Amazon: The Thread | 5,000 Jobs | 1M SQFT in Nashville Yards

[Dale]

43 minutes ago, henburg said:

I think we're straying into a topic that many of you have expressed disapproval with in the past. I'll simply say that regulation is something that isn't inherently bad and that there are a lot of things that we could potentially learn from other city governments. 

I can't speak to the reality of this group's demands, but their intentions seem to be coming from a good place. I love our growth, but it's obviously not all sunshine and rainbows- gentrification is a very real and easily observable phenomenon happening in Nashville. I think that our city government has failed to consider the perspectives of many in regards to development in the past and even very recently. So, why shouldn't there be a group invested in the interests of our longtime residents who are now being priced out of their neighborhoods? I think that holding our leaders accountable is something that is pretty important. 

Is it regulation that makes cities great ?

[samsonh]

Dale, want to respond to my post quoting you? Or omit that?

[FromParkAveToTN]

Why are these people protesting Amazon instead of updating their resumes to apply for some of the higher paying jobs that will come with Amazon?

[SoundScan]

7 hours ago, KJHburg said:

^^^Actually both Charlotte and Nashville have grown around 13.9% since 2010 (to 2017) and that is FASTER than Seattle, San Fran-Oakland, Los Angeles, San Jose Silicon Valley, San Diego, Portland OR  and any other west coast tech hub that includes the mountain tech hubs of Salt Lake and Denver (barely)   

Guess which tech center beats them all?   Raleigh NC metro grew over 18%!  

Now Seattle is the fastest growing metro on the west coast mainly because it is slightly cheaper than the San Fran San Jose Bay area and has lots of Californians moving north.  

From wikipedia with the Census estimates of the metro populations

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_metropolitan_statistical_areas

We're comparing two different data sets. I was comparing cities, you're looking at MSAs. http://factfinder.census.gov/bkmk/table/1.0/en/PEP/2017/PEPCUMCHIP.US12A?#

Both sets are legitimate ways to look at growth. Also important to look at raw numbers when comparing areas of wide size/population/SOI variation, as that has a larger real-world impact.

2010-2017

Seattle +490,000
Raleigh +287,000
Charlotte +309,000
Nashville +239,000
Denver +424,000
Los Angeles +911,000
Bay Area +684,000
Portland +280,000
Salt Lake +288,000
San Diego +242,000
 

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by SoundScan
wrong URL

[SoundScan]

5 hours ago, Dale said:

Is it regulation that makes cities great ?

Define "great." I think you'll find that everyone has their own definition.

The crux of this discussion is simple. People who prioritize a low cost of living over other factors are moving from more expensive areas to less expensive areas. As these low CLI areas become more expensive--which with growth is inevitable--these same groups will move on again, perpetuating this effect while seemingly unaware of the irony.

The ongoing narrative that this is a zero-sum game is silly--the raw data clearly proves otherwise (see above).

[Dale]

10 hours ago, samsonh said:

Dale, want to respond to my post quoting you? Or omit that?

Which post ? The one where we were quibbling over whether taxes had to be income taxes in order to complain about them ?

4 hours ago, SoundScan said:

Define "great." I think you'll find that everyone has their own definition.

The crux of this discussion is simple. People who prioritize a low cost of living over other factors are moving from more expensive areas to less expensive areas. As these low CLI areas become more expensive--which with growth is inevitable--these same groups will move on again, perpetuating this effect while seemingly unaware of the irony.

The ongoing narrative that this is a zero-sum game is silly--the raw data clearly proves otherwise (see above).

I don’t think people are much held back by the suspicion of irony. Rather, I think that affordability is the driver. 

The irony that concerns me is the taxers who find their own taxes intolerable, who then flee to friendlier climes to tax.

[DDIG]

9 hours ago, FromParkAveToTN said:

Why are these people protesting Amazon instead of updating their resumes to apply for some of the higher paying jobs that will come with Amazon?

Hey Hey Ho Ho These 5,000 High Paying Jobs Have Got to Go!

[PaulChinetti]

On the affordable housing front wouldn't PATHE be better served to go after the city/council and get them to do something like Minneapolis did?

More houses, means more affordable houses. 

https://www.citylab.com/equity/2018/12/mayor-minneapolis-2040-affordable-housing-single-family-zoning/577657/ 

[Dale]

5 minutes ago, PaulChinetti said:

On the affordable housing front wouldn't PATHE be better served to go after the city/council and get them to do something like Minneapolis did?

More houses, means more affordable houses. 

https://www.citylab.com/equity/2018/12/mayor-minneapolis-2040-affordable-housing-single-family-zoning/577657/ 

Minneapolis coming through like a stopped clock. Translation: it got something right.

[Hey_Hey]

The problem I have with the affordable housing crusaders isn't that they want affordable housing, it's that they go about it in a backwards manner.  The typical strategy is by mandating inclusion of affordable housing in new developments (inclusionary zoning) or through rent controls.  Neither of those strategies work for the majority of residents.  Those strategies will offer affordable housing to a very small number of people who are fortunate enough to live in one of those units, but it doesn't result in a change in affordability for the other 99% who aren't able to live in these new developments. Interestingly, these strategies of bringing affordable housing may actually backfire and cause rent increases because developers are less likely to invest in new projects. 

Affordable housing advocates need to do one thing: INCREASE THE NUMBER OF UNITS AVAILABLE

That's the only thing that is going to work for everyone and be sustainable.  The primary means of doing this is by welcoming developers into the city and allowing them to build units, as many as we can reasonably build.  This means instead of becoming NIMBYs, we need YIMBYs. We need to invest in the codes department to allow for a streamlined construction approval/permitting process, we need to increase height restrictions, and we need to increase density by changing zoning.  Our affordable housing advocates need to be going to Planning Commission meetings and encouraging increased scale when a project comes up and challenge neighborhoods when they try to push new projects out of their neighborhoods. 

Edited December 12, 2018 by Hey_Hey

[Guest]

I am going to have to pass on the Minneapolis solution...at least partially so.

A quick read, but my takeaway is the eliminate zoning (so far so good), but then have the government centrally-planning where the affordable housing will be built (historic fail). 

 

Quote

Minneapolis has a long history going back 100 years of redlining and intentional segregation. We literally have maps at the city that identify north Minneapolis as a slum for blacks and Jews. We need to make sure that the precision of our solutions match the precision of the harm initially inflicted. And that harm was precise.  

Quote

Moreover, I believe that affordable housing should be in every neighborhood. There’s a right to live in a great city. We should have a beautiful diversity of people, of socioeconomic background, in every neighborhood.

 

1 hour ago, PaulChinetti said:

On the affordable housing front wouldn't PATHE be better served to go after the city/council and get them to do something like Minneapolis did?

More houses, means more affordable houses. 

https://www.citylab.com/equity/2018/12/mayor-minneapolis-2040-affordable-housing-single-family-zoning/577657/ 

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by Guest

[satalac]

Affordable housing? Don't they know we have a park downtown by the library that all of these people can go to? 

[CityHeart]

14 hours ago, FromParkAveToTN said:

Why are these people protesting Amazon instead of updating their resumes to apply for some of the higher paying jobs that will come with Amazon?

Yes, updating their resumes is the solution. If we could just get this message to all of the teachers, social workers, nurses and service industry folks.  Why didn't someone  think of this sooner.  I know.. I know coffee house. 

[nashvylle]

6 minutes ago, CityHeart said:

Yes, updating their resumes is the solution. If we could just get this message to all of the teachers, social workers, nurses and service industry folks.  Why didn't someone  think of this sooner.  I know.. I know coffee house. 

it is a mix of sarcasm/trolling. Don't fall for it. 

[Tennessine]

24 minutes ago, CityHeart said:

Yes, updating their resumes is the solution. If we could just get this message to all of the teachers, social workers, nurses and service industry folks.  Why didn't someone  think of this sooner.  I know.. I know coffee house. 

He's joking

[Dale]

4 hours ago, nashville_bound said:

I am going to have to pass on the Minneapolis solution...at least partially so.

A quick read, but my takeaway is the eliminate zoning (so far so good), but then have the government centrally-planning where the affordable housing will be built (historic fail). 

 

 

 

People who swoon over diversity.

[CityHeart]

I thought his trolls only extended to adding more high-end fashion stores at every new development.  

[Guest]

I could be wrong, but memory tells me it is a woman....maybe because of the shopping references...not sure.

 

5 hours ago, nativetenn said:

He's joking

 

[BnaBreaker]

29 minutes ago, nashville_bound said:

I could be wrong, but memory tells me it is a woman....maybe because of the shopping references...not sure.

 

 

I'm pretty sure you're correct

[Tennessine]

My apologies! I falsely assume everybody posting here is a dude 

[titanhog]

2 minutes ago, nativetenn said:

My apologies! I falsely assume everybody posting here is a dude 

[Tennessine]

@titanhog I knew a while ago you were a lady. @BnaBreaker aren't you as well?

[Dale]

Mind blown.

[BnaBreaker]

31 minutes ago, nativetenn said:

@titanhog I knew a while ago you were a lady. @BnaBreaker aren't you as well?

Only on Friday night.  

[Tennessine]