio Creek, just east of Newton's Creek, received most of the $120 million awarded to Virginia to combat flooding due to sea-level rise.

https://pilotonline.com/news/local/environment/hampton-roads-to-get-more-than-m-to-combat-future/article_08cbbfee-d215-515f-83ae-67ff9198b107.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.