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Cambria Hotel and Suites | 8-Story 155-Room Hotel [Approved]


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From Q4, 2018, according to the DDB. 

With 1,883 available hotel rooms, approximately 122,977 guests were lodged in downtown Orlando’s hotels for the 4 th quarter 2018. The average hospitality occupancy rate decreased from 72.8% to 72.4% compared to the previous quarter. Moreover, the average hospitality occupancy rate for the fourth quarter 2018 decreased by 1.46% and 4.61% compared to the same quarter in 2016 and 2017, respectively.

Downtown Orlando’s average daily rate (ADR) was $153.26, which is the highest when compared to Metro Orlando with an average daily rate of $127.32, Orange County with $134.94, and the City with $149.19. Additionally, downtown Orlando’s average daily rate (ADR) increased by 5.28% and decreased by 0.11% compared to the same quarter in 2016 and 2017, respectively.

http://www.downtownorlando.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Market-Report-Summary-4Q2018.pdf

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15 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

When downtown Orlando becomes a destination in and if itself, more hotels will be built. Right now, not that many out of town visitors come to Orlando just to see and stay in downtown.

they killed it, ya know... CSS... they had it going for many years in combination with neighboring attractions and they butchered it, cut it up, sold off the parts like Edward (whatever his name was in Pretty Woman-- Richard Gere) and killed it and sent downtown backwards as a tourist spot decades.  The MEC may bring a little back but they can't even get their stuff off the ground to add to the little that's already here tourist-wise...  

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11 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

When downtown Orlando becomes a destination in and if itself, more hotels will be built. Right now, not that many out of town visitors come to Orlando just to see and stay in downtown.

According to DDB, downtown hotel occupancy is about 70%. Since break even for most properties is 65-70%, they can make a lot more money out in the tourist zone.

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2 hours ago, smileguy said:

From Q4, 2018, according to the DDB. 

With 1,883 available hotel rooms, approximately 122,977 guests were lodged in downtown Orlando’s hotels for the 4 th quarter 2018. The average hospitality occupancy rate decreased from 72.8% to 72.4% compared to the previous quarter. Moreover, the average hospitality occupancy rate for the fourth quarter 2018 decreased by 1.46% and 4.61% compared to the same quarter in 2016 and 2017, respectively.

Downtown Orlando’s average daily rate (ADR) was $153.26, which is the highest when compared to Metro Orlando with an average daily rate of $127.32, Orange County with $134.94, and the City with $149.19. Additionally, downtown Orlando’s average daily rate (ADR) increased by 5.28% and decreased by 0.11% compared to the same quarter in 2016 and 2017, respectively.

http://www.downtownorlando.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Market-Report-Summary-4Q2018.pdf

So, if 123,000 guests stayed downtown over a 3 month period, that equals around 41,000 per month. There are 11 hotels downtown if you count the one on Orange Ave across from Orlando Health.

dtohotels.jpg

That's an average of about 3727 guests per month at each hotel, which works out to about 124 guests per hotel per day.

I guess that's a pretty good number and apparently it's keeping them profitable, but imagine if a thousand or two thousand more available rooms were suddenly tossed into the pot without a significant increase in the number of visitors.

I would think the current number of downtown hotels more or less reflects the current demand, though I'm sure that demand slowly but steadily increasing, and as it does, obviously we'll see more hotels going up.

But I still think downtown Orlando has yet to really come into its own as a destination unto itself.

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10 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

 

So, if 123,000 guests stayed downtown over a 3 month period, that equals around 41,000 per month. There are 11 hotels downtown if you count the one on Orange Ave across from Orlando Health.

dtohotels.jpg

That's an average of about 3727 guests per month at each hotel, which works out to about 124 guests per hotel per day.

I guess that's a pretty good number and apparently it's keeping them profitable, but imagine if a thousand or two thousand more available rooms were suddenly tossed into the pot without a significant increase in the number of visitors.

I would think the current number of downtown hotels more or less reflects the current demand, though I'm sure that demand slowly but steadily increasing, and as it does, obviously we'll see more hotels going up.

But I still think downtown Orlando has yet to really come into its own as a destination unto itself.

There’s also the question of meeting space. Now that whatever’s left of Expo Centre belongs to UCF, anything built will need room for meetings or else just cater to corporate/mom and pop travelers.

Given the cost of real estate downtown relative to more open spaces, it’s probably not surprising they’re not sprouting.

Of course, with TraveLodge and, quite possibly, Eo Inn coming offline, that will help a little. OTOH,SunTrust downsizing from the company’s onetime Florida HQ also hurts.

If GOAA is serious about commercial flights at Herndon, they might also do a hotel over there.

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16 hours ago, JFW657 said:

 

So, if 123,000 guests stayed downtown over a 3 month period, that equals around 41,000 per month. There are 11 hotels downtown if you count the one on Orange Ave across from Orlando Health.

dtohotels.jpg

That's an average of about 3727 guests per month at each hotel, which works out to about 124 guests per hotel per day.

I guess that's a pretty good number and apparently it's keeping them profitable, but imagine if a thousand or two thousand more available rooms were suddenly tossed into the pot without a significant increase in the number of visitors.

I would think the current number of downtown hotels more or less reflects the current demand, though I'm sure that demand slowly but steadily increasing, and as it does, obviously we'll see more hotels going up.

But I still think downtown Orlando has yet to really come into its own as a destination unto itself.

It doesn’t matter, Orlando is Orlando. 75 million visitors in one year which will increase is reason enough to continue to build hotels anywhere in Orlando rather it’s downtown or I drive, you know some folks don’t want to stay around Disney or the attractions, similar to folks not wanting to stay on the strip in Vegas.

Edited by Urban25
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21 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

If GOAA is serious about commercial flights at Herndon...

say whaaaaat?

 

10 hours ago, JFW657 said:

I wouldn't be overly surprised if a CV... er, rather... UCF/VD hotel gets built right there as part of the downtown campus.

I would venture to guess that is more likely than the MEC ever getting off the ground- or at least it's convention hotel component.  A convention hotel near a college campus is usually a guaranteed success.  Marriott is already there, but...they could absorb another one I think.

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7 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

say whaaaaat?

 

I would venture to guess that is more likely than the MEC ever getting off the ground- or at least it's convention hotel component.  A convention hotel near a college campus is usually a guaranteed success.  Marriott is already there, but...they could absorb another one I think.

I posted about that a couple of weeks ago in the OEA thread. GOAA’s in stealth mode about it or may just want to throw shade on Sanford...

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4 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

My guess is the market decided. If you go back to 1971 when the Magic Kingdom opened, there weren’t enough hotel rooms in the tourist area yet.

As a result, Howard Johnson’s (still a big player back then), included a map of every HoJo along I4 from US27 to Lee Rd.

There were still HoJos and Holiday Inns along OBT and 17-92.

On Colonial Drive, the new HoJo tower at Hughey and 50 (a clone of the one in DC where the Watergate burglars stayed was all the rage). The Hilton across from Parkwood Plaza doubled in size and there was a Sheraton across from Colonial Plaza.

In the end, the market decided. Once OC voters decided OCCC should be in the tourist zone and the opening of EPCOT brought the first luxury resorts, the die was cast.

When WDW decided (and later Universal) its success depended on keeping its guests on property in its own hotels, they built their own ersatz downtowns and provided free transportation from MCO to their guests.

Meanwhile, all the hotels and motels listed up top found they couldn’t compete and sold out.

Winter Park, arguably the place tourists coming into town would most like to see, has also lost most of their properties. The exception is the Alfond Inn, which caters to Rollins, WP business folks and the cultural tourists who visit.

You mentioned Vegas and the folks who don’t want to stay on the strip. Bob Snow of Church Street Station had the same idea and built in downtown Las Vegas. He went bankrupt.

Meanwhile, Downtown Orlando hotel occupancy has generally been lower and the growth slower than I-Drive and LBV.

We continue to add hotels but slowly because, as DDB points out, they tend to stay about 70% full, just above the 65-70% break even point for most properties.

Maybe all this will change but I’m not sure why it would. We have a wonderful downtown but it’s not the reason we have an airport in the US top 10.

The tourist quadrant is not the enemy. The parks are our largest property tax payers and they are our largest sales tax collectors.

The TDT paid for much of our downtown venues and fuel the accountants, lawyers, bankers and government workers downtown.

Personally, I’m thrilled the tourists stay in the tourist zone and pay the various taxes for civic amenities we use and they rarely see. It’s a win-win.

The voters of Orange County figured that out when they decided to put the convention center on I-Drive instead of at the old fairgrounds (leaving space for UCF/VD*). Heaven help us if we were to have that traffic added to downtown (and we don’t have the political heavy hitters to get a MARTA to help as the third largest MSA in the state instead of the biggest like Atlanta).

Given the resources we have, I think we’ve done well for a city that was the size of Lakeland or Ocala just 50 years ago.

* Props to JFW for our new nick for CV!

I think more scheduled events downtown could increase tourism.  One way is to host conventions, but you need expo space to do that.  The ATL has the GWCC downtown...we don't...and to get something meaningful that would mean the City is competing with the County, unless Orange County owned a subsidiary convention center located downtown, but they most likely wouldn't do that.  Sports events aren't enough- but more events could help.  

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12 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

I posted about that a couple of weeks ago in the OEA thread. GOAA’s in stealth mode about it or may just want to throw shade on Sanford...

wow.  missed it.  Yeah, MCO already "stole" Thomas Cook from OSI...and...maybe another one...

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6 hours ago, Urban25 said:

It doesn’t matter, Orlando is Orlando. 75 million visitors in one year which will increase is reason enough to continue to build hotels anywhere in Orlando rather it’s downtown or I drive, you know some folks don’t want to stay around Disney or the attractions, similar to folks not wanting to stay on the strip in Vegas.

Well, when you stop and think about it, Orlando isn't really "Orlando". The Orlando we know and love and the Orlando the travel agents sell and tourist brochures feature, are not for the most part the same Orlando.

Most people who fly into OIA from all over the country and the world to visit are going to "the other Orlando". 

And of course, the vast majority of those visitors prefer to stay in hotels near where they are going to be spending most of their time, in the tourist corridor. Sure, some people visiting the parks will, as you said, opt to stay downtown to see what our city is like, but compared to the total number, it probably doesn't even amount to a ripple on the pond.

Downtown Orlando might someday become an attraction itself and there will be more hotels there than you can shake a stick at, but there will have to be a strong market and a large demand which really isn't there just yet.

1 hour ago, jrs2 said:

I think more scheduled events downtown could increase tourism.  One way is to host conventions, but you need expo space to do that.  The ATL has the GWCC downtown...we don't...and to get something meaningful that would mean the City is competing with the County, unless Orange County owned a subsidiary convention center located downtown, but they most likely wouldn't do that.  Sports events aren't enough- but more events could help.  

That would certainly help, but really, the one thing that will increase tourism downtown is GROWTH.

When downtown Orlando develops into a truly cosmopolitan metropolis, people will visit there for a myriad of reasons, or just to be there.

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On 5/28/2019 at 4:06 PM, jrs2 said:

Oh how I wish that was the case for downtown Orlando, but unfortunately, the tourist corridor(s) do not translate to the downtown district.

 

 

12 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

I like this hotel a lot for the area. The design looks good, it isn't overwhelming in scale next to the Orthodox church next to it (although the deck and the church might clash a bit on Sundays) and doesn't block out views of the rest of downtown buildings from the lake. It has potential to add traffic to the lake and to Washington, with other GF retail space, and will fill in a nasty vacant lock and block out the monolithic AT&T building from view. 

Whole lot to like and I hope it goes through. 

I always tell people that a great city doesn’t need y’all buildings, just look at D.C

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I would be interested in seeing the hotel occupancy rate in greater detail. I know I've tried to get a room for visitors downtown and had trouble booking anything under $250/night, presumably due to high occupancy.  I wonder how much of this is event-driven with close to 100% occupancy, balanced out by non-event nights, and what those numbers look like.   

I think we need significant convention space - nothing like what's on I-Drive, but enough to hold 1,200 - 1,800 person events - to support a significant increase in rooms. 

You also have to think about overall room count in DTO over this period. We have added the Marriott back to inventory, along with Ustler's Residence Inn and Hampton Inn at Orlando Health (if it's part of this area) .

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35 minutes ago, smileguy said:

I would be interested in seeing the hotel occupancy rate in greater detail. I know I've tried to get a room for visitors downtown and had trouble booking anything under $250/night, presumably due to high occupancy.  I wonder how much of this is event-driven with close to 100% occupancy, balanced out by non-event nights, and what those numbers look like.   

I think we need significant convention space - nothing like what's on I-Drive, but enough to hold 1,200 - 1,800 person events - to support a significant increase in rooms. 

You also have to think about overall room count in DTO over this period. We have added the Marriott back to inventory, along with Ustler's Residence Inn and Hampton Inn at Orlando Health (if it's part of this area) .

We used to have the downtown Expo Center, but that never really did much to bring in out of town guests. I'm not sure the city would even want to attempt to compete with I-Drive and the big convention hotels down there anyway. I'm thinking maybe that area pretty much has the local convention market sewn up tight. 

54 minutes ago, Urban25 said:

I always tell people that a great city doesn’t need y’all buildings, just look at D.C

Sooo.... what is a "y'all building" anyway?

b7gemap5mdr11.jpg

I think we've got our share of them already!!!! :P

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On 5/28/2019 at 5:09 PM, JFW657 said:

When downtown Orlando becomes a destination in and if itself, more hotels will be built. Right now, not that many out of town visitors come to Orlando just to see and stay in downtown.

My wife and I used downtown Orlando as a "home base" when coming to vacation down here. We would stay at the Grand Bohemian hotel then drive from downtown anywhere we needed to go. We liked it so much we bought into downtown and now live here.  After I4 is completed it's going to be like a dream to visit this city. All the billions of investments going into downtown will really pay off. 

Edited by Jvest55
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23 hours ago, JFW657 said:

We used to have the downtown Expo Center, but that never really did much to bring in out of town guests. I'm not sure the city would even want to attempt to compete with I-Drive and the big convention hotels down there anyway. I'm thinking maybe that area pretty much has the local convention market sewn up tight. 

Sooo.... what is a "y'all building" anyway?

b7gemap5mdr11.jpg

I think we've got our share of them already!!!! :P

*tall 

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  • 2 weeks later...
1 hour ago, FLClarkKent said:

While I usually hate seeing trees taken down, this lot looks better cleaned up.

Also saw this sign on the lot today during a trip to the library.

Arbor Man does too. But the trees on that lot, didn't seem to be of significant age or size, etc....

cambrialot.jpg

....so it's not as bad as losing a large, spreading oak that's been in place for a hundred years.

Does that sign bode well for Cambria moving forward, or does it signify the end?

I notice it refers to first and second floors, so I'm assuming they plan to have a building there. I wonder if ground breaking is contingent at all on them getting signed retail leases.

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