Popsickle

Amazon HQ2

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^^^ I have contended almost from the get go that Atlanta would win this due its size and ability to absorb many 1000s of new people.  They have a huge site the Gulch near the Mercedes Dome that can be developed into millions of sq ft.  Plus they have 2 transit lines that intersect very near there offering access all over.  Plus they have a lot more available space downtown than we do as our uptown office market is much tighter.  In terms of business centers of the south Atlanta by far is #1 but Charlotte is #2 ahead of Nashville, Raleigh Durham etc   I would argue that the ATL is already in the top tier of cities in this country. 

That all being said Charlotte will do just fine without Amazon.  We have been absorbing more office space as % of total market than Atlanta for years and will likely do that again this year.  We are already one of the 10 fastest growing cities in the country.  And as I have said many companies will steer clear of the HQ2 winner and we can win them.   I am just being a realist here not a pessimist or excuse maker.  I think Charlotte's future is as bright as any city in the country due to many factors our location, our cost of living, our liveability, our tax structure, our airport, our pro business attitude.  I just wish this HQ2 search would wrap up and I contend Amazon has had a short list for quite some time and that has always included Atlanta.  There were reports last summer of firm needing 500K of space quickly in Atlanta and that was before this nationwide and continent wide search began. 

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32 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

^^^ I have contended almost from the get go that Atlanta would win this due its size and ability to absorb many 1000s of new people.  They have a huge site the Gulch near the Mercedes Dome that can be developed into millions of sq ft.  Plus they have 2 transit lines that intersect very near there offering access all over.  Plus they have a lot more available space downtown than we do as our uptown office market is much tighter.  In terms of business centers of the south Atlanta by far is #1 but Charlotte is #2 ahead of Nashville, Raleigh Durham etc   I would argue that the ATL is already in the top tier of cities in this country. 

That all being said Charlotte will do just fine without Amazon.  We have been absorbing more office space as % of total market than Atlanta for years and will likely do that again this year.  We are already one of the 10 fastest growing cities in the country.  And as I have said many companies will steer clear of the HQ2 winner and we can win them.   I am just being a realist here not a pessimist or excuse maker.  I think Charlotte's future is as bright as any city in the country due to many factors our location, our cost of living, our liveability, our tax structure, our airport, our pro business attitude.  I just wish this HQ2 search would wrap up and I contend Amazon has had a short list for quite some time and that has always included Atlanta.  There were reports last summer of firm needing 500K of space quickly in Atlanta and that was before this nationwide and continent wide search began. 

Oh I agree with you on everything you're saying.  I may not have articulated my point as well as I intended.   I think Charlotte is going to do very well in the future.  It's why I moved here.  I am just saying that some success of Charlotte might very well come as a byproduct of the success of Atlanta rather than a failure there.  

 

 

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I'm sure Delta is doing some major lobbying  to try and  get Amazon to move to ATL. They have invested a great deal in starting a hub in Seattle that will only compliment their Hub empire in Atlanta. 

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I really hope this goes to Atlanta. Mostly because they have this giant dead zone (the Gulch) right in the middle of their downtown that would require something of this magnitude to get a redevelopment off the ground. Charlotte doesn't really have any equivalent. Would it be transformative in Charlotte, well, yes, but Charlotte doesn't have anywhere quite like this where it literally fits like the missing piece of a puzzle. Hq2 would bring vitality to a part of Atlanta that is bristling with potential but has been depressed for some time. It would both boost MARTA ridership, and finally provide the spark to get Atlanta to build its long-overdue downtown train station and force the state of GA to get started on a commuter rail network as a part of the incentives package. I think Atlanta also makes sense for Amazon because the metro area is nearly three times the population of Charlotte's, with costs not that much higher. Congestion is a non-issue in Atlanta if Amazon goes for the Gulch, since MARTA is in place to bring workers in from many directions on day one.

I think we should look past regional rivalries and boosterism and look at where it would fit the best and have the greatest impact, which to me is clearly Atlanta.

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On 1/6/2018 at 6:26 PM, kermit said:

not just you, downtown Atlanta sucks. Like Charlotte, Atlanta a city of groovy neighborhoods (Highlands, Little 5, East Atl, Decatur, Midtown, the Clairmont District....) but they are a much bigger PITA to travel between there.

 

 

On 1/6/2018 at 10:58 PM, Cadi40 said:

I agree. At some points Charlotte seems much more lively then Downtown Atlanta. The only place at least I can find many people downtown is the centennial park or the coke factory/aquarium, and those are mostly tourists.

In terms of pedestrian activity, Midtown > Downtown.

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Charlotte is going to doing  just find with or without Amazon.   Charlotte at the present is having a hard time keeping up apartments and houses.   I think Amazon will ask too much to location to a new Headquarters 2 city.    In the last few years we have some companies to move their headquarters here,  including a Fortune 500 company. 

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Anybody know when the short list is supposed to come out? Seems like there is no date set at this point. I really want this to come to Charlotte but either way Amazon just needs to wrap this circus act up. 

This short list crap is just a way to keep them in the spot light. They know who they are going to pick, quit dragging it out. 

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From the Atlanta Business Chronicle what Gov. Deal says in an article today

""But Deal warned that Amazon may not choose a site for HQ2 until after the 2018 General Assembly session ends in March and may not even have released a short list by then.  "If Georgia makes the short list, I will call a special session so we can make whatever statutory changes are necessary," he said.""

Amazon is mucking up the whole economic development process for some cities as other companies hold off to see where this lands.  

and this news from Boston

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/2018/01/09/amazon-hq2-tax-breaks-boston-official-emails.html

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With NC offering up to 1.5 BILLION for a 4k job auto plant does anyone think what we put into our bid for Amazon is in that range or greater?

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1 hour ago, navigator319 said:

With NC offering up to 1.5 BILLION for a 4k job auto plant does anyone think what we put into our bid for Amazon is in that range or greater?

What's most interesting to me is Alabama only needed to offer $379 million.   Toyota said Randolph county was just too far from the supply chain and they feared it would cause problems.  

If Amazon looks at HQ2 in a similar light, and you assume they will, the supply chain of talent acquisition and retention is going to trump most every offer.  Atlanta > Boston > everyone else??  

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41 minutes ago, cjd5050 said:

What's most interesting to me is Alabama only needed to offer $379 million.   Toyota said Randolph county was just too far from the supply chain and they feared it would cause problems.  

If Amazon looks at HQ2 in a similar light, and you assume they will, the supply chain of talent acquisition and retention is going to trump most every offer.  Atlanta > Boston > everyone else??  

Alabama understood their differentiated value and superior location for Toyota's Just In Time manufacturing process. They didn't need to throw as much money at Toyota, because they could show the economic value their location brings for a Total Cost of Ownership that still came in lower than North Carolina. 

With Toyota's existing plants largely being located in the auto manufacturing belt stretching down I -65 and I-69 from the Midwest to the South, they will have more opportunities to extract synergies in their supply chain. And while North Carolina does have automotive parts suppliers, if they aren't CURRENT Toyota suppliers, it introduces new risk to the production system and suppliers that might not be as familiar with Toyota's demand for Just-In-Time manufacturing partnerships.

http://www.toyota-global.com/company/vision_philosophy/toyota_production_system/just-in-time.html

 

Amazon is going to behave VERY similarly. While incentives will be a major part of their discussions, finding the right workforce, a large enough metro for talent acquisition, and the right office environment is going to be more important. They should evaluate their site selection process from a Total Cost of Ownership, or holistically, rather than fixate on one factor like incentives. 

Edited by CLT2014
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^^^ That is why I know Amazon already has a very short list of cities it wants to go to that includes Atlanta, Boston, DC suburbs etc and this whole charade is to extract millions in incentives to the richest human ever (Mr Bezos) https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/jan/10/is-amazon-founder-jeff-bezos-the-richest-person-ever

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^^^ Interesting Boston and Seattle are similar in many ways ( I personally dont like the weather in either but Seattle wins this category)  Well I sure the average 100K salary will be able get an apartment there hopefully.   Not sure what corporate taxes are there though and personal income taxes are higher for sure than Washington state as they have no income tax. 

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This is from a nationally known site consultant asked by Atlanta Business Chronicle where he thought Amazon HQ2 go and this is really good. Sorry Charlotte is not mentioned on this list.  

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/2018/01/08/viewpoint-amazon-hq2-national-site-search-a-look.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2018-01-13&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1515851255&j=79497971

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50 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

This is from a nationally known site consultant asked by Atlanta Business Chronicle where he thought Amazon HQ2 go and this is really good. Sorry Charlotte is not mentioned on this list.  

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/2018/01/08/viewpoint-amazon-hq2-national-site-search-a-look.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2018-01-13&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1515851255&j=79497971

Probably the best HQ2 related article I have read. Thanks for the post!

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On 1/13/2018 at 3:43 PM, Popsickle said:

Probably the best HQ2 related article I have read. Thanks for the post!

Never realized that two meant several.  (Raleigh’s flights to European cities). 

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Move over Amazon HQ2 there is a new chase that may begin and I would believe it would NOT be in California maybe in Austin where they have 1000s of employees already.  But another elephant hunt may start soon and remember Apple has a huge data center in Maiden and solar farm etc.  http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-building-new-campus-hiring-20000-new-employees-2018-1   In the very least look for more expansion in Maiden and Catawba County.  But who knows this could land in NC maybe the Charlotte area?  

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38 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

Move over Amazon HQ2 there is a new chase that may begin and I would believe it would NOT be in California maybe in Austin where they have 1000s of employees already.  But another elephant hunt may start soon and remember Apple has a huge data center in Maiden and solar farm etc.  http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-building-new-campus-hiring-20000-new-employees-2018-1   In the very least look for more expansion in Maiden and Catawba County.  But who knows this could land in NC maybe the Charlotte area?  

Jealous of all the attention Amazon is getting.  Can Google be far behind?  Which leads me to this hypothetical:  if you could have any company establish a first or second HQ in CLT, who would you choose?  

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