Triangle Economic News

[KJHburg]

200 jobs for Conduent innovation center in Morrisville. Average salary $100k  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/12/18/conduent-to-open-200-job-2-7m-hub-in-morrisville.html

[KJHburg]

I will call this Triangle East but it is great for NC over in Rocky Mount an 800 employee Chinese tire plant will open.  Their first plant outside of China.  https://edpnc.com/triangle-tyre-selects-kingsboro-megasite-largest-ever-manufacturing-investment-rural-north-carolina  Some may even commute from eastern Wake county I would bet. 

[RALNATIVE]

22 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

I will call this Triangle East but it is great for NC over in Rocky Mount an 800 employee Chinese tire plant will open.  Their first plant outside of China.  https://edpnc.com/triangle-tyre-selects-kingsboro-megasite-largest-ever-manufacturing-investment-rural-north-carolina  Some may even commute from eastern Wake county I would bet. 

This is great for NC and eastern Wake. There are many people in towns like Wendell, Knightdale, Zebulon, and Rolesville that are within reasonable commuting distance to that location.

[Trent Y]

Good for Rocky Mount. Huge shot in the arm with this and the recently announced Corning jobs.

[ctl]

Site detail https://www.econdev.org/kingsboromegasite, about halfway between Rocky Mount and Tarboro.  Over 40 miles from Zebulon and more from Knightdale or Wendell. 

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by ctl

[Jones_]

I've always thought commuter rail should extend to Rocky Mount.....you know...when it finally gets here.  It's downtown has great bones and rail history and it and the Triangle are potentially a good compliment to each other. 

Edited December 20, 2017 by Jones_

[RaleighHeelsfan]

39 minutes ago, Jones_ said:

I've always thought commuter rail should extend to Ricky Mount.....you know...when it finally gets here.  It's downtown has great bones and rail history and it and the Triangle are potentially a good compliment to each other. 

Rail should go to Wilson then Greenville.  Wilson is closer to Raleigh and practically should already be considered part of the MSA in my mind. Wilson downtown also has the bones, and the city as a whole is 10x better than Rocky Mount. Rocky Mount is a scary place all the way around. (I am not talking skin color, I am talking ALL around) Drugs are way out of control. Don't get me wrong, Wilson has problems too, but it does not come close.

Wilson has right near 50,000 people. (I am sure they have now past that) But they have a ton of people who commute to Raleigh. The west side of wilson is only 35 minutes from downtown Raleigh...30 minutes from North Raleigh. For a couple years i commuted to downtown raleigh from near the pitt co line, took me 50 minutes. I live in F-V and it takes me an hour to get home from work!!!

Edited December 20, 2017 by RaleighHeelsfan

[Richhamleigh, DC]

6 hours ago, RaleighHeelsfan said:

Rail should go to Wilson then Greenville.  Wilson is closer to Raleigh and practically should already be considered part of the MSA in my mind. Wilson downtown also has the bones, and the city as a whole is 10x better than Rocky Mount. Rocky Mount is a scary place all the way around. (I am not talking skin color, I am talking ALL around) Drugs are way out of control. Don't get me wrong, Wilson has problems too, but it does not come close.

Wilson has right near 50,000 people. (I am sure they have now past that) But they have a ton of people who commute to Raleigh. The west side of wilson is only 35 minutes from downtown Raleigh...30 minutes from North Raleigh. For a couple years i commuted to downtown raleigh from near the pitt co line, took me 50 minutes. I live in F-V and it takes me an hour to get home from work!!!

There was a proposal back around 2001 - 2004 called Eastrans.  For service from Goldsboro to Raleigh to Wilson.  NS was involved in the talks and potentially interested in operating the northern part of the crescent while NCRR would operate the southern portion. 

[ctl]

There isn't  direct rail line between Rocky Mount and Raleigh. It's an interesting point of history that at one time, the Atlantic Coast Line RR -- the wealthiest railroad in the south at the time, by virtue of its line between Richmond, Va and Florida that passes through Rocky Mount -- did intend to build a line into Raleigh from Rocky Mount. They got as far as the eastern vicinity of Rolesville before the idea died in 1929. A segment of that line still exists between Spring Hope and Rocky Mount to serve freight customers.

The eastward rail commute route most likely to happen in the intermediate term is Raleigh-Garner-Clayton-Selma. In theory it could be extended eastward to Goldsboro. This is also one of the potential ways to run Raleigh-Wilmington trains. Or the commute route could turn north at Selma to reach Wilson or Rocky Mount. This is how the Amtrak trains run today.

As for the "original NS" line that runs Raleigh-Knightdale-Wendell-Wilson direct, in theory  it could be used for commuter trains but it would require a massive capital investment.

You might see Raleigh-Garner-Clayton-Selma in 15-20 years. You'll have to wait longer for the others. 

[KJHburg]

Another small tech firm moving its headquarters to the Triangle (Durham) from Silicon Valley.  Quote from Triangle Business Journal article

""For 16 years, data protection software firm StrongAuth has been based in Silicon Valley, its small team of engineers pushing out open-source cybersecurity technologies for both government and enterprise clients. But a recently completed $10 million funder means major growth is on the horizon – and it’s not happening in California. CEO Jake Kiser says that, while StrongAuth is keeping its small office in Silicon Valley, its administrative headquarters is now in Durham. And that’s where the bulk of the hiring will be happening.""

Subscriber article https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/01/04/armed-with-10m-silicon-valley-firm-taps-durham-for.html?ana=e_du_prem&s=article_du&ed=2018-01-04&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1515098899&j=79447031

It came down to 2 places to grow California or NC and NC won out! 

[Jones_]

That extra emphasis on Durham makes me think this was more about Durham and less (despite) about NC...I could be wrong. And, of course, lots of statewide things = Durham. Anyway, good news. 

[KJHburg]

^^ I think it has many reasons much lower cost of living, low state corporate taxes, great universities 3 great state universities in the Triangle alone, less competition for labor, east coast location.   Silicon Valley is an extremely expensive place to grow a company ask Trilliant  who moved HQ from Silicon Valley to Cary earlier in the year.  

[urbanlover568]

On 1/4/2018 at 5:34 PM, Jones_ said:

That extra emphasis on Durham makes me think this was more about Durham and less (despite) about NC...I could be wrong. And, of course, lots of statewide things = Durham. Anyway, good news. 

Durham  is growing at a rapid rate. It's becoming the place to be now in the triangle. 

[Jones_]

On 1/4/2018 at 7:37 PM, KJHburg said:

^^ I think it has many reasons much lower cost of living, low state corporate taxes, great universities 3 great state universities in the Triangle alone, less competition for labor, east coast location.   Silicon Valley is an extremely expensive place to grow a company ask Trilliant  who moved HQ from Silicon Valley to Cary earlier in the year.  

Oh yeah I know all of those reasons...they are fairly objective. I just thought I smelled a subjective "Durham" being a deciding factor. Take Durham out of the RTP area, and to some people it just wouldn't be anywhere near the same. 

[ctl]

Too bad about the loss of the auto plant to Alabama. The Triangle would surely have received from spill-over, even if we shared the benefits with the Triad and Charlotte. I-85 between the two Hyundai/Kia plants in Montgomery, Ala and West Point, Ga (just across the river into Georgia) has numerous suppliers and subcontractors for Hyundai/Kia. 

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

3 hours ago, ctl said:

Too bad about the loss of the auto plant to Alabama. The Triangle would surely have received from spill-over, even if we shared the benefits with the Triad and Charlotte. I-85 between the two Hyundai/Kia plants in Montgomery, Ala and West Point, Ga (just across the river into Georgia) has numerous suppliers and subcontractors for Hyundai/Kia. 

I personally never thought that N.C. had much of a chance as there are now so many auto manufacturers in that part of the country. Maybe other types of manufacturing?

[ctl]

It does become an irresistible trend after a while. But the NC countryside needs a landmark large employer who pays good wages. The State will have to try again.

[KJHburg]

^^^ Not to mention a Toyota Engine plant near Huntsville that was just expanded.  Hopefully that site would be sold too for the Rocky Mt site was finally taken  with the new Chinese tire plant. 

In other news Raleigh and Wake County continue to add jobs #2 best new job market in the country.  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/01/10/raleigh-is-second-best-performing-city-for-jobs-in.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2018-01-10&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1515621587&j=79481841

[Jones_]

Northern Durham County has at least two car parts manufacturers that I know of (one that does car window motors and another that does transmissions) so I always kind of figured the I-85 corridor could stand a chance for us. Having said that, I noticed one article that blamed a lack of "supply chain logistics" for us not getting it. Well, I know what supply chains are, and logistics are situational....but I am still not sure exactly what was meant by that statement and could the State have had any control over it. Were they just saying there weren't enough other car part places nearby? Are our 'megasites' poorly located? 

[KJHburg]

^^^ I think it is more that Toyota has an engine plant very close by to this new Alabama site plus with plants to the west in Mississippi and plants north in Kentucky and there are just lots of auto suppliers around that mid south region.   We do have lots of auto suppliers here in NC all over the piedmont but evidently it was not enough. 

We got one megasite used with the Chinese tire company in Rocky Mount and I think they other 2 the one in Randolph and Chatham counties are in great locations close to Greensboro and Raleigh respectively. 

[plus2]

I think you could interpret "supply chain logistics" that it simply would cost too much to transport the parts to NC, or reversely that the Alabama location would save a bunch of money on that front. Perhaps Toyota actually preferred the NC location, but couldn't make the economics work.

We're playing catch up on auto plants. We need to find a different industry or market to corner. Too bad Boeing went to SC.

[JeffC]

Remember when NC State was trying to hire a basketball coach (the time they ended up hiring Sidney Lowe) and all the big name coaches feigned interest in us to get their current schools to cough up raises?  THat is what I am told by the economic development types happened with Toyota.  THey were never really interested in coming here...they just wanted Alabama to up the ante, as it were...

[ctl]

It's plausible... definitely a buyer's market, and this time there appear to be no recriminations or finger-pointing within NC over the loss. 

Look back 25 years. Complacency with RTP, the Charlotte banks, the military bases, and tobacco/textiles/furniture money (still very influential back then) led NC not to compete seriously for the initial round of automobile plants in the south. I think the textiles/furniture crowd, in particular, did not want automobile companies bidding up the cost of labor in-state -- or, heaven forbid, bring in unionization. The old industries could already see the threat from Asia and Latin America by then.

Of course, if we get Amazon HQ2, no one in the Triangle will care about the absence of an auto plant in NC... but the delta between thriving urban areas and depressed rural areas will be exacerbated, and that's not good for the state.

Edited January 11, 2018 by ctl

[RALNATIVE]

49 minutes ago, ctl said:

It's plausible... definitely a buyer's market, and this time there appear to be no recriminations or finger-pointing within NC over the loss. 

Look back 25 years. Complacency with RTP, the Charlotte banks, the military bases, and tobacco/textiles/furniture money (still very influential back then) led NC not to compete seriously for the initial round of automobile plants in the south. I think the textiles/furniture crowd, in particular, did not want automobile companies bidding up the cost of labor in-state -- or, heaven forbid, bring in unionization. The old industries could already see the threat from Asia and Latin America by then.

Of course, if we get Amazon HQ2, no one in the Triangle will care about the absence of an auto plant in NC... but the delta between thriving urban areas and depressed rural areas will be exacerbated, and that's not good for the state.

I think you're right. Another example of how NC, in particular, did not plan and prepare for the eventual decline of the traditional industries of agriculture, furniture, and textiles. They did not invest as they should have in the future economy, other than what we see with RTP, and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

[KJHburg]

That is why that 800 employee Chinese tire factory outside of Rocky Mount is such a big thing.  The urban areas will thrive more if the rest of NC is doing okay.  With manufacturing coming back somewhat mainly to smaller towns this is good the entire state.  Everyone can not work or live in Charlotte or the Triangle.