Charlotte area population statistics

[KJHburg]

I think it is a NC strength not to have one large state dominating metro area like Atlanta and Georgia.  as for attracted educated Raleigh Durham  together separately are some of the most educated metros in the country.  Yes CA and NY may have the super rich billionaires that skew the average per capita income upward but we have a lower cost of living than any of those high income states ANY of them we are less expensive NY NJ CT.     Charlotte in attracting a Fortune 100 company shows we can compete with the 6 million metro population of the sprawling city of Atlanta. 

[JRNYP2C]

17 hours ago, Phillydog said:

50 Biggest Combined Metros 2019, with single MSAs included.

NC - 3

TN - 2

VA - 1

SC - 1

GA - 1

(Nashville, TN CSA was bigger than Raleigh-Durham CSA in 2010.  Raleigh-Durham is growing faster;

Only California, Texas, and Florida have more in the Top 50.  Ohio is tied with North Carolina).

.New York-Newark, NY-NJ-CT-PA CSA	NY-NJ-CT-PA	22,589,036
.Los Angeles-Long Beach, CA CSA	CA	18,711,436
.Chicago-Naperville, IL-IN-WI CSA	IL-IN-WI	9,825,325
.Washington-Baltimore-Arlington, DC-MD-VA-WV-PA CSA	DC-MD-VA-WV-PA	9,814,928
.San Jose-San Francisco-Oakland, CA CSA	CA	9,665,887
.Boston-Worcester-Providence, MA-RI-NH-CT CSA	MA-RI-NH-CT	8,287,710
.Dallas-Fort Worth, TX-OK CSA	TX-OK	8,057,796
.Houston-The Woodlands, TX CSA	TX	7,253,193
.Philadelphia-Reading-Camden, PA-NJ-DE-MD CSA	PA-NJ-DE-MD	7,209,620
.Miami-Port St. Lucie-Fort Lauderdale, FL CSA	FL	6,889,936
.Atlanta--Athens-Clarke County--Sandy Springs, GA-AL CSA	GA-AL	6,853,392
.Detroit-Warren-Ann Arbor, MI CSA	MI	5,341,994
.Phoenix-Mesa, AZ CSA	AZ	5,002,221
.Seattle-Tacoma, WA CSA	WA	4,903,675
.Orlando-Lakeland-Deltona, FL CSA	FL	4,160,646
.Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington, MN-WI Metro Area	MN-WI	3,640,043
.Cleveland-Akron-Canton, OH CSA	OH	3,586,918
.San Diego-Chula Vista-Carlsbad, CA Metro Area	CA	3,338,330
.Portland-Vancouver-Salem, OR-WA CSA	OR-WA	3,259,710
.Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL Metro Area	FL	3,194,831
.St. Louis-St. Charles-Farmington, MO-IL CSA	MO-IL	2,907,648
.Charlotte-Concord, NC-SC CSA	NC-SC	2,797,636
.Salt Lake City-Provo-Orem, UT CSA	UT	2,641,048
.Sacramento-Roseville, CA CSA	CA	2,639,124
.Pittsburgh-New Castle-Weirton, PA-OH-WV CSA	PA-OH-WV	2,603,259
.San Antonio-New Braunfels-Pearsall, TX CSA	TX	2,571,266
.Columbus-Marion-Zanesville, OH CSA	OH	2,525,639
.Kansas City-Overland Park-Kansas City, MO-KS CSA	MO-KS	2,501,151
.Indianapolis-Carmel-Muncie, IN CSA	IN	2,457,286
.Las Vegas-Henderson, NV CSA	NV	2,313,238
.Cincinnati-Wilmington-Maysville, OH-KY-IN CSA	OH-KY-IN	2,280,246
.Austin-Round Rock-Georgetown, TX Metro Area	TX	2,227,083
.Raleigh-Durham-Cary, NC CSA	NC	2,079,687
.Nashville-Davidson--Murfreesboro, TN CSA	TN	2,062,547
.Milwaukee-Racine-Waukesha, WI CSA	WI	2,047,966
.Virginia Beach-Norfolk, VA-NC CSA	VA-NC	1,859,197
.Greensboro--Winston-Salem--High Point, NC CSA	NC	1,689,151
.Jacksonville-St. Marys-Palatka, FL-GA CSA	FL-GA	1,688,701
.Providence-Warwick, RI-MA Metro Area	RI-MA	1,624,578
.New Orleans-Metairie-Hammond, LA-MS CSA	LA-MS	1,507,017
.Louisville/Jefferson County--Elizabethtown, KY-IN CSA	KY-IN	1,489,142
.Oklahoma City-Shawnee, OK CSA	OK	1,481,542
.Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson, SC CSA	SC	1,475,235
.Hartford-East Hartford, CT CSA	CT	1,470,083
.Grand Rapids-Kentwood-Muskegon, MI CSA	MI	1,412,470
.Memphis-Forrest City, TN-MS-AR CSA	TN-MS-AR	1,371,039
.Birmingham-Hoover-Talladega, AL CSA	AL	1,317,702
.Fresno-Madera-Hanford, CA CSA	CA	1,309,368

.

 

So, I'm a little confused at the differentiating line in two of the CSA's that are mentioned here, just due to overlap.  Washington-Baltimore-Arlington has DC-MD-VA-WV-PA as part of the overall CSA, then you have Philadelphia-Reading-Camden PA-NJ-DE-MD as their CSA.  Outside of the obvious large cities, how are MD & PA segregated out here?  Geographically, I'm still trying to see where the panhandle of MD is spliced up, and for example, where do Harrisburg and Lancaster fall?  And to put another caveat, what parts of WVA fall under the DC region that would not fall under the Pittsburgh-New Castle-Weirton CSA?  I get Wheeling and Morgantown - possibly put there.  Normally, I'm pretty good with figuring this out and with geography in general, but this one has me puzzled.

[videtur quam contuor]

Harpers Ferry W Va is about 50-60 road miles from D. C.

[QCxpat]

14 hours ago, KJHburg said:

I think it is a NC strength not to have one large state dominating metro area like Atlanta and Georgia.  as for attracted educated Raleigh Durham  together separately are some of the most educated metros in the country.  Yes CA and NY may have the super rich billionaires that skew the average per capita income upward but we have a lower cost of living than any of those high income states ANY of them we are less expensive NY NJ CT.     Charlotte in attracting a Fortune 100 company shows we can compete with the 6 million metro population of the sprawling city of Atlanta. 

Here are a couple of maps showing the geographic distribution of North Carolina's population. 

The urban crescent running from the Raleigh-Durham-Cary metro to the Charlotte-Concord-Gastonia metro is prominent.

 

Links:  

(1)  https://www.ncdemography.org/

(2)  https://www.maps4office.com/us-north-carolina-map-county-population-density/

(3)  https://www.cpc.unc.edu/

[kermit]

1 hour ago, JRNYP2C said:

So, I'm a little confused at the differentiating line in two of the CSA's that are mentioned here, just due to overlap.  Washington-Baltimore-Arlington has DC-MD-VA-WV-PA as part of the overall CSA, then you have Philadelphia-Reading-Camden PA-NJ-DE-MD as their CSA.  Outside of the obvious large cities, how are MD & PA segregated out here?  Geographically, I'm still trying to see where the panhandle of MD is spliced up, and for example, where do Harrisburg and Lancaster fall?  And to put another caveat, what parts of WVA fall under the DC region that would not fall under the Pittsburgh-New Castle-Weirton CSA?  I get Wheeling and Morgantown - possibly put there.  Normally, I'm pretty good with figuring this out and with geography in general, but this one has me puzzled.

So MSAs are defined as collections of counties that are connected to an adjacent urban core through the flow of commuters (this is a simplified definition). CSAs (as I understand them, I might be wrong) are collections of MSA# (and micropolitan areas) which are connected by the flow of commuters (but not necessarily connected to an urban core in the other metro) — I believe the threshold is that 15% of the workforce commutes into the other MSA.

CSAs can get really big because they can be chained together. For example, if 15% of Hagerstown commutes to Fredrick MD to work then it would be considered part of the Washington CSA even without sending any workers into the DC urban core of the metro. At the same time, if Easton MD (Its a micro) sent 15% of its workers to Anne Arundel then it would be part of the DC CSA as well. I am not sure how OMB handles situations where small metros or micros send more than 15% to multiple larger MSAs. 

We could have a single CSA spanning from Charlotte to Raleigh, pretty easily, but all three of those MSAs are large enough that the 15% figure can be difficult to reach (roughly 250,000 Greensboro-HP-WS folks would need to commute to somewhere in the Charlotte MSA for them to consolidate). [now that I have typed that I am not sure if the 15% figure is of total pop or just of the workforce]

I have been pretty aggressive about ignoring CSAs all my career so its possible I am wrong about all of this. 

Edited May 23, 2020 by kermit

[DH17]

28 minutes ago, QCxpat said:

Here are a couple of maps showing the geographic distribution of North Carolina's population. 

The urban crescent running from the Raleigh-Durham-Cary metro to the Charlotte-Concord-Gastonia metro is prominent.

 

Links: 

(2)  https://www.maps4office.com/us-north-carolina-map-county-population-density/

 

I really like the concept of these maps, but wow, they really got Forsyth and Guilford counties wrong. Looks like they are off by a decimal in the raw data (36K vs 360K and 50K vs 500K).

They made the Triad disappear!

Edited May 23, 2020 by DH17

[kermit]

50 minutes ago, DH17 said:

I really like the concept of these maps, but wow, they really got Forsyth and Guilford counties wrong. Looks like they are off by a decimal in the raw data (36K vs 360K and 50K vs 500K).

They made the Triad disappear!

Good catch. Guilford is nearly twice the size of Durham and Forsyth is nearly 50% bigger than Durham.

Both maps look like they are actually population growth. Maps need legends! (And the anamorphic “chart” isnt really a “map”)

Edited May 23, 2020 by kermit

[Tyrone Wiggum]

5 minutes ago, kermit said:

Makes me wonder if it is a mislabeled growth map.

In the parlance of the young people, map is trash. Iredell appears to be bigger than Gaston+Lincoln+Catawba combined. Lumberton is now apparently bigger than the Triad. Asheville is now 4x the size of Morganton.

/An attempt was made

[tozmervo]

4 hours ago, DH17 said:

I really like the concept of these maps, but wow, they really got Forsyth and Guilford counties wrong. Looks like they are off by a decimal in the raw data (36K vs 360K and 50K vs 500K).

They made the Triad disappear!

Hilariously, I could tell something was wrong from the opposite direction - I was like there's no way Randolph is that much bigger!

[KJHburg]

In speaking of CMSA consolidated metro statistical areas is the Raleigh Durham area which is 2 separate metros despite RTP being mainly in Durham County and many of their workers live in Wake County the other metro area.    When people talk about Nashville and its size just remember Raleigh Durham Cary is bigger if you put the 2 MSAs together.    My friends who live  in north Raleigh work in Durham County part of RTP go to the DPAC and dinner in downtown Durham and shop primarily in Wake County where they live.   I-540 traffic is heaviest in the morning heading to the RTP mainly to Durham county side.   However many that work at Duke and Duke Medical live in Durham, Chatham, Granville or even Alamance counties.  Morrisville and north Cary along I-40 attract commuters from all over the CMSA for their jobs.    I wonder if this will ever go back to one big metro area again?  

[davidclt]

On 5/23/2020 at 10:40 AM, DH17 said:

I really like the concept of these maps, but wow, they really got Forsyth and Guilford counties wrong. Looks like they are off by a decimal in the raw data (36K vs 360K and 50K vs 500K).

They made the Triad disappear!

Using a similar color scale using the 2019 data. I had no idea Lincoln county had such a small population compared to Gaston and Catawba. North Carolina really is pretty rural..

[cltbwimob]

On 5/23/2020 at 8:17 PM, KJHburg said:

In speaking of CMSA consolidated metro statistical areas is the Raleigh Durham area which is 2 separate metros despite RTP being mainly in Durham County and many of their workers live in Wake County the other metro area.    When people talk about Nashville and its size just remember Raleigh Durham Cary is bigger if you put the 2 MSAs together.    My friends who live  in north Raleigh work in Durham County part of RTP go to the DPAC and dinner in downtown Durham and shop primarily in Wake County where they live.   I-540 traffic is heaviest in the morning heading to the RTP mainly to Durham county side.   However many that work at Duke and Duke Medical live in Durham, Chatham, Granville or even Alamance counties.  Morrisville and north Cary along I-40 attract commuters from all over the CMSA for their jobs.    I wonder if this will ever go back to one big metro area again?  

I don’t know if it will go back to being one big metro again at least not in the near future given the current rules for defining metro areas.  In fact, it seems as if the relative socioeconomic “gravity” (as measured by commuting interchange) of the Triangle is weakening.  According to a 2018 update to MSA and CSA definitions, both Harnett County and Lee County were removed from the Raleigh-Durham CSA and became part of the Fayetteville CSA.  So it appears as if the economic pull of the Triangle is not as strong as it once was considering that fringe counties previously considered to be in the Triangle have been drawn out of that orbit.  
 

Having said that, I think the way we define a “metropolitan” area is quite dumb, at least on a semantic level.  In my mind, the combined statistical area should be renamed the metropolitan area/region, and further subsequent divisions such as  MSAs and Micro areas should be classed as something else.  Because of the way the definition is set up right now, you have these sort of asinine and meaningless subdivisions that tend to lead people to understate the size of metro areas such as the Triangle and the Triad.  This leads to a false psychological notion that such areas are smaller and thereby less important than they actually are.  Raleigh and Durham are not part of the same metro area according to the statistical definitions but anyone who knows anything about the state and it’s economic geography knows that such a division is inane.  The same applies to Greensboro and Winston-Salem.  The Triangle should be considered one metropolitan region (as should the Triad), and changing the nomenclature such that the term “Combined Statistical Area” becomes “Metropolitan area/region” would, in my opinion, eliminate confusion and more accurately reflect the true socioeconomic size and clout of a given region.

Edited May 25, 2020 by cltbwimob

[Cadi40]

I decided to do some research and measure cities populations by a constant area in order to provide for a more accurate reading of it's respective size. I measured cities by a 50 mile radius extending outside of their CBD area into the surrounding counties. All of these numbers are based on current population estimates. This data is approximate and there are likely some discrepancies.

Charlotte: 2,254,614

Raleigh: 1,956,959

Atlanta: 4,646,562

Austin: 1,518,867

Nashville: 1,676,899

Miami: 4,525,698

Dallas: 5,457,419

 

Obviously, for areas like Raleigh, some of the population displayed is actually population from the Triad, however it's still impressive that it's 50 mile radius is larger in population than Austin or Nashville.

 

Edited May 25, 2020 by Cadi40
Increased accuracy in data

[cltbwimob]

1 hour ago, Cadi40 said:

I decided to do some research and measure cities populations by a constant area in order to provide for a more accurate reading of it's respective size. I measured cities by a 50 mile radius extending outside of their CBD area into the surrounding counties. All of these numbers are based on current population estimates. This data is approximate and there are likely some discrepancies.

Charlotte: 2,254,614

Raleigh: 1,956,959

Atlanta: 4,646,562

Austin: 1,518,867

Nashville: 1,676,899

Miami: 4,525,698

Dallas: 5,457,419

 

Obviously, for areas like Raleigh, some of the population displayed is actually population from the Triad, however it's still impressive that it's 50 mile radius is larger in population than Austin or Nashville.

 

Good idea, but it looks like your numbers are a bit low.  Here is a link to a population calculator that will calculate the population (based on 2019 Census estimates) from 25-500 miles away from any city or county in the US:

http://www.statsamerica.org/radius/big.aspx
 

The 50-mile population around Charlotte is actually a touch over 3 million.  For Raleigh it’s approximately 2.75 million.

[Cadi40]

6 hours ago, cltbwimob said:

Good idea, but it looks like your numbers are a bit low.  Here is a link to a population calculator that will calculate the population (based on 2019 Census estimates) from 25-500 miles away from any city or county in the US:

http://www.statsamerica.org/radius/big.aspx
 

The 50-mile population around Charlotte is actually a touch over 3 million.  For Raleigh it’s approximately 2.75 million.

Correct, there were a few different websites and the numbers vary from 2.25 - 3.2 for Charlotte. The main takeaway from the data is that Charlotte is more on par with a city like Denver, rather than Nashville or Austin. 

Edited May 26, 2020 by Cadi40

[KJHburg]

another complicated MSA in NC is Wilmington which includes New Hanover and Pender county which is NE but not Brunswick across the river even though there are thousands of homes and commuters into Wilmington.  Census Bureau says southern Brunswick county has more people commuting to the Mytrle Beach metro so it classifies the whole county up to Leland across the river from downtown Wilmington metro Myrtle Beach.

A better way would be zip codes as some counties are huge like Brunswick and commuters can go 2 different directions.   

[Cadi40]

In addition to my previous research, I decided to make a list of the largest Metro areas in the United States using the ideology that they're each given a 50 mile radius to measure it's population. This idea makes it more consistent to comprehend their respective size, but also leads to contamination of data due to proximity of metro areas. I'm including the largest 23, which in reality ranges from NYC to Orlando.

1) New York City: 17,345,696

2) Los Angeles: 13,214,799

3) Chicago: 8,777,707

4) Washington DC: 8,480,174 (Includes parts of the Baltimore Metro)

5) Baltimore: 7,916,318 (Includes parts of Washington Metro)

6) Philadelphia: 7,614,618

7) Dallas: 7,360,274

8) Houston: 7,036,109

9) Boston: 6,825,635

10) Atlanta: 5,996,392

11) Riverside/ San Bernardino: 5,646,238 (Includes parts of L.A. metro)

12) San Fransisco: 5,179,446

13) Detroit: 4,750,123

14) Miami: 4,669,718 (Missing much of West Palm Beach)

15) Orlando: 4,620,570 (Includes part of Tampa metro)

16) Phoenix: 4,485,414

17) Seattle: 4,403,227

18) Tampa: 4,322,861

19) Minneapolis: 3,727,078

20) San Diego: 3,338,330

21) Denver: 3,247,861

22) Charlotte: 3,014,487 (Just for fun if you added an extra 25 miles to the radius to increase it to a 75 mile radius, Charlotte would be the 13th largest metro on this list with 4,754,303)

23) St. Louis: 2,754,235

Ironically Charlotte stayed in 22nd, but the most notable increases were in places like Orlando, which was on the bottom of the list and is now the 15th largest metro, however some of that data is contaminated. 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2020 by Cadi40

[Nick2]

The triad and the triangle should be considered one metro. It makes no sense for Forsyth/Guilford or Durham/wake to not be part of the same metro considering how many people commute between these counties. 

Also, @cltbwimob, Lee county not being part of Raleigh is absolutely nonsense.

@Cadi40 Orlando includes a good amount of Tampa and also Atlantic coast areas not associated with it. Just goes to show how built up Florida has really become all around.

[KJHburg]

View from JAX, Duval, Jacksonsville FL the nations 12th largest city ahead of Charlotte.   (and yes I know CLT metro is bigger but I am telling you cities brag on these inside the city limits population)

https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2020/05/28/census-large-cities-in-the-south.html

Last paragraph is newsworthy too  Only 3 states build more new homes than NC.   NC is 9th in population remember.  and yes we build more homes than slightly bigger Georgia. 

""Along with people, five states gained more than 50,000 housing units between 2018 and 2019: Texas (185,000), Florida (128,000), California (91,000), North Carolina (64,000) and Georgia (53,000), the Census Bureau said.""

drove through  this new DR Horton community in University area every home you see under construction is under contract.   We need more homes built in NC and in Charlotte! Photos from today.   Priced in the hot price range of 250-300K 

 

[videtur quam contuor]

Do the figures include manufactured housing? All types of manufactured housing?

[KJHburg]

11 minutes ago, tarhoosier said:

Do the figures include manufactured housing? All types of manufactured housing?

No that figure is just stick built houses and apartments is usually the way they count it.   Charlotte and Raleigh metro area in the top 20 of new home construction in the country.    Then add in the vacation homes being built in the mountains and the coast.  Wilmington is booming as is Asheville in housing too.  

[KJHburg]

great discussion about Charlotte population done by the CRBA and includes a UPer being interviewed. It is 27 minutes just listen in short segments or work while listening to it.  Great information  on it.

https://cltalliance.buzzsprout.com/940228/3939398-clt-alliance-talks-charlotte-s-meteoric-population-growth

[Cadi40]

I'm really curious to see what Florida does in the upcoming years in relation to global warming, billions upon billions of dollars worth of investment will literally go down the drain if they don't do anything to combat the rising sea levels.

[nicholas]

10 hours ago, Cadi40 said:

I'm really curious to see what Florida does in the upcoming years in relation to global warming

Tell everyone to open their windows and turn the air conditioning on to full blast, duh.

[Desert Power]

On 5/25/2020 at 10:10 PM, Cadi40 said:

22) Charlotte: 3,014,487 (Just for fun if you added an extra 25 miles to the radius to increase it to a 75 mile radius, Charlotte would be the 13th largest metro on this list with 4,754,303)

 

I wish we had better connectivity to the Triad, It is interesting that all of the counties growing fastest in that group with the 75 mile radius is basically the Charlotte MSA.