Amazon looking to build in GR metro

[wingbert]

19 hours ago, scottythe1nonly said:

LOL.   Hyperbole?

Why should GR leaders waste time on this?    The notion that the city has "the antithesis of a forward thinking city administration" because it's not wasting time, money, energy on this  is just absurd.    

Did you read the article?  

“It’s an opportunity for small cities to promote themselves—they can laud their advanced degree programs, transit-oriented developments...to the economic development market in a high-profile way.”

"It’s that kind of personal connection with the company that could lead to other backchannel deals, says Boyd. “Amazon could put a fulfillment or a back-office facility [in a small city], or they could encourage their mid-size vendors to move there,” he says. Amazon is in communication with most of the major manufacturers in the United States, many of whom might build headquarters of their own—putting your city on the map could mean a spot on the short list, says Boyd."

"Crafting the proposals gives cities a chance to reflect, to identify economic strengths and weaknesses, and to develop a strategy to win the next one even if they end up losing the biggest one."

The irony in your comment is that this whole conversation would be moot if Jeff Bezos had listened to that kind of advice early on.  LOL indeed.

Edited October 13, 2017 by wingbert

[GRLaker]

Honestly...Grand Rapids has not had to do much in the line of marketing campaigns in the last handful of years. Our rankings in just about every category for mid-size cities has done the job for them. Kind of makes you wonder if they even remember how to get creative in marketing 

With that said...I doubt Jeff Bezos cares about who comes up with the best cheesy video. The city that will land this or any consolation prize from it will be the one that has the best economic development team working their magic behind the scenes. It's not flashy, but it gets the job done.

[GRDadof3]

Nice! 108 page proposal to Amazon (won't be made public). 

http://www.mlive.com/business/index.ssf/2017/10/grand_rapids_bid_for_amazon_he.html

[arcturus]

What Chicago is offering.  Damn!

https://www.timeout.com/chicago/blog/the-10-sites-chicago-is-proposing-for-amazons-new-headquarters-102017

[scottythe1nonly]

Be careful what you wish for.  

https://www.treehugger.com/corporate-responsibility/why-amazons-headquarters-are-plotnick-diamond.html

[Kinkema]

1 hour ago, scottythe1nonly said:

Be careful what you wish for.  

https://www.treehugger.com/corporate-responsibility/why-amazons-headquarters-are-plotnick-diamond.html

Amazon didn't kill Seattle, in fact I don't think Seattle is dead...

Seattle has just failed on all counts to allow for development of non single family homes. Not saying Grand Rapids or any other city in the US would do it differently, but you can't blame Amazon for a city's mistakes.

[GRDadof3]

11 hours ago, arcturus said:

What Chicago is offering.  Damn!

https://www.timeout.com/chicago/blog/the-10-sites-chicago-is-proposing-for-amazons-new-headquarters-102017

I don't see Chicago getting it. Their finances are in ruins, crime is out-of-control, CPS is closing down a ton of schools due to families fleeing the neighborhoods. That would all come out in a due diligence period. 

[arcturus]

1 hour ago, GRDadof3 said:

I don't see Chicago getting it. Their finances are in ruins, crime is out-of-control, CPS is closing down a ton of schools due to families fleeing the neighborhoods. That would all come out in a due diligence period. 

Yet despite those facts the city has no less than 54 high-rises either under construction or mapped.

https://chicago.curbed.com/maps/chicago-tower-highrise-construction-map

The most intriguing to me is the former McDonald's HQ in Oak Brook.

[mpchicago]

5 minutes ago, arcturus said:

Yet despite those facts the city has no less than 54 high-rises either under construction or mapped.

https://chicago.curbed.com/maps/chicago-tower-highrise-construction-map

The most intriguing to me is the former McDonald's HQ in Oak Brook.

I counted 5 cranes in a 4 block area on my walk near Randolph and Halsted the other day.   The real estate market, both residential and office is hot in and around downtown.   However,  it's true between the corruption, taxes,  crippling debit, Chicago is probably not high on the list for Amazon.  You would crap your pants if you knew how much property taxes are on my bungalow.

Interesting how Grand Rapids' proposal was extremely low profile, to the point they didn't release any details except a few pictures,  of the booklet they sent, while other towns are putting on a circus.   I would have liked to see what GR put together. 

[arcturus]

24 minutes ago, mpchicago said:

Chicago is probably not high on the list for Amazon.

It didn't stop Seattle neighbor Boeing from relocating there.   I'm giving them the edge simply because of this despite the corporate differences.

Edit:  Amazon has at least 2 .. maybe 3 HUGE fulfillment buildings either completed or under construction there.  Not that they're putting them elsewhere.

Edited October 24, 2017 by arcturus

[GRDadof3]

31 minutes ago, arcturus said:

It didn't stop Seattle neighbor Boeing from relocating there.   I'm giving them the edge simply because of this despite the corporate differences.

Edit:  Amazon has at least 2 .. maybe 3 HUGE fulfillment buildings either completed or under construction there.  Not that they're putting them elsewhere.

Boeing moved a couple 100 people there, basically more of a symbolic move. Not 50,000 people. 

Amazon is building fulfillment centers all over the place, even in Detroit. 

[GRDadof3]

1 hour ago, arcturus said:

Yet despite those facts the city has no less than 54 high-rises either under construction or mapped.

https://chicago.curbed.com/maps/chicago-tower-highrise-construction-map

The most intriguing to me is the former McDonald's HQ in Oak Brook.

Yes, it is really fascinating the dichotomy of the failing city and the booming downtown. It's like Detroit x10 or x20. The epitome of the haves and the have nots. I heard a really fascinating theory from a Chicago area developer that the reason why the city neighborhoods have gotten so bad is because of the removal of all of the housing projects over the last 30 years. It pushed a lot of low income people and particularly gang members into neighborhoods where they weren't before, which created an entire new class of warfare and turf wars, and the fleeing of thousands of people from the city. So much so that despite all of the growth downtown, the metro area of Chicago hasn't had net domestic migration in over 20 years, and the metro area is now actually DROPPING in population, which puts it in a very unique category (only a handful of metros are losing population, like Cleveland, Toledo and Rochester NY ). 

While their murder rate is not the highest in the country, it's like #6 or #7 with about 30 murders per 100,000 people. Grand Rapids is around 3. Many of the other cities that I think have a better chance (Denver, Austin) are also pretty low. 

[x99]

20 minutes ago, GRDadof3 said:

Amazon is building fulfillment centers all over the place, even in Detroit. 

They have to, in order to keep customers.  Now that Amazon is charging sales tax, which placed it at a disadvantage versus smaller online retailers, it has to try to crush everyone else with next day delivery.  

As for Grand Rapids landing a major corporate headquarters, I'm torn.   First, I'm at the point where I don't want to see another soul in downtown unless/until the city stops intentionally snarling up traffic and plugging up all of the ramps.  I'm not convinced the geniuses in city hall could properly handle any sort of major influx to the area.  Secondly, I don't want to see a bunch of incentives thrown at someone to try to convince them to locate here.  This just imposes a mountain of costs on the rest of us as city leaders run to give away the farm to their shiny new MegaCo.  Now, if MegaCo comes in and says, "We'll pay our own way for infrastructure, roads, ramps, taxes, and impose discipline and proper retail/office management on your city hall", I'm all in.  But that's just not the way these things work.  It's a race to the bottom to maximize profits, not to act as good corporate citizens helping to maintain the social contract.

I will say I'm glad to see Right Place was involved.  I have a hard time Birgit Klohs would have been so stupid as to allow the city to sell its soul to Jeff Bezos.  

Edited October 24, 2017 by x99

[MJLO]

1 hour ago, mpchicago said:

Interesting how Grand Rapids' proposal was extremely low profile, to the point they didn't release any details except a few pictures,  of the booklet they sent, while other towns are putting on a circus.   I would have liked to see what GR put together. 

I was glad the GR EDC arms didn't put on a circus.  I think it speaks to a level of professionalism and experience not seen in some of the gimmicks that were sent out for attention.  There are a handful of other cities that also have kept details under wraps. 

[arcturus]

31 minutes ago, GRDadof3 said:

Boeing moved a couple 100 people there, basically more of a symbolic move. Not 50,000 people. 

Amazon is building fulfillment centers all over the place, even in Detroit. 

560 as of 2016 with a payroll most likely worth a few thousand Amazon jobs.  

[mpchicago]

29 minutes ago, MJLO said:

I was glad the GR EDC arms didn't put on a circus.  I think it speaks to a level of professionalism and experience not seen in some of the gimmicks that were sent out for attention.  There are a handful of other cities that also have kept details under wraps. 

I'm not suggesting that that GR should have put on a circus,  which I agree is silly.  I would have simply liked to have see the proposal, or even the basic outline.

[discgrab21]

51 minutes ago, mpchicago said:

I'm not suggesting that that GR should have put on a circus,  which I agree is silly.  I would have simply liked to have see the proposal, or even the basic outline.

Any chance somebody could or would FOIA the proposal?  The basis for not disclosing to the public is the proposed tax incentives, but that could easily be redacted, and we would be able to see the proposed site(s), renderings, and their take on transit infrastructure and housing. 

[scottythe1nonly]

1 hour ago, discgrab21 said:

Any chance somebody could or would FOIA the proposal?  The basis for not disclosing to the public is the proposed tax incentives, but that could easily be redacted, and we would be able to see the proposed site(s), renderings, and their take on transit infrastructure and housing. 

if it's even that detailed.  Me thinks it's more like the early pitches for the Olympics.  The kind that are void of detail but designed to get the IOC members interested enough to show up for their bribes.  
 

[GRDadof3]

4 hours ago, arcturus said:

560 as of 2016 with a payroll most likely worth a few thousand Amazon jobs.  

arcturus as much as I've liked debating with you in the past, I think I'll pass on this one.  

2 hours ago, discgrab21 said:

Any chance somebody could or would FOIA the proposal?  The basis for not disclosing to the public is the proposed tax incentives, but that could easily be redacted, and we would be able to see the proposed site(s), renderings, and their take on transit infrastructure and housing. 

I can probably guess where the sites are: 36th street old GM site, 201 Market (probably thrown in there), Meadowbrooke Office Park in Cascade near M-6.

I'd be surprised if they included renderings..  The Right Place tends to be more left-brained than right-brained. But I'll bet the data and supporting background info surpassed a lot of the other proposals. 

 

[wingbert]

Well that's that...

Amazon Chooses 20 Finalists for Second Headquarters

• Atlanta
• Austin, Tex.
• Boston
• Chicago
• Columbus, Ohio
• Dallas
• Denver
• Indianapolis
• Los Angeles
• Miami
• Montgomery County, Md.
• Nashville
• Newark
• New York
• Northern Virginia
• Philadelphia
• Pittsburgh
• Raleigh, N.C.
• Toronto
• Washington, D.C.

[scottythe1nonly]

Which one will give them the most money

[walker]

16 minutes ago, wingbert said:

• Austin, Tex.
• Columbus, Ohio
• Indianapolis
• Nashville
• Raleigh, N.C.

Not that I was looking forward to Amazon moving in but I wonder what was in the proposals of these other mid-size cities that made them more desirable than GR.  Off the top of my head, I see that all of them are state capitals with accompanying major universities.  None of them have nice beaches nearby and none of them as far as I know without doing some research have particularly strong mass transit, and none of them are airline hubs if that's important.   It would be nice for Birgit Klohs to know for the next big proposal.    

[GR_Urbanist]

58 minutes ago, wingbert said:

Well that's that...

Amazon Chooses 20 Finalists for Second Headquarters

• Atlanta
• Austin, Tex.
• Boston
• Chicago
• Columbus, Ohio
• Dallas
• Denver
• Indianapolis
• Los Angeles
• Miami
• Montgomery County, Md.
• Nashville
• Newark
• New York
• Northern Virginia
• Philadelphia
• Pittsburgh
• Raleigh, N.C.
• Toronto
• Washington, D.C.

 

So are you saying there is still a chance? 

[GRLaker]

2 hours ago, walker said:

Not that I was looking forward to Amazon moving in but I wonder what was in the proposals of these other mid-size cities that made them more desirable than GR.  Off the top of my head, I see that all of them are state capitals with accompanying major universities.  None of them have nice beaches nearby and none of them as far as I know without doing some research have particularly strong mass transit, and none of them are airline hubs if that's important.   It would be nice for Birgit Klohs to know for the next big proposal.    

To add to all of those...We're also only half the size of the majority in that list. 50,000 cubicles is a lot of seats to fill. They're more likely to be able to meet the demand.

Austin Metro: 2.06 million

Columbus Metro: 2.02 million

Indianapolis Metro: 2 million

Nashville Metro: 1.83 million

Raleigh-Durham Metro: 2.04 million

Grand Rapids Metro: 1.04 million

[wingbert]

5 hours ago, walker said:

Not that I was looking forward to Amazon moving in but I wonder what was in the proposals of these other mid-size cities that made them more desirable than GR.  Off the top of my head, I see that all of them are state capitals with accompanying major universities.  None of them have nice beaches nearby and none of them as far as I know without doing some research have particularly strong mass transit, and none of them are airline hubs if that's important.   It would be nice for Birgit Klohs to know for the next big proposal.    

Well you know, it wasn't that big a deal to try and use this as a learning experience.  This was a once in a lifetime anomaly, right?

Apple Announces Intent To Build Second U.S. Campus