Soccer in Nashville

[L'burgnative]

Oh no doubt Vandy's a stepping stone stop or where you go to die but I still found that quote and mind set dumb.  I think Prune Tracy explained it well; Vandy does not need to leave campus.  Also I'd like to add that it's going to take a lot more than Vandy and a soccer team coming to the fair ground to revitalize that area.  Like I asked; I think if you can't go downtown then look at midtown and I think if you take out Dudley Ave. the big lot across from Vandy Stadium would be a better place.  You have plenty of yuppies with all the colleges around that might give two craps about soccer and Vandy stays on campus.

[L'burgnative]

I don't know why I'm sharing these but why not.  I was bore around Christmas time and drew and rendered these up in CAD.  Ignore the location but I think this would be perfect across from Vandy Stadium.  Yes I went with the classic look because to me there is no other way.

[titanhog]

I'm not sure what to think about it, other than Vandy pretty much shows us all again that they really don't care that much about football if they're willing to move off campus, let the city and a soccer club pay for part of their new stadium, and speak of how they need the land for more important stuff on campus.  This is a school that receives millions and millions from the SEC for being a member who shares in the tv windfall...yet they won't spend real money to have a great on-campus stadium like most of the other schools.  They also receive huge endowments...yet treat football like a stepchild.  I really wish they would put more into it like Stanford.

And...would our MLS team be making a mistake by playing in a 30k+ seat stadium when it seems that most of the other MLS teams are well below 30?

[MLBrumby]

I think it has more to do with Mr. Ingram needing another (sure bet) tenant for his new sandbox. The soccer team is a "iffy" proposition, even if Nashville is awarded a team. Vanderbilt would be contractually obligated to pay rent for a long time. And as he knows better than most, Vandy has deep pockets. Pretty sure he went to Princeton although (I realize) his family has a supportive history with Vandy. 

[PruneTracy]

15 hours ago, titanhog said:

This is a school that receives millions and millions from the SEC for being a member who shares in the tv windfall...yet they won't spend real money to have a great on-campus stadium like most of the other schools.  They also receive huge endowments...yet treat football like a stepchild.  I really wish they would put more into it like Stanford.

I mean this in the best way possible but Vanderbilt doesn't really belong in the SEC. It's a relatively smaller private school with a higher academic tradition that puts that before athletics (imagine). The other 13 SEC members are public universities that essentially function as NFL farm teams that run tertiary education as a side hustle. If anything, the rest of the SEC could stand to cut football down a notch, rather than Vandy catching up to them.

Of course, the real solution here is to bring back the Magnolia League.

[timmay143]

1 hour ago, PruneTracy said:

I mean this in the best way possible but Vanderbilt doesn't really belong in the SEC. It's a relatively smaller private school with a higher academic tradition that puts that before athletics (imagine). The other 13 SEC members are public universities that essentially function as NFL farm teams that run tertiary education as a side hustle. If anything, the rest of the SEC could stand to cut football down a notch, rather than Vandy catching up to them.

Of course, the real solution here is to bring back the Magnolia League.

I get it, but what about the other sports teams?  How would that work?  I don't think it would be fair or reasonable for all of Vanderbilt's sports to resign from the SEC.  I guess it could work for football.  What about Kentucky football?

I think I would rather push the football program to be better.  I know the conferences are a little different, but if other private schools can have success then why not Vanderbilt?  There are more sports than college football.  I know, shocking!   Then again, there is more to college sports, such as education and being champions in life!

It would be like the NAIA basketball tournament.  Not many care if you win that.  Maybe the European football-soccer Promotion/Relegation leagues are on to something?

Regardless, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I would rather have a new stadium closer to or on campus.  Wouldn't mind a dual purpose stadium then.  Would be easier to organically grow in a denser part of town (similar to Preds-downtown feel).  However, if they are really serious, they could make other locations work.  Would have to be bombastic, but who knows?  It would be creating a denser section of town.  Spread the love, I guess?  A catalyst for growth?

Edited August 19, 2017 by timmay143

[PruneTracy]

1 hour ago, timmay143 said:

I get it, but what about the other sports teams?  How would that work?  I don't think it would be fair or reasonable for all of Vanderbilt's sports to resign from the SEC.  I guess it could work for football.  What about Kentucky football?

I think I would rather push the football program to be better.  I know the conferences are a little different, but if other private schools can have success then why not Vanderbilt?  There are more sports than college football.  I know, shocking!   Then again, there is more to college sports, such as education and being champions in life!

LOL Kentucky football.

Seriously, though, the same effects seen in football extend to a lesser extent to most other varsity sports, e.g., basketball, baseball, etc. I'm not saying Vanderbilt doesn't or can't compete, but I think it puts a pressure on the university counter to its mission when they are in a conference with state universities who put athletics programs on a pedestal. Indeed, Vanderbilt was a major SEC football power for the first part of the 20th century before college sports became a business.

To circle back around to the stadium issue, to make Vanderbilt a typical SEC program would imply the need for a stadium with at least 60,000 seats, probably more like 80,000 just to be average among the remaining SEC schools. That's way out of scale for the campus, for the Fairgrounds, it certainly wouldn't mesh with the needs for an MLS side (though I still think MLS, or any pro league, should not expect stadiums tailored specifically for their teams unless they're willing to finance them themselves). We're talking a couple of billion dollars that doesn't take into account the luxurious training facilities and other venues that are popping up on campuses around the country. Vanderbilt could afford it but it's money better spent elsewhere.

1 hour ago, timmay143 said:

Regardless, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I would rather have a new stadium closer to or on campus.  Wouldn't mind a dual purpose stadium then.  Would be easier to organically grow in a denser part of town (similar to Preds-downtown feel).  However, if they are really serious, they could make other locations work.  Would have to be bombastic, but who knows?  It would be creating a denser section of town.  Spread the love, I guess?  A catalyst for growth?

This whole situation is nuts. There's no reason Vanderbilt needs to play off-campus and there's no reason Nashville SC needs its own stadium, especially one financed by Metro. If they were to build at the Fairgrounds and Vanderbilt doesn't follow them then, after TSU expands the non-car Hole, there would be four rectangular stadiums in Nashville within a three-mile-wide circle with a 25,000+ capacity, two publicly-financed, of which three would also be 40,000 or less. And none of them would be occupied more than about twenty times per year.

I get that different entities are in play here but Vanderbilt and Nashville SC have virtually identical needs for a new stadium, they're both looking to build at the same time, and there's plenty of room in Midtown between West End Avenue and Natchez Trace where both programs would thrive. Makes no sense to overlook that.

[grilled_cheese]

Too bad we can't build a domed stadium with a retractable roof and have every team play there (Vandy, TSU, move the TN HS football championship there, MLS, Titans, NHL outdoor games.

[titanhog]

47 minutes ago, grilled_cheese said:

Too bad we can't build a domed stadium with a retractable roof and have every team play there (Vandy, TSU, move the TN HS football championship there, MLS, Titans, NHL outdoor games.

It's needs a retractable roof...and a button you push that either shrinks or enlarges the seating, so you can have a 20k capacity for the MLS team and TSU...30k for Vandy and then 65k for the Titans.  Nashville's own "Transformers" stadium. 

[MidTenn1]

A few points from me regarding the remarkable and interesting discussion above...

I overlaid the proposed soccer stadium footprint onto the Vandy campus where the current stadium is located and it seems there is no good option as a new stadium would eat up a large piece of expensive, Midtown property. I think it is very close to scale and validates the concerns the University has about proper use of it's campus.

Secondly, just cranking out some crude numbers, it seems that Vanderbilt may be in a $10,000,000 per year hole as compared to other SEC schools in scholarship costs alone ($70k/yr. x 200 athletes = $14,000,000 for Vandy vs. $14k/yr. x 250 = $3,750,000 for typical NCAA school). I suppose that extra $10 million a year could go a long way toward funding a nice stadium at any school, but it's just not there for Vandy.

Finally, does Vandy belong in the SEC? Ask if Nashville belongs in the SEC, instead. If the SEC dropped Vandy and picked up, say Virginia Tech, traveling fans and schools would get to spend the weekend in Blacksburg, Va.  instead of Music City USA. And the Men's Basketball tournament could go back to Birmingham. Are we having fun yet?

I have always thought Vandy should join the Big Ten along with Georgia Tech, instead. That would put the Big 10 in the  growing Atlanta and Nashville markets in the heart of SEC country and it would be a much better fit academically for Vandy, anyway. It would be the SEC's and ACC's loss, big time. 

But I feel the discussion about Vandy leaving the SEC is nonsensical. Vandy is competitive in the SEC and nationally in athletics and the arrow is pointed up. They will not leave the SEC and will get the benefits of playing in a state-of-the-art football stadium (albeit off-campus) at a scale that befits the low enrollment of the University and the scattered national and international nature of their alumni base.

From a guy with two diplomas from UT, I say, let Vandy be Vandy!

[titanhog]

^^But if they built that new stadium where you have it placed, they would then tear down the old stadium and use it for new buildings.  So...in the end, they wouldn't be giving up land...just swapping, so to speak.  But...I do understand that Vandy wants and needs more land...so kicking football off-campus helps that.

[timmay143]

15 hours ago, titanhog said:

It's needs a retractable roof...and a button you push that either shrinks or enlarges the seating, so you can have a 20k capacity for the MLS team and TSU...30k for Vandy and then 65k for the Titans.  Nashville's own "Transformers" stadium. 

And baseball...?    

[grilled_cheese]

The SEC "wants" Vandy for basketball.  They are not leaving.

When the SEC was expanding I was for NC State getting added as that would have added the NC TV market.  I doubt VTech would want to joint the SEC as that would pull them even further from their regional rivals (UVA would probably be their OOC game, Pitt, and WVU would likely be dropped).

[Pdt2f]

A lot of it has to do with media markets. Vandy and Mizzou aren't really SEC caliber football programs, but the league is more than willing to keep them because they give better access to the Nashville, St. Louis, Kansas City, and Columbia, MO media markets. 

[bigeasy]

I am not a Vandy fan so I guess I don't really know, but I personally think moving this off campus would be a huge mistake for the school. I guess students are not the ones that bring in the money for games, but I do think they are a big factor in making games worth going to.  I also doubt people not associated to the school would be more willing to attend a game at the fairgrounds than on campus. I would be fine with off campus if students could still walk there, but I doubt there is any property around campus to allow that.

And it may sound bad, but I highly doubt an organization as prestigious as Vandy would want to have a stadium at the fairgrounds. Just going to be honest, but that area is a dump.

 

 

[L'burgnative]

On 8/19/2017 at 8:50 PM, PHofKS said:

 

 

This is the exact location I was talking about; why isn't this location getting more consideration?  I'm a Bama fan but I'll say your post lost me when you said "Vandy should leave for the B1G" I call bs on that.  The SEC needs Vandy as much as it needs Bama.

Edited August 22, 2017 by L'burgnative

[Titans10]

Nashville SC to play first season at First Tennessee Park

 

http://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/2017/08/22/exclusive-nashville-soccer-club-play-inaugural-season-first-tennessee-park/587832001/

[titanhog]

[Titans10]

This is a good idea for a year or two, it's in a great location and is a good size. Only problem is viewing will be terrible because of the layout. It's unfortunate this wasn't originally designed with soccer in mind, it would have been a great location for the USL team to share with the Sounds. But it's better than playing at Vandy which is what I feared, at least we can drink and they will likely sell out most matches....at least I hope. Now only if Chattanooga FC would join the USL too when they go pro, so we can have a good rivalry with Nashville and Birmingham. 

[nashvylle]

The layout isn't ideal, but NYC Red Bull's play in Yankee stadium... 

[titanhog]

Nashville Vibe.  Nashville Groove.  Nashville Beat.  Just say no, Mr. Ingram!   

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2017/08/23/trademark-filings-reveal-potential-nashville.html

Edited August 24, 2017 by titanhog

[BnaBreaker]

43 minutes ago, titanhog said:

Nashville Vibe.  Nashville Groove.  Nashville Beat.  Just say no, Mr. Ingram!   

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2017/08/23/trademark-filings-reveal-potential-nashville.html

WTF!?!  Those are ultra corny and very minor league... what's wrong with Nashville SC?!  I love the straight forward, classic name and the logo as it is right now!  

[henburg]

The league has been moving towards the more international style of names for many years now, and Nashville SC, while not incredibly unique, fits the mold perfectly. Nashville Vibe, Beat, or Groove match better with the corny expansion teams of the 90's like the Tampa Bay Mutiny or Kansas City Wiz. It would be a massive mistake for Ingram to change it to any of these names. If the name were to be changed, I'd like to see something more localized, but still professional. Maybe something like Music City SC, just not a corny 90's leftover please. 

That all being said copyright files are definitely not always indicative of what an organization chooses, sometimes lots of options are saved that are never used, which is hopefully the case here. 

Edited August 25, 2017 by henburg

[markhollin]

How soccer will work at First Tennessee Park:

http://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/2017/08/23/nashville-soccer-club-usl-first-tennessee-park-sounds-work/591909001/

[CenterHill]

11 hours ago, henburg said:

The league has been moving towards the more international style of names for many years now, and Nashville SC, while not incredibly unique. fits the mold perfectly. Nashville Vibe, Beat, or Groove match better with the corny expansion teams of the 90's like the Tampa Bay Mutiny or Kansas City Wiz. It would be a massive mistake for Ingram to change it to any of these names. If the name were to be changed, I'd like to see something more localized, but still professional. Maybe something like Music City SC, just not a corny 90's leftover please. 

That all being said copyright files are definitely not always indicative of what an organization chooses, sometimes lots of options are saved that are never used, which is hopefully the case here. 

Agree those sound like Arena Football names.    Nashville SC or, better, Nashville FC get my vote.