Triangle Economic News

[KJHburg]

Another California tech firm establishing an office in downtown Raleigh to serve as a "dual headquarters" in the Charter Square bldg.  Company is RapidScale, a cloud services provider. 

From the subscriber only article Triangle Business Journal 

""The headcount currently stands at 21 in Raleigh, putting a strain on the recently completed office that already has the company considering local expansion options.  Barnes says it comes down to tech talent availability. The firm’s headquarters is in Irvine, California, at the northern tip of Orange County. And Irvine pales in terms of tech talent density when compared to some other parts of California, such as San Jose and San Francisco.  Tech talent, for the most part, has to drive in from Los Angeles or San Diego – potentially hours of grueling congestion. And they face California’s “insanely high” real estate costs. Enter in the Raleigh office. So, when a job became available, Barnes would put out feelers through staffing firms in both Irvine and Raleigh.“For every four to five candidates we get in Raleigh, we might get one in Irvine,” Barnes says.

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/02/28/california-tech-company-grows-east-coast-hq-in.html?ana=e_du_prem&s=article_du&ed=2018-02-28&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1519851075&j=80249481

[Trent Y]

Well maybe they can expand and help fill up Charter Square North. Which a little birdie says will start in 1 or 2 months. Kind of sucks because its been pushed from December to Feb already.  But sounds like March or April at the latest now.

[KJHburg]

Good video on the tech and upstart community in the Triangle area 

 

[KJHburg]

Yet another Silicon Valley startup choosing Raleigh as their east coast base  Cohesity leased 20K sq of space for up to 100 employees. 

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/03/12/silicon-valley-startup-sets-up-shop-in-raleigh.html?ana=e_ae_set2&s=article_du&ed=2018-03-12&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1520894762&j=80453211

In other news a British translation service picks Raleigh for first US office.  

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2018/03/12/british-business-picks-raleigh-for-first-u-s.html

 

Edited March 13, 2018 by KJHburg

[ctl]

17 hours ago, KJHburg said:

In other news a British translation service picks Raleigh for first US office.  

Delta's RDU-Paris nonstop is a good thing to have, and an RDU-China nonstop would be good too. But the ongoing commitment of American Airlines to RDU-LHR nonstop continues to be a big plus for the Triangle... especially since Delta is still operating its CDG flight with a narrow-body 757 during the winter.

Edited March 13, 2018 by ctl

[Scotchman]

"RDU-China nonstop would be good "

I would like very much to see a direct flight to Shanghai. I may not be the kind of customer that swings these type's of decisions, I only make the trip once or twice a year, but direct would be GREAT. Are you listening United or other Star-Alliance carriers?

[ctl]

I've been to China on business 7 times in the last few years. The trick with RDU-China is that only a few aircraft can fly the nonstop route profitably. You need range of 7000+ miles, but the route won't draw enough passengers to make a very  large aircraft feasible. This restricts the choice of aircraft considerably, and airlines have many uses already for such an aircraft.

My guess is that the route will happen eventually, but it will be a Chinese airline that offers service three or four times a week at the outset. I think it's very unlikely to be a Oneworld member/affiliate... more likely to be SkyTeam than Star.

[Scotchman]

7000 mile, low demand (for international routes) is what the 787's are designed for. United flies 8,700-mile  LA to Singapore and  Qantas just started a 9,008 mile  London to Perth using 787-9's.  Demand may be in issue,  maybe every other day which would allow one plane to do outbound and return 3 times a week.  According to a report out a few weeks ago 67 people per day make trip to and from China.  A direct flight would pull in some travelers that now drive to Charlotte and Triad for flights.  I personally come from Boone even though Charlotte is closer.  Trips from Raleigh are cheaper, have better connections (shorter flight time) and I have free parking in Raleigh.  One thing that may immediately drive up trip count going to Shanghai (PVG)  is Duke University just opened a campus between Shanghai and Suzhou.  Google maps 31°25'11.0"N 120°53'31.3"E. But my guess is projected demand for 300 passenger round trips per week to attract a 3 time a week direct flight.  Air China is a Star Alliance member as well as United which seems to often have best routing out of RDU for places I go. But all said while I would like to see direct RDU to PVG flights, will be surprised if happens anytime soon.

 

[RiverwoodCLT]

For a long flight to the far east, you will need a 12,000 ft.  or more due to the weight of fuel for take off.

[ctl]

The 788 is viable. I'm not convinced about the load factor on a 789.  Problem is,  the Chinese international airlines haven't been big buyers of any 787 variant.  They have some but not many. As far as Airbus aircraft are concerned, the A338neo is too scarce and their other aircraft, like the Boeing 777, are probably too big.   

I don't believe there is much chance that American, Delta, or United will fly RDU-China nonstop.

In any event, runway length at RDU will indeed be an issue, at least in summer.  Until RDU builds the new runway, an outbound from RDU would presumably fly to IAD for refueling; the runways there are 11,500. 

[RiverwoodCLT]

I read that American was losing money at DFW airport to China.    If  DFW can't make money,  I do not see any flights out of North Carolina anytime soon.

Edited March 14, 2018 by RiverwoodCLT

[ctl]

AA flies DFW-Shanghai, DFW-Beijing, and DFW-Hong Kong. They also fly LAX-Hong Kong, LAX-Beijing, LAX-Shanghai, Chicago-Shanghai, and Chicago-Beijing. That's a lot of daily seats, not counting people who connect at Narita for cities in China. For years people have warned that AA was going too far. AA replies that they are committed to the market.

I still believe that RDU is likely to be served by China Southern, China Eastern, Hainan, or one of the others.

[KJHburg]

26 minutes ago, ctl said:

AA flies DFW-Shanghai, DFW-Beijing, and DFW-Hong Kong. They also fly LAX-Hong Kong, LAX-Beijing, LAX-Shanghai, Chicago-Shanghai, and Chicago-Beijing. That's a lot of daily seats, not counting people who connect at Narita for cities in China. For years people have warned that AA was going too far. AA replies that they are committed to the market.

I still believe that RDU is likely to be served by China Southern, China Eastern, Hainan, or one of the others.

I have flown the DFW to HKG flight 3x and it is packed coming back to the USA and about 60-70% going over there.  HKG is unique as it is a gateway to southeast Asia and most people I meet on that flight are going to Thailand, Vietnam, etc   Never been on the other flights but I can tell you this from CLT to HKG was cheaper for me than nonstop from CLT to London Heathrow same time period. 

Plus remember there is a time sensitive freight coming from Hong Kong region as that area has some of the greatest concentration of manufacturing in China.  So freight could be paying the bills even if the passenger loads are less.  But every time I have from back to DFW from HKG the flight was full much to my disappointment. 

Edited March 15, 2018 by KJHburg

[15895]

3 hours ago, ctl said:

AA flies DFW-Shanghai, DFW-Beijing, and DFW-Hong Kong. They also fly LAX-Hong Kong, LAX-Beijing, LAX-Shanghai, Chicago-Shanghai, and Chicago-Beijing. That's a lot of daily seats, not counting people who connect at Narita for cities in China. For years people have warned that AA was going too far. AA replies that they are committed to the market.

I still believe that RDU is likely to be served by China Southern, China Eastern, Hainan, or one of the others.

I think that is out of the realm of possibility. The only Asian flights RDU could potentially get is Seoul on Korean and Tokyo on Delta and that is a giant stretch. I think right now Atlanta only has Tokyo and Seoul and Shanghai is coming online in July.  

Miami doesn't even have an Asian flight (despite having flights around the rest of the world (Tel Aviv, Istanbul, Doha, Moscow,  everywhere in South and Central America, all over Europe). Plus its an American hub. 

American Airlines itself only had 8 daily flights from the US to Asia until it started its Dallas flights (which AA says that pretty much its Asian routes don't make money period but American has to be in the market and is investing in these routes for the future. Kinda like US Airways did with flights to South America/Brasil before the AA merger)

Philadelphia doesn't have any Asian flights. I would guess the pecking order for the east coast is Philadelphia - Miami - Charlotte - toss ups (Raleigh would actually be my next bet but way below PHL/MIA/CLT because of connections, alliances, etc. But I would imagine Raleigh would get a flight before any other cities). Phoenix would also probably be up there in the top of being next for Asian service.

 

Asian service is difficult. I would bet the next long haul destinations out of RDU would be: Iceland, Amsterdam, Rome, Munich in that order. 

 

 

Edited March 15, 2018 by AirNostrumMAD

[Isaac]

Iceland would be pretty awesome.  They have a lot of discount flights to Europe. 

[ctl]

Yes, HKG is a major connecting point. I go through there six times a year on my way to Singapore, KL, etc. But as convenient as it would be for me personally, I can't see RDU-HKG. HKG is dominated by the established big players (Cathay Pacific, American, United, Delta) none of whom would be interested in RDU. Plus, for citizens of the PRC, getting permission even to transit at HKG on the outbound involves additional paperwork.

There has been a significant Korean community in Atlanta for 40 years, and now there is additional demand because of the Hyundai/Kia plants (and plants of their component vendors) on I-85 between Atlanta and Montgomery... same story as what drives flights between Charlotte and Germany. I've been on flights between Atlanta and Montgomery when more than half the seats were filled with Koreans.

AA was late to the party in Asia. Northwest was historically a player, then they were bought by Delta. United bought the Asia routes of Pan Am, another historic player. At first American tried to participate in Asia with Canadian Airlines out of Vancouver. But Canadian went bust, leaving American in a catch-up position. They have recovered somewhat by getting Japan Air Lines and Cathay Pacific into Oneworld. A lot of people fly to Narita on American, especially in business class where the high dollars are, and make onward connections on JAL there.  Both JAL and Cathay are superb.

[KJHburg]

JLL highlighting the Raleigh Durham tech office market.  http://jllcampaigns.com/jlltechspec/articles/raleigh-top-tech-talent-hub-2018?utm_campaign=TechSpec weekly email 3%2F23%2F2018&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Eloqua

[Merthecat]

An article from the N&O outlining why Raleigh needs a dense central area and why RTP should be revitalized:

http://www.newsobserver.com/opinion/article206532529.html

[KJHburg]

Dude Solutions a Cary software company is expanding rapidly. 80 new hires since November.  Here is a story about them  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/03/27/new-dude-solutions-ceo-charts-acquisitions-hiring.html?ana=e_ae_set4&s=article_du&ed=2018-03-28&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1522266155&j=80737271

[Merthecat]

Purr Cup Cafe is looking for a location in downtown Raleigh.  They hope to open a "cat cafe" in which customers can drink coffee and adopt cats from a separate room.

https://purrcupcafe.com/

Sounds like a neat concept, and one that I'd love to experience (as a cat lover).

[Jones_]

13 hours ago, Merthecat said:

Purr Cup Cafe is looking for a location in downtown Raleigh.  They hope to open a "cat cafe" in which customers can drink coffee and adopt cats from a separate room.

https://purrcupcafe.com/

Sounds like a neat concept, and one that I'd love to experience (as a cat lover).

The one's I've been to are rightfully, very controlled environments. You can't just stroll in and pet kitties...you have to have an appointment to do that. But coffee and cats are in my top 5 favorite things, so I'd definitely be hanging out there too. 

[KJHburg]

300-400 new jobs coming to Morrisville with new 60,000 sq ft lease with TrialCard.  From subscriber article of Triangle Business Journal

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/04/12/trialcard-expansion-brings-more-than-300-jobs.html?ana=e_du_prem&s=article_du&ed=2018-04-12&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1523563471&j=80998051

""Pharmaceutical services and analytics company TrialCard is expanding its operations into new space in the Triangle and adding 300 to 400 more jobs in the coming months.  TrialCard CEO Mark Bouck confirms the company is moving into roughly 60,000 square feet at 3200 Gateway Centre Blvd., off of Aviation Parkway in Morrisville.""

[KJHburg]

and forgot this one 422 new jobs with LabCorp  in the old GSK facility in RTP now called Parmer RTP  a 200,000 sq ft. lease and 422 jobs. 

http://www.areadevelopment.com/newsItems/4-12-2018/labcorp-durham-county-north-carolina.shtml

That is over 700 jobs at the min announced in one week in the Triangle. 

[RALNATIVE]

13 hours ago, KJHburg said:

and forgot this one 422 new jobs with LabCorp  in the old GSK facility in RTP now called Parmer RTP  a 200,000 sq ft. lease and 422 jobs. 

http://www.areadevelopment.com/newsItems/4-12-2018/labcorp-durham-county-north-carolina.shtml

That is over 700 jobs at the min announced in one week in the Triangle. 

I've always wondered if LabCorp was considering a move of it's HQ, or at least more of it's operations, to the Triangle. It makes sense since  one of their biggest rivals is located in the area.

I guess this move helps solidify that idea.

[ctl]

One could say it's an accident of history that the company we now know as Labcorp came to be HQ'd in Burlington. Labcorp is notoriously thrifty, and  as a relatively low-cost location Burlington has suited it well so far. You may have seen a former Citi building on I-85 that Labcorp snapped up. But as the company continues to grow, there isn't much office and lab space still on the market in Burlington. Also, Burlington is a drag on Labcorp's recruiting... either living there or having to commute there. So yes, RTP makes sense for Labcorp as long as they can find inexpensive space as they're accustomed to. The former GSK building, like the former Citi space in Burlington, probably had an attractive lease rate.