Triangle Economic News

[SydneyCarton]

This is amazing.  The Triangle is really burgeoning into a high tech powerhouse.  Considering the very low cost of living and relative lack of traffic compared to other tech centers, I think that this is just the tip of the iceberg.

[KJHburg]

24 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

Has the exact location shown up in a story? Presumably we know where apple owns the land already. 

On Little Drive in southern section of RTP in Wake County between Louis Stephens and Davis Drive.  They have owned for 3 years now  under name Acute Investments. 

24 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

Has the exact location shown up in a story? Presumably we know where apple owns the land already. 

On Little Drive in southern section of RTP in Wake County between Louis Stephens and Davis Drive.  They have owned for 3 years now  under name Acute Investments. 

[Richhamleigh, DC]

Nice article from CNBC...

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/26/apple-announces-1-billion-north-carolina-campus.html

[tozmervo]

3 hours ago, KJHburg said:

On Little Drive in southern section of RTP in Wake County between Louis Stephens and Davis Drive.  They have owned for 3 years now  under name Acute Investments. 

The big triangular plot below? 

[DownEast]

I think that's the eastern half. I believe 540 bisects the total plot. 

[DPK]

It's all of this.

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by DPK

[KJHburg]

Yes that is correct plot of land above in @DPK post.  across the lake from Cisco Systems.  they own it under the name of Acute Investments.  They bought it about 3 years then decided to expand in Austin where they already had 6000 employees.  This will grow much bigger than 3000 jobs I bet.  More below from Apple themselves

Apple commits $430 billion in US investments over five years - Apple

another national story on Apple in RTP

Apple To Invest $430B Across U.S. Over Five Years (businessfacilities.com)

and yet another

Apple To Develop $1B Campus As Part Of New $430B Commitment To U.S. Investments (bisnow.com)

this is indeed BIG news 

Just now, KJHburg said:

Yes that is correct plot of land above in @DPK post.  across the lake from Cisco Systems.  they own it under the name of Acute Investments.  They bought it about 3 years then decided to expand in Austin where they already had 6000 employees.  This will grow much bigger than 3000 jobs I bet.  More below from Apple themselves

Apple commits $430 billion in US investments over five years - Apple

another national story on Apple in RTP

Apple To Invest $430B Across U.S. Over Five Years (businessfacilities.com)

and yet another

Apple To Develop $1B Campus As Part Of New $430B Commitment To U.S. Investments (bisnow.com)

this is indeed BIG news 

I am not sure they own the triangle piece at the corner of Little and Davis Drive though.  (inside I-540) 

 

[rancenc]

Official announcement for the state on the topic of Apple's expansion!

https://www.nccommerce.com/news/press-releases/governor-cooper-announces-apple-will-create-3000-jobs-wake-county

[KJHburg]

actual photos of the Apple RTP campus site I took in November on a trip to Cary.

this is from Little Drive and I was looking for any work and at the time there was surveying etc. being done.    Just down from Parkside Town Common shopping center in Cary right by 540.  

[Richhamleigh, DC]

I wonder if Gov. Terry Sanford would be happy today?

[Richhamleigh, DC]

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/apple-picks-north-carolina-research-triangle-park-campus/

[Durham_Transplant]

It’s honestly still surreal to think about Apple and Google making these announcements in the span of a month. Sure it’s been talked about forever and always felt like a “matter of time” scenario but this feels bigger and faster than most anticipated. Some part of me always felt like the political landscape, transit, size, whatever would prevent something of this scale from really happening. This absolutely will be a watershed moment for the Triangle in terms of the companies, talent and capital we are able to attract going forward. Exciting times ahead folks.

[KJHburg]

Big Tech has long needed to diversify their locations too much was concentrated in California and Seattle and both Google and now Apple are finding they need to be where the talent is at or graduating from.  Can you imagine taking a $100,000 year job and living with a roommate in a small apartment in Silicon Valley to work for Apple?  Dittos for Google. The biggest and brightest minds are not willing to move to California as much anymore as they once were  and big Tech needs to diversify their geographical footprint.  Apple is looking at 10,000+ employees in Austin in the next few years their largest outpost outside of Silicon Valley.  I fully expect this Apple campus to be a lot bigger than 3000 employees over time.   Microsoft is building a huge campus in Atlanta for example too.  

This is indeed great news for the Triangle region and these employees will live all over the metro area intown Durham, suburban Cary or Apex, north Raleigh, even downtown Raleigh and Chapel Hill and far beyond. I can see express buses in the future going to this campus from all directions.  

[Crucial_Infra]

On 4/26/2021 at 5:05 PM, KJHburg said:

actual photos of the Apple RTP campus site I took in November on a trip to Cary.

this is from Little Drive and I was looking for any work and at the time there was surveying etc. being done.    Just down from Parkside Town Common shopping center in Cary right by 540.  

The signs were always there. 

[Crucial_Infra]

On 4/26/2021 at 2:03 PM, DPK said:

It's all of this.

 

It’s such a sweet location. Almost equidistant between Duke (15 mins), UNC Chapel Hill (17 mins) and NC State (19 mins). And located at the junction of two “interstates” (NC 540 and NC 885). Also NC 55 nearby. It’s a heavyweight piece of land which is why Cisco is located there as well. 13 mins to Cary. 12 mins to RDU. 14 mins to Apex. These employees can live wherever they want in the Triangle. 

Edited April 28, 2021 by Crucial_Infra

[RALNATIVE]

On 4/26/2021 at 7:22 PM, Durham_Transplant said:

It’s honestly still surreal to think about Apple and Google making these announcements in the span of a month. Sure it’s been talked about forever and always felt like a “matter of time” scenario but this feels bigger and faster than most anticipated. Some part of me always felt like the political landscape, transit, size, whatever would prevent something of this scale from really happening. This absolutely will be a watershed moment for the Triangle in terms of the companies, talent and capital we are able to attract going forward. Exciting times ahead folks.

Once those Apple, Google, and all of the other very high paying jobs materialize, look for the per capita income for this area to be through the roof. Raleigh/Wake County already has the highest per capita in the state, but it will be off the charts in a few years. Watch for many more economic benefits to be reaped over the coming years.

[SydneyCarton]

While I prefer my original NC home, Charlotte, to the Triangle, I think that it in the not too distant future, the Triangle will be the absolutely dominant area of the Carolinas.  I am continually impressed with the massive intellectual capital of this area, and that capital will continue to be an enormous magnet to draw very high-end jobs from Boston and SF.    

Edited April 28, 2021 by SydneyCarton

[DownEast]

12 hours ago, RALNATIVE said:

Once those Apple, Google, and all of the other very high paying jobs materialize, look for the per capita income for this area to be through the roof. Raleigh/Wake County already has the highest per capita in the state, but it will be off the charts in a few years. Watch for many more economic benefits to be reaped over the coming years.

Orange County has highest per capita income in NC. Wake is a close second. Average median household income though has Wake pretty far ahead of the pack. The distribution of residences related to these new jobs will be interesting with Chatham and Alamance gaining steam with their affordability and also with the completion of NC 540, Johnston is about to explode. Heck, lookout for Granville with the completion of 885. It's time the Triangle starts to look at some sort of multi-nodal transit network starting with DT Raleigh and RTP and eventually DT Durham. 

[RALNATIVE]

2 hours ago, DownEast said:

Orange County has highest per capita income in NC. Wake is a close second. Average median household income though has Wake pretty far ahead of the pack. The distribution of residences related to these new jobs will be interesting with Chatham and Alamance gaining steam with their affordability and also with the completion of NC 540, Johnston is about to explode. Heck, lookout for Granville with the completion of 885. It's time the Triangle starts to look at some sort of multi-nodal transit network starting with DT Raleigh and RTP and eventually DT Durham. 

Since Apple is planning $100M for infrastructure within the state, hopefully some of that money will go towards improved Triangle transit (i.e. light rail). I would imagine that they are helping fund Austin's light rail.

[RALNATIVE]

17 hours ago, Crucial_Infra said:

It’s such a sweet location. Almost equidistant between Duke (15 mins), UNC Chapel Hill (17 mins) and NC State (19 mins). And located at the junction of two “interstates” (NC 540 and NC 885). Also NC 55 nearby. It’s a heavyweight piece of land which is why Cisco is located there as well. 13 mins to Cary. 12 mins to RDU. 14 mins to Apex. These employees can live wherever they want in the Triangle. 

Does anyone know if this site actually has a Raleigh address?

[Richhamleigh, DC]

4 hours ago, DownEast said:

Orange County has highest per capita income in NC. Wake is a close second. Average median household income though has Wake pretty far ahead of the pack. The distribution of residences related to these new jobs will be interesting with Chatham and Alamance gaining steam with their affordability and also with the completion of NC 540, Johnston is about to explode. Heck, lookout for Granville with the completion of 885. It's time the Triangle starts to look at some sort of multi-nodal transit network starting with DT Raleigh and RTP and eventually DT Durham. 

Butner, in Granville, is closer to Treyburn, RTP, and downtown Durham than any of the aforementioned places....it's closer than Holly Springs or Fuquay Varina as well.   And, lots of lake front land.  

[Rufus]

2 hours ago, RALNATIVE said:

Does anyone know if this site actually has a Raleigh address?

The CISCO buildings there have a Durham address, so most likely the same for Apple. 

[KJHburg]

about those Apple salaries and they are almost triple the Wake county average.

Apple salaries for new Triangle jobs will be close to double its average wage, data show | WRAL TechWire

I think the employees will live all over.  Some younger ones will live in central Durham or even downtown Raleigh.  Those with families will pick Cary, Chatham County, Apex, all the way down to Fuquay and Holly Springs and N Raleigh.  But these Apple employees will live all over the Triangle for sure.  

would this not have a RTP mailing address?  Cisco has one 

Cisco Systems, Inc | Research Triangle Park (rtp.org)

 

[RALNATIVE]

4 hours ago, KJHburg said:

about those Apple salaries and they are almost triple the Wake county average.

Apple salaries for new Triangle jobs will be close to double its average wage, data show | WRAL TechWire

I think the employees will live all over.  Some younger ones will live in central Durham or even downtown Raleigh.  Those with families will pick Cary, Chatham County, Apex, all the way down to Fuquay and Holly Springs and N Raleigh.  But these Apple employees will live all over the Triangle for sure.  

would this not have a RTP mailing address?  Cisco has one 

Cisco Systems, Inc | Research Triangle Park (rtp.org)

 

I'm thinking that developers must be considering more high rise urban residential. I'm talking Skyhouse or Walter type of developments. The typical Google and Apple millenial employee is interested in urban living and being surrounded by urban amenities.  That's why the cost of housing in San Francisco, for example, is so outrageously high.

Supply/Demand + High Salaries = High COL

Now's the time for developers and city planners in Raleigh, Durham, and Cary to really start focusing on what will attract and retain Apple and Google type employees.

[KJHburg]

Both Google and Apple are based in Silicon Valley in Mountain View and Cupertino respectively.  These are both more suburban in nature and sure some employees live in more urban areas like downtown San Fran or San Jose but San Francisco is really a good bit away.  Many of the younger employees will want apartments and townhomes nearby but seeing they can afford to buy a home  many will  do that.  I do think many will choose to live in downtown Durham and Raleigh for sure.  But many will end up in Cary Morrisville, southern Durham county and just everywhere.  Apple's new campus in Austin is in the far north suburbs.  There are 1000s of apartments nearby but their people live all over the region.   I think this gives a lot of push for the Hub RTP where 1200 apartments are to built.  (Hint they need to start immediately on those)  I think some will love living in the apartments at Fenton in Cary for example as well as the Van Allen in downtown Durham.   I just think this is so big there is not one area can contain all the employees.

The question is how quick is the hiring going to be and where is some temporary office space going to be located?   Will these be mostly new hires and fresh out of college or a mix of professionals in AI and machine learning from all over the country?  

Google and Apple both announcing this year is incredible for the area but Google has a head start. 

If you look at many of the jobs Google is advertising where you can work in Durham amongst other places they are pretty experienced positions Search Jobs - Google Careers     Lets see Silicon Valley, Seattle  NYC or Durham or Austin only the last 2 are affordable.

 

 

Edited April 29, 2021 by KJHburg