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KJHburg

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6 hours ago, ctl said:

RTP has expanded before and could expand again. The legal mechanisms exist. The issue is, at what value would TMC be appraised. Ain't gonna be cheap.  

 

RTP needs to do more with what they have than sprawling aimlessly.  I work in the tech sector and while I realize RTP is a draw to this area, I have zero desire to work in RTP.  I'd rather be in one of the downtown cores of the Triangle, allowing me to do things at lunch and after work easily within walking distance.

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4 hours ago, DPK said:

 

RTP needs to do more with what they have than sprawling aimlessly.  I work in the tech sector and while I realize RTP is a draw to this area, I have zero desire to work in RTP.  I'd rather be in one of the downtown cores of the Triangle, allowing me to do things at lunch and after work easily within walking distance.

Agreed. I work in IT and feel fortunate to work in downtown Raleigh and not RTP.  They've looked at it; if you google RTP urbanization they have some articles from around 2014 discussing it which includes adding residential and such as infill. There's a lot of land in RTP that is just surface parking or empty that they can work with but they need to commit to getting commuter rail, cycleway, etc. The office park is a dying anachronism from the 70s and 80s - people today want live/work/play downtowns. 

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People will always have personal preferences, and you're free to exercise those preferences as you see fit. That said, I can tell you there is absolutely no evidence that companies in/around RTP are having problems filling their open positions. People on this forum are predisposed to favor urbanism. Depending on where one lives, commuting into DTR or DTD is not easy either. Maybe it should be, but at present it's not. ITB Raleigh cannot hold the population of the Triangle.  It's simply infeasible to meet all of Amazon's requirements in DTR or DTD. Like it or not, RTP is here to stay and if someone is looking for 100+ acres, it's gonna be OTB. 

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The Triangle may have large job prospects held up by this Amazon decision according to this article.  Everyone is waiting on Amazon to announce their short list. 

This proves what I have been talking about from Dallas Business Journal. Other companies want to see where Amazon ends up so they go elsewhere.  https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news/2017/10/19/how-dallas-fort-worth-is-already-feeling-the.html?ana=e_ae_set3&s=scroll&ed=2017-10-21&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1508592556&j=79031501

"I've seen a slowdown in relocating companies and companies waiting to make a final determination until Amazon makes a decision," Arledge told the Dallas Business Journal. "The Amazon effect has slowed down some things. Until they put together a short list or pick a final location, I think this will continue to have an impact on some other real estate searches."

"With Amazon promising to bring up to 50,000 jobs with the average pay of $100,000 with its second North American campus, Arledge said companies — especially those in the financial services or technology industries — want to steer clear of Amazon's No.1 draft pick for an HQ2."

with the average pay of $100,000 with its second North American campus, Arledge said companies — especially those in the financial services or technology industries — want to steer clear of Amazon's No.1 draft pick for an HQ2."

Arledge said she has already suggested some clients wanting to open a big operation in Dallas, Atlanta and Raleigh to hang tight — or go on a brief hiatus — before making a major relocation or consolidation decision.

Edited by KJHburg
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Maybe if there are a couple of BIG job projects that Raleigh has good change of landing, make them this offer (if they are big enough).  If you agree to come here we will withdraw from the Amazon bid (we may be kind of a long shot anyway).   Would it not be better to have multiple smaller (as relation to Amazons forecast (promise??))  than one huge one that maybe 10 years down the road decide that new tech means we do not need you any more.

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Very interesting.  If Amazon were to choose Raleigh, the only place in downtown that I could envision HQ2 is along Harrington St., between Hillsborough and Peace. 

But I would really be surprised if Raleigh is selected in the first place.  I'm not sure the city is quite capable of accommodating such a large investment at this point.

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30 minutes ago, Merthecat said:

Very interesting.  If Amazon were to choose Raleigh, the only place in downtown that I could envision HQ2 is along Harrington St., between Hillsborough and Peace. 

But I would really be surprised if Raleigh is selected in the first place.  I'm not sure the city is quite capable of accommodating such a large investment at this point.

My thoughts are if Amazon did choose Raleigh, it would be for purely visionary reasons and not because the city best matches up to their stated wishlist. They would want to help Raleigh grow in such a way that suits their short term and long term needs, as well as attracts many other tech companies that could increase the overall talent pool.

Believe it or not, this could be a much more appealing option to them than choosing a city that clearly meets all of their requirements, but yet is not flexible enough to mold as Amazon wants.

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17 hours ago, Merthecat said:

Very interesting.  If Amazon were to choose Raleigh, the only place in downtown that I could envision HQ2 is along Harrington St., between Hillsborough and Peace. 

But I would really be surprised if Raleigh is selected in the first place.  I'm not sure the city is quite capable of accommodating such a large investment at this point.

That's my thought as well, but with a big swath of State Government land thrown in to get to the 400 acres they said they need. I suggested to the recruitment team, they should package this with the MLS proposal and wrap Amazon buildings around the stadium. Each proposal strengthens the other quite a bit. 

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In regards to MetLife, what exactly is it about Cary? I can personally say that I have never understood the business draw to this town. Unless the Town of Cary truly offers great financial  incentives and a more central Triangle  location? Or is it something more? Kind of like North Hills? Wake Forest? I am starting to answer my own questions and I don’t like where I am headed or the answers that I am reaching. :-(

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Cary is a great location for several factors. Close to the airport, close to interstate highways, executive housing, between Raleigh and Durham like RTP and can draw from labor from both areas and the availability of large corporate and business parks.  I have friends in north Raleigh and they hate Cary. I don't understand that given it is one of the safest cities over 100,000 people in the country, tight zoning, great neighborhoods etc.  

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5 hours ago, KJHburg said:

Cary is a great location for several factors. Close to the airport, close to interstate highways, executive housing, between Raleigh and Durham like RTP and can draw from labor from both areas and the availability of large corporate and business parks.  I have friends in north Raleigh and they hate Cary. I don't understand that given it is one of the safest cities over 100,000 people in the country, tight zoning, great neighborhoods etc.  

Perceived or not, it's the soul sucking monotony of the place. I know that there are plenty of cool places tucked away, and also lots of good ethnic restaurants, but it's largely a new town and governed by the separation of uses and car to get anywhere approach to life. Interestingly, North Raleigh is exactly that as well (from my vantage anyway). 

RE Metlife, I have this feeling that their target employee, looks for exactly this in lifestyle choices, as opposed to being walking distance from your favorite bars and coffee shops. 

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Seriously.  Get over the ITB complex. A win for Cary is a win for the Triangle.  A win for the Triangle is a win for us all.   Their demographic isn't pretentious hipsters.  It's funny, my friends in Cary never put down DTR but oh how Raleighites love to hate on Cary.  <eyeroll>

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10 hours ago, Julendsl said:

Seriously.  Get over the ITB complex. A win for Cary is a win for the Triangle.  A win for the Triangle is a win for us all.   Their demographic isn't pretentious hipsters.  It's funny, my friends in Cary never put down DTR but oh how Raleighites love to hate on Cary.  <eyeroll>

yooo, this obviously triggered you.  I don't even think what Jones said was all that controversial or groundbreaking.  Overall, Cary is a pretty bland place with residential in separate culdesacs, chain stores surrounded by acres of parking lots, pretty nice greenways, and pockets of local businesses if you know where to look.  Just unfortunate a by product of being planned when every trip was done by car so hard to overcome that.

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2 hours ago, Green_man said:

yooo, this obviously triggered you.  I don't even think what Jones said was all that controversial or groundbreaking.  Overall, Cary is a pretty bland place with residential in separate culdesacs, chain stores surrounded by acres of parking lots, pretty nice greenways, and pockets of local businesses if you know where to look.  Just unfortunate a by product of being planned when every trip was done by car so hard to overcome that.

In ref to cary

To paraphrase a headline from The Economist from a few years back "A suburb looking for a city"

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Raleigh voted #10 best city to live in out of 600 cities.  http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/article181870911.html

This dislike of Cary:  yes it is suburb but that does not make it less of a pleasant place to live. It is a great place to live, look at the home values, look at the growth, the schools etc.  I guess Raleigh people won't want to come to Cary for IKEA either   yall can still drive to Charlotte to avoid Cary LOL. 

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17 hours ago, Julendsl said:

Seriously.  Get over the ITB complex. A win for Cary is a win for the Triangle.  A win for the Triangle is a win for us all.   Their demographic isn't pretentious hipsters.  It's funny, my friends in Cary never put down DTR but oh how Raleighites love to hate on Cary.  <eyeroll>

You know, I have this theory that living in suburbs and being car dependent, makes people angry....

Seriously though, take a deep breath and re-read my other comment. Here are the cliff notes: "Perceived or not". I opened by ensuring I made no claim to a universal truth with that caveat. "Separation of uses". Objective truth embedded in suburban zoning laws. "Car to get anywhere". 99% objectively true. I've never used a "GoCary" bus, but imagine the routes cater to the carless. "Largely a New Town". As stated, objectively true depending on how you define "new".  I felt like this backdrop observation provided the causative framework for the other things I've pointed out. You also maintain that Cary and DTR are different by discussing them separately. And that is just the simple point of my post.....MetLife is aiming at one. Citrix and Red Hat aimed at another. Ok ok, "soul sucking" is a bit of a bash....but monotony is very much  codified in Cary. And I think it's fair to say that monotony sort of encapsulates why somebody might choose an older, urban environment over a suburban one (urban amenities sort of buried in that thought). 

Did you make that account just to counterpunch at the ghost you thought was coming to get you?  Now that you have it, why not weigh in on some of these threads with some thoughts on what you like, and why you like it.  I've tried to mellow some of my testiness (age is helping on that front) because I like this forum a lot and enjoy hearing from the other folks here. I try to back up my sharpest views with some reasons why, beyond just "I prefer". But sometimes it's just "I prefer". And I try to allow for others to have a "they prefer" because I value the different thoughts and opinions.  It's not just an echo chamber in here. 

One last thing....I certainly do hear people from the 'burbs bash downtown...the crime, the noise, the people peeing in the bushes. I am 1000% sure downtown has endured much more criticism  from the burbs than vice versa....my 30 years of living here has giving me more than enough 1st, 2nd and 3rd hand evidence to back that up. Most of the time I just shrug and invite people not comfortable with downtown, to just stay away without taking the criticism of my neighborhood too seriously. 

Sure, another last thing...I am a licensed civil engineer in the State of NC. My house has grass in the front and I trade garden vegetables with my neighbors over a picket fence. I go to sleep at 10 pm and wake up at 7am. I drive a 2010 Mazda. If this is your image of a hipster, then I imagine Cary must be full of them too....

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^^ Not sure what corner RHO is going on.

Fintech firm Lighthouse Networks is adding 50 more jobs in new Morrisville office.

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/11/01/fintech-firm-to-hire-50-at-new-morrisville-office.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2017-11-01&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1509565505&j=79096831

More Cary news (please no one get "triggered" by it).  MetLife at its Cary campus is adding a Techstars location for startup fintech companies.  This is in addition to the 500 jobs it is adding to the 1500 already there. (they promised the state at least 1300)  

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2017/11/01/metlife-to-team-up-with-techstars-on-digital.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2017-11-01&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1509565669&j=79096831

Edited by KJHburg
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