Orlando's Hometown National Champions

[spenser1058]

2 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

So, Gus is a Power 5 coach.  It's almost like he's an "insider" if you will.  O'Leary not so much b/c he was there during the BCS years but not with the later realignment creating the Power & Group conferences.  So, this is good.

Spurrier was brash but he backed it up, and most of his commentary was reactive to other coaches mouthing off.  Goff was a crapty coach but was a douche ex-UGA QB from the mid-Seventies.  Spurrier didn't like UGA and didn't appreciate stupid comments bu Goff to the media.  That's why Goff never beat Spurrier, even when UGA had a "superior" team in 1992.  Spurrier respected UT and knew he had to win that game to have a shot at a good season.  The Citrus Bowl jokes- UT deserved it b/c of the douchebaggetry of their then-former coach, Johnny Majors, and his anti-UF politicking.  That was karma.  So I wouldn't be surprised at all if all the woes at UT in the past 15 years are a delayed karma to Majors' 'Gator Chomp' to the SEC in 1984 and likely also 1990.

Danny White talked a big game but UCF didn't back it up on the field.  The 2 for 1 drama got UCF air time, but the bulk of the Power Five just ridiculed and laughed when UCF couldn't win their own division.  It's just a fact.  So, after White talked and talked and then had to eat crow, he split in a more douchy fashion then when Franks split UF after he got hurt and realized his cry-babying was the only reason Mullen tolerated him as the starter in 2018 and beginning of 2019.

White had a job to do and he did it or tried to do it; can't fault him for that.  Give us respect! Oh wait, I'm going to be the AD at UF's rival, UT...  Nevermind.

That's White's legacy to me.

Yeah...Saint Bobby...Saint Bobby and Mickey Andrews...for another time...

Whether you liked it or not, the fact is that his maneuver did two things: first, UCF is now arguably the best-known team in the G5. We were just another directional school before.

Also, before Danny there was no discussion of CFP expanding for decades. Now, it’s about to happen. He made it so it couldn’t be ignored any more (the fact it may work out just fine for the SEC just made it easier).

As to the 2-for-1s, I think he learned very quickly after we demolished Stanford and Pitt that the world had changed (the fact we could beat P5 teams mattered more than how they felt about Danny). As to Florida changing, most of that is because Dan and Gus are buds and so are Scott and Terry. That wasn’t the case before. The Gators are also aware that recruiting in Central Florida just got a lot harder thanks to Gus and they need to show the flag down here.

It’s also the history of UF. The Gators were prodded by the state government to play FSU (and for the first 5 years refused to play in Tally). They also walked away from Miami when they could lose. We’re in good company as far as I’m concerned.
 

[jrs2]

50 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

Whether you liked it or not, the fact is that his maneuver did two things: first, UCF is now arguably the best-known team in the G5. We were just another directional school before.

Also, before Danny there was no discussion of CFP expanding for decades. Now, it’s about to happen. He made it so it couldn’t be ignored any more (the fact it may work out just fine for the SEC just made it easier).

As to the 2-for-1s, I think he learned very quickly after we demolished Stanford and Pitt that the world had changed (the fact we could beat P5 teams mattered more than how they felt about Danny). As to Florida changing, most of that is because Dan and Gus are buds and so are Scott and Terry. That wasn’t the case before. The Gators are also aware that recruiting in Central Florida just got a lot harder thanks to Gus and they need to show the flag down here.

It’s also the history of UF. The Gators were prodded by the state government to play FSU (and for the first 5 years refused to play in Tally). They also walked away from Miami when they could lose. We’re in good company as far as I’m concerned.
 

Nah, I agree. White made noise and made UCF a topic of discussion and the G5 issue.  And, you're right, UCF isn't really considered a directional school anymore.

Yeah...recruiting...Orlando aside, apparently there's not enough of a Gator presence in Jax of all places...which astounds me...a bone of contention amongst the O&B.

The 2 for 1.  Not to get into any of the logic or argument pro or con to agreeing to it...but...I think White hurt UCF a little by not agreeing to it and instead watching from the sidelines as USF did and is going to reap the $$$ benefits of it this season.  It's a moot point now, but his strategy was that of a Gitmo POW starving himself to get media play or a concession from a government that hoped they died anyway, or a girlfriend threatening suicide when you realize you would be better off without her anyway if she actually did.  I wouldn't be surprised if at the time, Scott was getting direction from the SEC Commish about whether to offer a 2 for 1 vs a 1 for 1.  And on that note, maybe the Big10 Commish was in on that decision making as well, making sure UF didn't "legitimize" UCF so to speak.  But as far as expanding the CFP, I think UCF thought they would always end up just on the outside of the Top 4, which would benefit their cause with an expanded 8 team Playoff.  But now, they couldn't even guarantee they would be ranked between the Top 5-8, or 5-12 depending on the scenario.  But I assure you, White's politicking only sent signals to the other P5 conferences to make sure that the CFP ensures that an expanded Playoff only means more teams from their conferences would get berths, and not G5 teams like UCF.  An expansion wouldn't be to benefit the G5, it would be to benefit the P5, because the other consideration is the longevity of the Bowl Games and how to make them more relevant in the age of the CFP.  And I guarantee you the pollsters in the AP would devalue UCF's ranking to ensure that the P5 benefited and use the strength of schedule factor in their hip pocket as a last resort to keep UCF out.  In the end, it's about $$$.  TExas and OU are moving to the SEC for better TV deals.  That's where the real money is.  But the teams have to win to get the ratings which brings big money contracts.

The games against Stanford and Pitt- good stepping stone games.  I say that because the negative, is that both wins were home games- Pitt was a .500 team, and Stanford was a 4-8 team; the away game vs Pitt was a loss the following year.  The best win would probably be on the road against GaTech b/c it was an away game, but Tech was only a 3-7 team.  It looks like you have to go to the game against Auburn in 2017 which would be considered a good win to get peoples' attention; that and the Bortles Ball game vs Baylor in 2014.

On the "good win" issue, by comparison, when Spurrier started coaching UF in 1990, to beat Tennessee on the road, UF had to wait until 1994.  Not that UF hadn't beaten UT on the road before; they did.  But for Spurrier, this was a big game.  They had lost on the road to good FSU, Auburn, Syracuse, Miss State, and UT teams up until then.  That same year they were wiping the field with FSU 31-3 on the road before the Choke at Doak, which cost them a berth in the NC vs Nebraska and gave Saint Bobby a second crack at UF who won a close game.  Prior to 1994, UF beat a crapty Auburn team on the road and crapty LSU teams on the road. The one good road win was Spurrier's first, at Bama in '90.    All Gator fans that were paying close attention knew up until 1994 that UF's best chances were during the odd years when UT and FSU were home games.  UGA was neutral site, and Auburn was the wildcard once Terry took over.  1994 changed all that.

UCF has not hit their "1994" yet.  Everyone thought they did in 1997 and with Bortles.  But UCF should already be talking to the Big 12 because the G5's road to the CFP will not be made easier by the P5.  Don't fool yourself.  If UCF is not talking to the Big 12 about a realignment or joining, then they will continue watching from the sidelines indefinitely.  IMO

[spenser1058]

1 hour ago, jrs2 said:

Nah, I agree. White made noise and made UCF a topic of discussion and the G5 issue.  And, you're right, UCF isn't really considered a directional school anymore.

Yeah...recruiting...Orlando aside, apparently there's not enough of a Gator presence in Jax of all places...which astounds me...a bone of contention amongst the O&B.

The 2 for 1.  Not to get into any of the logic or argument pro or con to agreeing to it...but...I think White hurt UCF a little by not agreeing to it and instead watching from the sidelines as USF did and is going to reap the $$$ benefits of it this season.  It's a moot point now, but his strategy was that of a Gitmo POW starving himself to get media play or a concession from a government that hoped they died anyway, or a girlfriend threatening suicide when you realize you would be better off without her anyway if she actually did.  I wouldn't be surprised if at the time, Scott was getting direction from the SEC Commish about whether to offer a 2 for 1 vs a 1 for 1.  And on that note, maybe the Big10 Commish was in on that decision making as well, making sure UF didn't "legitimize" UCF so to speak.  But as far as expanding the CFP, I think UCF thought they would always end up just on the outside of the Top 4, which would benefit their cause with an expanded 8 team Playoff.  But now, they couldn't even guarantee they would be ranked between the Top 5-8, or 5-12 depending on the scenario.  But I assure you, White's politicking only sent signals to the other P5 conferences to make sure that the CFP ensures that an expanded Playoff only means more teams from their conferences would get berths, and not G5 teams like UCF.  An expansion wouldn't be to benefit the G5, it would be to benefit the P5, because the other consideration is the longevity of the Bowl Games and how to make them more relevant in the age of the CFP.  And I guarantee you the pollsters in the AP would devalue UCF's ranking to ensure that the P5 benefited and use the strength of schedule factor in their hip pocket as a last resort to keep UCF out.  In the end, it's about $$$.  TExas and OU are moving to the SEC for better TV deals.  That's where the real money is.  But the teams have to win to get the ratings which brings big money contracts.

The games against Stanford and Pitt- good stepping stone games.  I say that because the negative, is that both wins were home games- Pitt was a .500 team, and Stanford was a 4-8 team; the away game vs Pitt was a loss the following year.  The best win would probably be on the road against GaTech b/c it was an away game, but Tech was only a 3-7 team.  It looks like you have to go to the game against Auburn in 2017 which would be considered a good win to get peoples' attention; that and the Bortles Ball game vs Baylor in 2014.

On the "good win" issue, by comparison, when Spurrier started coaching UF in 1990, to beat Tennessee on the road, UF had to wait until 1994.  Not that UF hadn't beaten UT on the road before; they did.  But for Spurrier, this was a big game.  They had lost on the road to good FSU, Auburn, Syracuse, Miss State, and UT teams up until then.  That same year they were wiping the field with FSU 31-3 on the road before the Choke at Doak, which cost them a berth in the NC vs Nebraska and gave Saint Bobby a second crack at UF who won a close game.  Prior to 1994, UF beat a crapty Auburn team on the road and crapty LSU teams on the road. The one good road win was Spurrier's first, at Bama in '90.    All Gator fans that were paying close attention knew up until 1994 that UF's best chances were during the odd years when UT and FSU were home games.  UGA was neutral site, and Auburn was the wildcard once Terry took over.  1994 changed all that.

UCF has not hit their "1994" yet.  Everyone thought they did in 1997 and with Bortles.  But UCF should already be talking to the Big 12 because the G5's road to the CFP will not be made easier by the P5.  Don't fool yourself.  If UCF is not talking to the Big 12 about a realignment or joining, then they will continue watching from the sidelines indefinitely.  IMO

In a very short time, “G5” and “P5” isn’t going to mean anything. 

There will be the SEC, the B1G, a “middle class” and everyone else.

The Big XII is a cobbled together mess that everyone has known would fall apart as soon as Texas and OU decided to leave - it just happened about two years more quickly than expected.

Now that Bowlsby has gone out of his way to p**s off ESPN (and if you believe him, ESPN  is in cahoots with the American), there’s really nothing holding it together. The American is much more cohesive (remember the head coach of a Big XII school left for a better berth at UH).

The schools of course will chase the money, but it’s humorous how little the money helps most teams. Texas, for example, has more money than God (it has the country’s second largest endowment after Harvard) but hasn’t been good on the field in years.

The Aggies paid a ridiculous amount to Jimbo Fisher to deliver an average performance. Houston has more money than just about any G5 school and has been mostly mediocre.

UCF has less money than all the schools in the SEC and we would have little difficulty defeating 2/3 of them. Tennessee is a vaunted “legacy school” and can’t even beat Georgia State (at home!) Meanwhile, the head coach at FSU has NEVER beat UCF (but did take our former QB and future head coach; Memphis. otoh, DID beat Ole Miss and would have no problem beating their state’s two SEC schools if those schools weren’t afraid to play them). Even worse, Penny is about to leave those schools in the dust in hoops and Vandy’s excuse for being in the SEC has always been basketball.

So, most of this stuff is vastly overrated. There is no “tradition” left (schools that were big rivals for decades gave all that up for $$$) and ESPN and, to a lesser extent, FOX Sports, will dictate who goes where based on revenue. Fortunately, UCF is in a big and attractive market that kids will want to go to (Lincoln, not so much, as Scott discovered), so we’ll be just fine despite all the noise you may hear for a year or two.
 

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by spenser1058

[jrs2]

2 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

In a very short time, “G5” and “P5” isn’t going to mean anything. 

There will be the SEC, the B1G, a “middle class” and everyone else.

The Big XII is a cobbled together mess that everyone has known would fall apart as soon as Texas and OU decided to leave - it just happened about two years more quickly than expected.

Now that Bowlsby has gone out of his way to p**s off ESPN (and if you believe him, ESPN  is in cahoots with the American), there’s really nothing holding it together. The American is much more cohesive (remember the head coach of a Big XII school left for a better berth at UH).

The schools of course will chase the money, but it’s humorous how little the money helps most teams. Texas, for example, has more money than God (it has the country’s second largest endowment after Harvard) but hasn’t been good on the field in years.

The Aggies paid a ridiculous amount to Jimbo Fisher to deliver an average performance. Houston has more money than just about any G5 school and has been mostly mediocre.

UCF has less money than all the schools in the SEC and we would have little difficulty defeating 2/3 of them. Tennessee is a vaunted “legacy school” and can’t even beat Georgia State (at home!) Meanwhile, the head coach at FSU has NEVER beat UCF (but did take our former QB and future head coach; Memphis. otoh, DID beat Ole Miss and would have no problem beating their state’s two SEC schools if those schools weren’t afraid to play them). Even worse, Penny is about to leave those schools in the dust in hoops and Vandy’s excuse for being in the SEC has always been basketball.

So, most of this stuff is vastly overrated. There is no “tradition” left (schools that were big rivals for decades gave all that up for $$$) and ESPN and, to a lesser extent, FOX Sports, will dictate who goes where based on revenue. Fortunately, UCF is in a big and attractive market that kids will want to go to (Lincoln, not so much, as Scott discovered), so we’ll be just fine despite all the noise you may hear for a year or two.
 

 

well, you do make a good point about waiting to see what happens when the dust settles b/c of Texas/OU.

I guess my point is that UCF has to make their luck; merely being in a big market doesn't mean anything.   Texas is Texas, money-wise as you even stated, and even they decided to make a major move for money and their future six months ago.

MEMPHIS:

I hate to keep bringing this up, but Memphis beat a 4-8 Ole Miss team in 2019.  And last year, Miss St (3-7) beat Tulsa in their bowl game, and Tulsa beat UCF in the Bounce House last year. 

Big XII:

So you are probably foreseeing the Big XII to devolve like the Big East did when it became the G5 AAC.  If KU leaves it will.  But the talking heads were saying that a team like Cincy would never join the B1G b/c of TOSU, and UCF wouldn't the SEC b/c of UF and perhaps not the ACC b/c of FSU and Miami--- and...that their best move would be the Big XII, and play with big teams like OSU, TCU, WVU, KSU, KU, Baylor, etc., with the understanding that the Big XII remained a conference. 

USF:

But this goes back to a criticism  I had of UCF vs USF back when USF made a play at the Big East just a few years into it's football life, while UCF was content in  Div 1-AA and later it's lowly conference (C-USA or prior) once it transitioned into 1-A and then complained when newbie USF beat them to the punch and blocked UCF's entrance into the Big East.   USF however screwed the pooch by not trying to make the jump to the Big XII before the Big East fell apart; as it was, WVU beat them to the punch.  UCF wasn't even in the mix of any decision making b/c they were C-USA; they were happy to take whatever bread crumbs were thrown their way after the failed conference invited them in.

USF beat UCF in it's ascension to a major conference with the notoriety that went along with it, and, was for years referred to as a Big East school, playing with the likes of BC, VaTech, Syracuse, WVU, Rutgers, etc.  But, USF UCF'ed themselves by becoming complacent and has since devolved because the Big East devolved to the AAC, and USF, who should've based on their track record, did not pay attention to what was happening to the conference, and now they are in the same predicament as UCF.   

REALIGNMENT:

And this is why the talking heads think UCF should make a move into the Big XII.  If you set your sights low, that's what you end up with.  Your trophies end up being 4-8 P5 wins and conference championship losers and secondary pollster services ranking your team number 1 based on record alone regardless of your strength of schedule.  And if you think that a possible realignment of conferences is going to work in UCF's favor, you are being unrealistic.  Case in point, the SEC remains as is, the B1G remains as is, the ACC remains as is, the PAC more than likely remains as is.  What's left is maybe a merger between the Big XII remnants and maybe the Mtn West/AAC.  If KU leave the Big XII, there goes basketball.  The PAC already made a dip into the Mtn West and got Utah, and the Big XII and got CU.  If anything, the PC may make a play for OSU and KU (unless KU goes to the B1G.  If that happens, there is no Big Xii just like there was no Big East when UCF was invited in; there was already a divorce decree except the ex-spouse hadn't moved out yet. 

So where does that leave UCF?  Are they the next ND?  Nope.  Gus is a good coach but he isn't the answer.  And I don't know if the situation is fixable for UCF.  And it will remain a perpetual beotch fest for it's fans claiming manifest destiny in the NCAA for years to come.  

The PLAYOFF:

Even with an expanded Playoff as the answer for UCF...the reality is that in an 8 team field, the SEC Champ gets in and 1-2-loss SECCG loser gets in and/or 1-loss SEC Divisional No.2 gets in or more.  That's at least 3 from the SEC.  Count B1G's two title contenders as being in with perhaps a 3rd.  At least the ACC Champ- maybe the ACC loser.  And now, the PAC champ gets in for sure.  That's 3+2+1+1 which is 7 for sure and if Miami or UNC are that good that's 2 from the ACC or if Oregon and/or U-Dub and USC are that good that could be 2 from the PAC to make it 8 teams in The Playoff= No UCF.

If it goes to 12 teams, the PAC gets the title contender in for sure, perhaps a 3rd, the B1G gets a Penn St or Wisc in, the SEC gets one more in, and the ACC gets another team in.  That's 12 and= No UCF.  

This is what's going to happen I guarantee you.  And the reason is b/c OU was a lock while in the BigXii.  But now, they may be penciled in as the SEC No.2 so you'll have Bama, UGA, OU, and maybe LSU, and maybe an A&M or UF depending on the year; Texas not so much just yet.   You could have 4 SEC teams in a 12 team Playoff and more than likely would b/c of OU's move.  If that happens, the B1G would scream bloody murder and the powers that be would make sure to invite yet another B1G team.  That's the domino effect at play, not justice for G5 UCF.

This is the reality.  It's not what I want; rather, it's what will happen.  Oh, and what about ND?  Do you think The Playoff would exclude a 1 to 2-loss ND team that's in the Top 15?  No way.

UCF's FUTURE ~ PAST:

So UCF gets left out yet again b/c college football doesn't need them, unless it's to write articles about lower division schools screaming injustice.  ABC/ESPN doesn't need them.  NBC doesn't need them.  UCF only plays in a 45k seat stadium.  At least Tennessee has a 110k seat stadium , tons of history, huge rivalries, a marquee conference and tons of money so if they suck, at least they've got that.

This isn't the Bobby Bowden  Seminoles that made notoriety by becoming road warrior giant killers in an age when  a ton of teams were Independents, like Miami, ND, Penn St, Pitt, FSU, Syracuse, VaTech, BC, WVU, etc.  Back then, it was a doable thing- play a schedule that could give you the best shot at making a New Years Day Bowl and the big money.  That was the name of the game until things started to change, and until all of those schools conferenced-up beginning in 1991.  But even in the Late '80's UCF was too busy being happy with Div 1-AA success in their playoff system.   

I just don't understand how UCF starts football in that manner and then all of the sudden USF gets into the game as a Div 1 team right out of the gate and gets into a major conference within a few short years and since then UCF spends all of this time trying to play catch up.  I mean I remember the Late '80's and UCF was the school you went to if you couldn't even get into FSU or afford UM; UF of course was out of the question.  Gene McDowell may have been a great coach, but how do you not have the vision to want to be 1-A?  Well, showing up late to the party isn't gonna get you laid by top shelf (male or female), especially when there are schools you are competing against that have been at this sort of thing for a hundred years.   USF knew this which is why they chose the fast track. 

To me, the mere existence of the USF Bulls football team is the biggest dagger in the hearts of UCF, because it shows UCF the mirror and how they fumbled through so many wasted years of Div III, II, and 1-AA and lower conference BS when they could've been positioning themselves for the big time from way back.  Ok, so they've had some big games and a parade on Disney's Main Street for the sake of PR.  But they'll never get into The Playoff unfortunately because of most all of the above.  But in the end I think the reason they ended up where they are is because of a sense of entitlement, which is why I think USF bested them to the Big East to begin with.  I think UCF's ceiling is the G5 or future equivalent.  Based on UCF's football planning track record, I don't see it's situation improving. 

UCF football is a secondary program that thinks it's not; that's the problem.

[spenser1058]

44 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

well, you do make a good point about waiting to see what happens when the dust settles b/c of Texas/OU.

I guess my point is that UCF has to make their luck; merely being in a big market doesn't mean anything.   Texas is Texas, money-wise as you even stated, and even they decided to make a major move for money and their future six months ago.

MEMPHIS:

I hate to keep bringing this up, but Memphis beat a 4-8 Ole Miss team in 2019.  And last year, Miss St (3-7) beat Tulsa in their bowl game, and Tulsa beat UCF in the Bounce House last year. 

Big XII:

So you are probably foreseeing the Big XII to devolve like the Big East did when it became the G5 AAC.  If KU leaves it will.  But the talking heads were saying that a team like Cincy would never join the B1G b/c of TOSU, and UCF wouldn't the SEC b/c of UF and perhaps not the ACC b/c of FSU and Miami--- and...that their best move would be the Big XII, and play with big teams like OSU, TCU, WVU, KSU, KU, Baylor, etc., with the understanding that the Big XII remained a conference. 

USF:

But this goes back to a criticism  I had of UCF vs USF back when USF made a play at the Big East just a few years into it's football life, while UCF was content in  Div 1-AA and later it's lowly conference (C-USA or prior) once it transitioned into 1-A and then complained when newbie USF beat them to the punch and blocked UCF's entrance into the Big East.   USF however screwed the pooch by not trying to make the jump to the Big XII before the Big East fell apart; as it was, WVU beat them to the punch.  UCF wasn't even in the mix of any decision making b/c they were C-USA; they were happy to take whatever bread crumbs were thrown their way after the failed conference invited them in.

USF beat UCF in it's ascension to a major conference with the notoriety that went along with it, and, was for years referred to as a Big East school, playing with the likes of BC, VaTech, Syracuse, WVU, Rutgers, etc.  But, USF UCF'ed themselves by becoming complacent and has since devolved because the Big East devolved to the AAC, and USF, who should've based on their track record, did not pay attention to what was happening to the conference, and now they are in the same predicament as UCF.   

REALIGNMENT:

And this is why the talking heads think UCF should make a move into the Big XII.  If you set your sights low, that's what you end up with.  Your trophies end up being 4-8 P5 wins and conference championship losers and secondary pollster services ranking your team number 1 based on record alone regardless of your strength of schedule.  And if you think that a possible realignment of conferences is going to work in UCF's favor, you are being unrealistic.  Case in point, the SEC remains as is, the B1G remains as is, the ACC remains as is, the PAC more than likely remains as is.  What's left is maybe a merger between the Big XII remnants and maybe the Mtn West/AAC.  If KU leave the Big XII, there goes basketball.  The PAC already made a dip into the Mtn West and got Utah, and the Big XII and got CU.  If anything, the PC may make a play for OSU and KU (unless KU goes to the B1G.  If that happens, there is no Big Xii just like there was no Big East when UCF was invited in; there was already a divorce decree except the ex-spouse hadn't moved out yet. 

So where does that leave UCF?  Are they the next ND?  Nope.  Gus is a good coach but he isn't the answer.  And I don't know if the situation is fixable for UCF.  And it will remain a perpetual beotch fest for it's fans claiming manifest destiny in the NCAA for years to come.  

The PLAYOFF:

Even with an expanded Playoff as the answer for UCF...the reality is that in an 8 team field, the SEC Champ gets in and 1-2-loss SECCG loser gets in and/or 1-loss SEC Divisional No.2 gets in or more.  That's at least 3 from the SEC.  Count B1G's two title contenders as being in with perhaps a 3rd.  At least the ACC Champ- maybe the ACC loser.  And now, the PAC champ gets in for sure.  That's 3+2+1+1 which is 7 for sure and if Miami or UNC are that good that's 2 from the ACC or if Oregon and/or U-Dub and USC are that good that could be 2 from the PAC to make it 8 teams in The Playoff= No UCF.

If it goes to 12 teams, the PAC gets the title contender in for sure, perhaps a 3rd, the B1G gets a Penn St or Wisc in, the SEC gets one more in, and the ACC gets another team in.  That's 12 and= No UCF.  

This is what's going to happen I guarantee you.  And the reason is b/c OU was a lock while in the BigXii.  But now, they may be penciled in as the SEC No.2 so you'll have Bama, UGA, OU, and maybe LSU, and maybe an A&M or UF depending on the year; Texas not so much just yet.   You could have 4 SEC teams in a 12 team Playoff and more than likely would b/c of OU's move.  If that happens, the B1G would scream bloody murder and the powers that be would make sure to invite yet another B1G team.  That's the domino effect at play, not justice for G5 UCF.

This is the reality.  It's not what I want; rather, it's what will happen.  Oh, and what about ND?  Do you think The Playoff would exclude a 1 to 2-loss ND team that's in the Top 15?  No way.

UCF's FUTURE ~ PAST:

So UCF gets left out yet again b/c college football doesn't need them, unless it's to write articles about lower division schools screaming injustice.  ABC/ESPN doesn't need them.  NBC doesn't need them.  UCF only plays in a 45k seat stadium.  At least Tennessee has a 110k seat stadium , tons of history, huge rivalries, a marquee conference and tons of money so if they suck, at least they've got that.

This isn't the Bobby Bowden  Seminoles that made notoriety by becoming road warrior giant killers in an age when  a ton of teams were Independents, like Miami, ND, Penn St, Pitt, FSU, Syracuse, VaTech, BC, WVU, etc.  Back then, it was a doable thing- play a schedule that could give you the best shot at making a New Years Day Bowl and the big money.  That was the name of the game until things started to change, and until all of those schools conferenced-up beginning in 1991.  But even in the Late '80's UCF was too busy being happy with Div 1-AA success in their playoff system.   

I just don't understand how UCF starts football in that manner and then all of the sudden USF gets into the game as a Div 1 team right out of the gate and gets into a major conference within a few short years and since then UCF spends all of this time trying to play catch up.  I mean I remember the Late '80's and UCF was the school you went to if you couldn't even get into FSU or afford UM; UF of course was out of the question.  Gene McDowell may have been a great coach, but how do you not have the vision to want to be 1-A?  Well, showing up late to the party isn't gonna get you laid by top shelf (male or female), especially when there are schools you are competing against that have been at this sort of thing for a hundred years.   USF knew this which is why they chose the fast track. 

To me, the mere existence of the USF Bulls football team is the biggest dagger in the hearts of UCF, because it shows UCF the mirror and how they fumbled through so many wasted years of Div III, II, and 1-AA and lower conference BS when they could've been positioning themselves for the big time from way back.  Ok, so they've had some big games and a parade on Disney's Main Street for the sake of PR.  But they'll never get into The Playoff unfortunately because of most all of the above.  But in the end I think the reason they ended up where they are is because of a sense of entitlement, which is why I think USF bested them to the Big East to begin with.  I think UCF's ceiling is the G5 or future equivalent.  Based on UCF's football planning track record, I don't see it's situation improving. 

UCF football is a secondary program that thinks it's not; that's the problem.

It’s so funny how you always make excuses for SEC teams that lose and at the same time say how much better they are than anyone else. You really can’t have it both ways. Simple truth - most SEC teams are no better than average.

The 4-team CFP is going away - why are you fighting the last war? Everyone including the head of the SEC says college football is about to be very different. Btw- how many times has UF been in the CFP with 4 teams?

As to UCF “fumbling”, that’s really not the case. USF jumped ahead (using the Miami model) and now have a program falling apart. They’ve never won their conference and never been in a NYD bowl ( we’ve been in three and won two).

Of course, we could have used the UF model and taken 70 years to win our conference but we didn’t do that either. Meanwhile, adding OU to the SEC is just going to make it that much harder for UF to make it to the top of the conference again. 

Edited August 12, 2021 by spenser1058

[spenser1058]

As of 8/11/21 our Knights have sold 97% of this year’s season tickets.

Charge On!

[jrs2]

13 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

It’s so funny how you always make excuses for SEC teams that lose and at the same time say how much better they are than anyone else. You really can’t have it both ways. Simple truth - most SEC teams are no better than average.

The 4-team CFP is going away - why are you fighting the last war? Everyone including the head of the SEC says college football is about to be very different. Btw- how many times has UF been in the CFP with 4 teams?

As to UCF “fumbling”, that’s really not the case. USF jumped ahead (using the Miami model) and now have a program falling apart. They’ve never won their conference and never been in a NYD bowl ( we’ve been in three and won two).

Of course, we could have used the UF model and taken 70 years to win our conference but we didn’t do that either. Meanwhile, adding OU to the SEC is just going to make it that much harder for UF to make it to the top of the conference again. 

this isn't about UF or Tennessee, and this isn't about crapty SEC teams either.  And if most SEC teams are no better than average, what does it say for UCF when a below average 3-8 Miss St. team beats Tulsa, who had already beaten UCF at home?

My main point is that those older programs are positioned so that they benefit from any Playoff or comparable money making scheme the NCAA or the networks hatch up, and UCF, even if they manage to ever go undefeated again, will still be left out because they won't be able to get a high enough ranking.

As crapty as "average" Tennessee has been for so many years, they are still light years better than UCF which is why UCF's main cheerleader and coach BOTH left when UT came a knocking.  

On the USF comparison, the record is clear that UCF was always one to two steps behind USF in the 'becoming a prominent football school department.'  I think what this means today is that if the Big XII comes calling to make a survival move, that they are going to invite USF over UCF if they need a Florida team.   I don't even think the two schools are on equal footing for it to be a debate- academically; not to get sidetracked.  Just read the first portion of both Wikipedia pages and that tells you everything:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_South_Florida

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Central_Florida

[jrs2]

https://www.si.com/college/westvirginia/wvu-football/examining-future-options-for-the-big-12-wvu

Well, maybe I jumped the gun about USF.  Here, they say if the Big XII invited teams from the AAC, it would be Houston, UCF, and Cincy, teams stating they wanted to move to the P5.

[jrs2]

On 8/12/2021 at 10:55 AM, spenser1058 said:

As of 8/11/21 our Knights have sold 97% of this year’s season tickets.

Charge On!

So I found an article on this "anti SEC" pact between the ACC, B1G and PAC.

https://www.si.com/college/ucf/university-of-central-florida-football/conference-realignment-and-the-pact

When I got to the end, only then did I realize that all of the charged hatred and bias against the SEC in that article was because the author was a UCF guy at FanNation.  Unbelievable.  The concession for UCF would be that those three Power Five conferences would take SEC schools off their respective schedules and instead schedule each other cross-conference, but also schedule some Group of Five teams, and UCF could be one of them.  More breadcrumbs.  

This is embarrassing.  

[spenser1058]

8 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

So I found an article on this "anti SEC" pact between the ACC, B1G and PAC.

https://www.si.com/college/ucf/university-of-central-florida-football/conference-realignment-and-the-pact

When I got to the end, only then did I realize that all of the charged hatred and bias against the SEC in that article was because the author was a UCF guy at FanNation.  Unbelievable.  The concession for UCF would be that those three Power Five conferences would take SEC schools off their respective schedules and instead schedule each other cross-conference, but also schedule some Group of Five teams, and UCF could be one of them.  More breadcrumbs.  

This is embarrassing.  

Obviously, you’ve never read Saturday Down South or listened to Paul Finebaum for total SEC fanboi chatter. It will take us years to ever catch up with that. 

[jrs2]

19 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

Obviously, you’ve never read Saturday Down South or listened to Paul Finebaum for total SEC fanboi chatter. It will take us years to ever catch up with that. 

Finebaum is an insufferable Bama fan.   

the point is that an Anti-SEC Pact only deals with the ACC, B1G, and PAC in inter-conference scheduling with each other to get more TV money, and the only involvement with UCF or the like is an ancillary one where they may schedule non-Pact games with them as an afterthought. 

Texas and OU combined accounted for more than 50% of the money in the Big XII.  That's staggering.  I do not think they could get that money back by replacing them with two G5 schools- not even three and probably not even four.   Because of this I think the Big XII might fold or devaluate itself like the Big East did and become a secondary conference.  What made the Big XII to begin with were the heavy hitters in the Big 8 (OU, Nebraska, Colorado) and prominent programs in the SWC (Texas, A&M, Arkansas, etc.).  Once Texas and OU leave, none of those 6 schools mentioned (including also Mizzou which makes it 7) will be part of that conference anymore.  That's 7 out of 12 from the 1996 lineup of schools.  Wow.

So, even if UCF  was invited in, it's not the Big XII anymore; it's probably now a newly formed "G6" conference that has Kansas BB as the headliner and OSU, Baylor and WVU football as the others.

[spenser1058]

1 hour ago, jrs2 said:

Finebaum is an insufferable Bama fan.   

the point is that an Anti-SEC Pact only deals with the ACC, B1G, and PAC in inter-conference scheduling with each other to get more TV money, and the only involvement with UCF or the like is an ancillary one where they may schedule non-Pact games with them as an afterthought. 

Texas and OU combined accounted for more than 50% of the money in the Big XII.  That's staggering.  I do not think they could get that money back by replacing them with two G5 schools- not even three and probably not even four.   Because of this I think the Big XII might fold or devaluate itself like the Big East did and become a secondary conference.  What made the Big XII to begin with were the heavy hitters in the Big 8 (OU, Nebraska, Colorado) and prominent programs in the SWC (Texas, A&M, Arkansas, etc.).  Once Texas and OU leave, none of those 6 schools mentioned (including also Mizzou which makes it 7) will be part of that conference anymore.  That's 7 out of 12 from the 1996 lineup of schools.  Wow.

So, even if UCF  was invited in, it's not the Big XII anymore; it's probably now a newly formed "G6" conference that has Kansas BB as the headliner and OSU, Baylor and WVU football as the others.

I’m gonna write something that you will find impossible - I have no interest in UCF being in the SEC, even if they came and asked us tomorrow. 

Now I know Terry and Dr. Cartwright would find it almost impossible to turn down because of the money, bu culturally it’s not a good fit for us.

The Big XII isn’t either. The American works for us because of the urban schools that make it up. Obviously, ECU isn’t, but nothing’s perfect (although every year that region of NC is growing and Greenville will be a Raleigh exurb before too long. Tulane is different but it’s in NOLA (‘nuff said).

There’s a history of schools believing they could do better outside the SEC. The Bobbys (Bowden and Dodd) both said no.

The difference between us is that you think everything is fixed in amber even though conference alignments have been changing forever.

If you believe Bob Bowlsby, ESPN is already making deals with the American to push the Big XII out. It’s been a mess since it was cobbled together. Compare that with the American, where the four major teams mostly get along.

The nature of diversity in our urban schools doesn’t mesh well with the Texas “church” school mentality of the Big XII, either.

Things change. In 1980, ‘Bama was invincible under The Bear. Soon, he was gone and ‘Bama was in the woods for a decade or more. It will likely be different next time because the State of Alabama passed a bunch of special perks for the school that virtually no other school in the country has. But, when Saban retires, we may see yet another dip in their fortunes (unless Coach Swinney abandons the Palmetto State).

15 years from now, schools like Mississippi State are gonna be just like they are today and ain’t nobody gonna be butting up stumps to make their NIL stand in Starkville. Otoh,  UCF just gets better.

Remember UCF’s down year in 2015, two years after winning the Fiesta Bowl? It lasted one year. Two years later, we were undefeated for two years. We fix things when they go wrong.

Compare that with Tennessee, which has been a mess for how long? Sometimes being mired in tradition ain’t a plus.
 

[jrs2]

58 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

I’m gonna write something that you will find impossible - I have no interest in UCF being in the SEC, even if they came and asked us tomorrow. 

Now I know Terry and Dr. Cartwright would find it almost impossible to turn down because of the money, bu culturally it’s not a good fit for us.

The Big XII isn’t either. The American works for us because of the urban schools that make it up. Obviously, ECU isn’t, but nothing’s perfect (although every year that region of NC is growing and Greenville will be a Raleigh exurb before too long. Tulane is different but it’s in NOLA (‘nuff said).

There’s a history of schools believing they could do better outside the SEC. The Bobbys (Bowden and Dodd) both said no.

The difference between us is that you think everything is fixed in amber even though conference alignments have been changing forever.

If you believe Bob Bowlsby, ESPN is already making deals with the American to push the Big XII out. It’s been a mess since it was cobbled together. Compare that with the American, where the four major teams mostly get along.

The nature of diversity in our urban schools doesn’t mesh well with the Texas “church” school mentality of the Big XII, either.

Things change. In 1980, ‘Bama was invincible under The Bear. Soon, he was gone and ‘Bama was in the woods for a decade or more. It will likely be different next time because the State of Alabama passed a bunch of special perks for the school that virtually no other school in the country has. But, when Saban retires, we may see yet another dip in their fortunes (unless Coach Swinney abandons the Palmetto State).

15 years from now, schools like Mississippi State are gonna be just like they are today and ain’t nobody gonna be butting up stumps to make their NIL stand in Starkville. Otoh,  UCF just gets better.

Remember UCF’s down year in 2015, two years after winning the Fiesta Bowl? It lasted one year. Two years later, we were undefeated for two years. We fix things when they go wrong.

Compare that with Tennessee, which has been a mess for how long? Sometimes being mired in tradition ain’t a plus.
 

that was a great post.

But I do not believe things are fixed in amber in the way that you think I might.  You don't want UCF in the SEC and the SEC doesn't necessarily want that either, but that's not what my point is about.

Regarding Bama, things never changed for Bama...the Bear left, they had a down decade, then they got good again, and then they got stellar with Saban.  They are still in the SEC and they still win championships.  The lull in the 80's was just that, a lull.  They weren't ousted from the SEC or from what would later become the P5.  

I watched the Bobby Bowden documentaries this week, one from 1986 and one from 1990.  The dynamic in college football back then was that there were several schools that were Independents and played cross-conference schedules.   Those major programs were the ones that finally made their way to conferences in the 1990's.   I don't think college football as a whole had respect for the SEC in 1990 as a conference any more than it did for the Big 10 or Big 8.  Instead, Independents were seen by many as the way to go when gaging what FSU, Miami, ND, and Penn St. had been able to accomplish over those years.  NYD bowls paid in the millions while lesser bowls paid a fraction of that.   FSU saw the utility in an easier schedule to get to those games and opted for the ACC over the SEC in 1992. Meanwhile, the SEC evolved and began divisional play and a championship game to set itself apart from the rest of college football.  Strength of Schedule was a big factor back in the '80's and '90's and the SEC's move proved worthwhile to get it's champ into the title game. 

UCF is not part of that group of "upwardly mobile Independents" from the 1980's and never was b/c they were Div III and 1-AA during that time.  And that group filtered up into conference play in the '90's.  Then those conferences solidified with their core in '91 with the Big East.  In '92 (SoCar & Arky to SEC); in '92 (FSU to the ACC); in '94 (Penn St to B1G).  In '96 the merger of Big 8 & SWC occurred and the dumping of the lesser SWC schools.  After this, a new round of realignment in the 2000's saw the move of  Miami, BC, VaTech, Syracuse, Pitt, Rutgers, WVU, out of the Big East which dropped them to a G5 conference in the AAC. 

UCF wasn't part of any of this, whether as an Independent conferencing up nor as a member of a major conference making a parallel move.  Independents were not seen as lesser programs.  In some cases, they were better programs than those of conference teams.  So, UCF was not part of any of this history; not until 1996 and at best they were the 'non-conference weak home opponent' on major teams' schedules.  We all know this. 

The bouncing back that UCF did was good.  But, UCF would have had to have beaten LSU in 2018 to go undefeated back to back, and then finished higher than they did in 2019, and not tanked in 2020, to still be talked about seriously and to show that they were above the AAC.  Instead they showed that they are not.  They also showed by the departure of the AD, Heupel, Frost, that they are a stepping stone school as well.  

The dynamic of the '80's that saw a bona fide group of upper echelon football programs join major conferences was a once in a lifetime event; it began in the early 1900's, got standardized in 1930's with the advent of the AP Poll and several conferences, survived WWII, continued with the addition of the UPI Coaches Poll, continued with conference allegiances to bowls like the Orange, Sugar, Cotton, and Rose, saw the continued success of major Independents leading to conference affiliations for most of those teams, and eventually led to the Bowl Alliance, BCS, and The Playoff to choose a true No.1. 

I may see things being in amber, but from what I've seen, if a college team wasn't part of this ilk I just described, it cannot ever be.  UCF as a school is too new, and the football team was formed when Bobby Bowden fielded his finest FSU team to date.  UCF needed heavy hitters to start that program and evolve it fast in the '80's to become part of that wave of Independents.  They didn't, and the once in a lifetime exodus of the major Independents in the early '90's happened without them even being in 1-A.   Miami in the '80's was so good, all eyes were on their rivalry with FSU and whether either would conference-up.  Once Miami chartered The Big East in football, the rest of the Independents followed (sans ND).  The popularity and success of Notre Dame throughout the century is perhaps the greatest catalyst to the success of college football throughout the years and their Independent status gave validity to that "league" which included so many teams.  But the advent of FSU and Miami I believe spearheaded the Independents to conference-up in the '90's which evolved to what we have today in the P5.

 

[spenser1058]

18 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

that was a great post.

But I do not believe things are fixed in amber in the way that you think I might.  You don't want UCF in the SEC and the SEC doesn't necessarily want that either, but that's not what my point is about.

Regarding Bama, things never changed for Bama...the Bear left, they had a down decade, then they got good again, and then they got stellar with Saban.  They are still in the SEC and they still win championships.  The lull in the 80's was just that, a lull.  They weren't ousted from the SEC or from what would later become the P5.  

I watched the Bobby Bowden documentaries this week, one from 1986 and one from 1990.  The dynamic in college football back then was that there were several schools that were Independents and played cross-conference schedules.   Those major programs were the ones that finally made their way to conferences in the 1990's.   I don't think college football as a whole had respect for the SEC in 1990 as a conference any more than it did for the Big 10 or Big 8.  Instead, Independents were seen by many as the way to go when gaging what FSU, Miami, ND, and Penn St. had been able to accomplish over those years.  NYD bowls paid in the millions while lesser bowls paid a fraction of that.   FSU saw the utility in an easier schedule to get to those games and opted for the ACC over the SEC in 1992. Meanwhile, the SEC evolved and began divisional play and a championship game to set itself apart from the rest of college football.  Strength of Schedule was a big factor back in the '80's and '90's and the SEC's move proved worthwhile to get it's champ into the title game. 

UCF is not part of that group of "upwardly mobile Independents" from the 1980's and never was b/c they were Div III and 1-AA during that time.  And that group filtered up into conference play in the '90's.  Then those conferences solidified with their core in '91 with the Big East.  In '92 (SoCar & Arky to SEC); in '92 (FSU to the ACC); in '94 (Penn St to B1G).  In '96 the merger of Big 8 & SWC occurred and the dumping of the lesser SWC schools.  After this, a new round of realignment in the 2000's saw the move of  Miami, BC, VaTech, Syracuse, Pitt, Rutgers, WVU, out of the Big East which dropped them to a G5 conference in the AAC. 

UCF wasn't part of any of this, whether as an Independent conferencing up nor as a member of a major conference making a parallel move.  Independents were not seen as lesser programs.  In some cases, they were better programs than those of conference teams.  So, UCF was not part of any of this history; not until 1996 and at best they were the 'non-conference weak home opponent' on major teams' schedules.  We all know this. 

The bouncing back that UCF did was good.  But, UCF would have had to have beaten LSU in 2018 to go undefeated back to back, and then finished higher than they did in 2019, and not tanked in 2020, to still be talked about seriously and to show that they were above the AAC.  Instead they showed that they are not.  They also showed by the departure of the AD, Heupel, Frost, that they are a stepping stone school as well.  

The dynamic of the '80's that saw a bona fide group of upper echelon football programs join major conferences was a once in a lifetime event; it began in the early 1900's, got standardized in 1930's with the advent of the AP Poll and several conferences, survived WWII, continued with the addition of the UPI Coaches Poll, continued with conference allegiances to bowls like the Orange, Sugar, Cotton, and Rose, saw the continued success of major Independents leading to conference affiliations for most of those teams, and eventually led to the Bowl Alliance, BCS, and The Playoff to choose a true No.1. 

I may see things being in amber, but from what I've seen, if a college team wasn't part of this ilk I just described, it cannot ever be.  UCF as a school is too new, and the football team was formed when Bobby Bowden fielded his finest FSU team to date.  UCF needed heavy hitters to start that program and evolve it fast in the '80's to become part of that wave of Independents.  They didn't, and the once in a lifetime exodus of the major Independents in the early '90's happened without them even being in 1-A.   Miami in the '80's was so good, all eyes were on their rivalry with FSU and whether either would conference-up.  Once Miami chartered The Big East in football, the rest of the Independents followed (sans ND).  The popularity and success of Notre Dame throughout the century is perhaps the greatest catalyst to the success of college football throughout the years and their Independent status gave validity to that "league" which included so many teams.  But the advent of FSU and Miami I believe spearheaded the Independents to conference-up in the '90's which evolved to what we have today in the P5.

 

I love that you’ve fixed in place the nature of college football and that new powers can’t be successful but all the mediocre schools who happened to be around decades ago are guaranteed a spot. That’s a recipe for decline. 

Today, Amazon passed Walmart as the nation’s biggest retailer, just as Walmart previously passed Kmart, who passed Sears, who passed A&P for the title. 

Had you told Sears the day that the Tower opened in Chicago what was about to happen, they might have had a sImilar response to yours.

Steve Spurrier said that winning your conference is the most important goal in college football. If so, when’s the last time Florida did that? When’s it likely to happen again? I guess the Gators are obsolete? (They’re also ranked below Cincy, among others).

 

[spenser1058]

His seat was already warm but a new NCAA investigation into the Huskers’ 2021 program may make it even tougher for Frosty. Remember, the AD who hired him has already left:

https://www.actionnetwork.com/ncaaf/nebraska-cornhuskers-football-coach-scott-frost-under-investigation-ncaa-violations

From Action Network

 

[jrs2]

13 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

I love that you’ve fixed in place the nature of college football and that new powers can’t be successful but all the mediocre schools who happened to be around decades ago are guaranteed a spot. That’s a recipe for decline. 

Today, Amazon passed Walmart as the nation’s biggest retailer, just as Walmart previously passed Kmart, who passed Sears, who passed A&P for the title. 

Had you told Sears the day that the Tower opened in Chicago what was about to happen, they might have had a sImilar response to yours.

Steve Spurrier said that winning your conference is the most important goal in college football. If so, when’s the last time Florida did that? When’s it likely to happen again? I guess the Gators are obsolete? (They’re also ranked below Cincy, among others).

 

Your analogy to the Gators and winning the conference is apples and oranges ala obsoletetry

you mentioned the "new powers."  Cincy was a Big East team for many years prior to the formation of the AAC.  

you call certain schools "mediocre."  What is UCF?  Are they a school that's finishing in the Top 10 or Top 25 every year of it's existence?   What has UCF done to not be considered "mediocre?"  Here's what they've done: 2010, 2013, 2017, 2018, and I'll give you 2019.  Now balance that against all of the FBS losses they've had in head to head games over the years.   UCF didn't even finish in the Top 50 last year.  WTF? Even with QB Gabriel and Heupel in his 3rd year?  How is that possible for a "new power?"  UCF has ended the season ranked a few times in it's history at a very inconsistent clip.  That's not the mark of a "new power".  UCF's latest "run" ended after 2019.

Anyway, like I pointed out, The P5 that exists today was a merging of the conferences and the Independents that were playing at an elite level for decades leading up to conference realignments, and those conferences have been realigned already with those accomplished schools.

Amazon's success is based on sales.  UCF is not the Amazon of college football.  UCF as a program can't even get into the same conversation regarding football money with the P5 or with recruiting or with their brand; that's why their stadium is so small.  UCF is a K-Mart that had a good sale with the blue lights a couple of times and has people believing it has these great sales all of the time, like Amazon, when it doesn't.  UCF needed a Bobby Bowden to take a generic team and give it relevance by being a giant killer consistently until it becomes the giant.  UCF hasn't done this.

What value does UCF's win-loss record even have?  In 2019, UCF went 10-3 with a bowl win and finished ranked No.24.  Well, in 2015, UF finished 10-3 with 3 straight losses and still finished No.25.  In 2016, UF finished 9-4 with 3 straight losses and still finished No.14.  Now put UCF in that scenario and they'll be lucky to finish anywhere near the Top 25 or 30.  Keep reading:  The answer: not much value at all.

When the wheels came off in 2020, UCF didn't even finish ranked in the Top 50.  UCF was ranked No.11 at 2-0 when they lost to Tulsa.  Did that drop them 5 spots?  Nope.  It dropped them clear out of the Top 25, more than 15 spots.  Wow.  When has that ever happened to a football "power"?  That's not the mark of a program with respect.  The pollsters gave UCF the benefit of the doubt in 2020 but UCF proved everyone wrong.  UCF will be lucky to get into the Top 25 again in 2021.

The main point you refuse to accept isn't one about what I want, it's about what is, and that is the point that the P5 will not agree to an expanded Playoff unless it benefits those conferences by allowing more teams from those P5 conferences to get berths.  

[spenser1058]

Former Auburn/Kentucky QB Joey Gatewood is likely headed to UCF:

https://www.on3.com/news/former-auburn-kentucky-qb-joey-gatewood-likely-transferring-to-ucf/
https://www.on3.com/news/unc-mack-brown-pays-compliment-alabama-clemson/

He played for Gus at Auburn and is from Jax, so likely a good fit. Charge On!

 

[spenser1058]

Marc Daniels notes this is the first year since 1982 that no Florida team makes the top 10 of the AP preseason poll:

https://969thegame.iheart.com/content/2021-08-17-the-lack-of-florida-teams-in-the-top-10/
https://969thegame.iheart.com/featured/beat-of-sports/content/2021-08-17-the-lack-of-florida-teams-in-the-top-10/

From 96.9 The Game

[jrs2]

1 hour ago, spenser1058 said:

Marc Daniels notes this is the first year since 1982 that no Florida team makes the top 10 of the AP preseason poll:

https://969thegame.iheart.com/content/2021-08-17-the-lack-of-florida-teams-in-the-top-10/
https://969thegame.iheart.com/featured/beat-of-sports/content/2021-08-17-the-lack-of-florida-teams-in-the-top-10/

From 96.9 The Game

good segment.  

FSU sucks now- post Bowden wet dream, and Miami's coach is clueless, in all fairness.  Florida has one of the best coaches in the country but has a very tough schedule and a question mark at QB and offense, and a question mark with the defense.  The problem is that UGA returns a starter at QB, Bama is on the schedule, and LSU is on the road.  That preseason ranking is based on the probabilities of whether UF wins or loses those three games.  Odds are they go 1-2 or worse, hence the ranking. 

If UCF still has Gabriel, they should do well this year. 9-2.  Boise lost it's entire coaching staff; so did UCF but they've got Gus.  I see UCF losing to Louisville at Papa John's but maybe not.  Louisville is in it's 3rd season with it's HC and 2020 was an off year.  But the cards are in UCF's favor in 2021.  If they beat Louisville, and manage to beat Cincy, a team that pundits have already said give them a Playoff spot if they run the table, then UCF can recapture that fervor and "glory" and limelight and reassert itself in the national spotlight.  This is a make or break year for UCF simply b/c of what's at stake with Cincy being so good and so highly revered; UCF can take their place.  Will they though?  Coach Luke is a very good coach and he's been there for five years.

W - Boise St.

W- BCC

L- at Louisville

W- at Navy

L- at Cincy

W - Memphis

W- at Temple

W- Tulane

W- at SMU

W- UConn

W- USF

[spenser1058]

Are you ready for a bigger, better Bounce House and Athletics Village?

UCF football stadium would grow in Athletics Village expansion
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/ucf-knights/os-sp-ucf-football-proposed-stadium-expansion-20210819-ejjq6cib2vag7jdb4har3bax4q-story.html

From The Sentinel 

 

Edited August 19, 2021 by spenser1058

[spenser1058]

3 hours ago, jrs2 said:

good segment.  

FSU sucks now- post Bowden wet dream, and Miami's coach is clueless, in all fairness.  Florida has one of the best coaches in the country but has a very tough schedule and a question mark at QB and offense, and a question mark with the defense.  The problem is that UGA returns a starter at QB, Bama is on the schedule, and LSU is on the road.  That preseason ranking is based on the probabilities of whether UF wins or loses those three games.  Odds are they go 1-2 or worse, hence the ranking. 

If UCF still has Gabriel, they should do well this year. 9-2.  Boise lost it's entire coaching staff; so did UCF but they've got Gus.  I see UCF losing to Louisville at Papa John's but maybe not.  Louisville is in it's 3rd season with it's HC and 2020 was an off year.  But the cards are in UCF's favor in 2021.  If they beat Louisville, and manage to beat Cincy, a team that pundits have already said give them a Playoff spot if they run the table, then UCF can recapture that fervor and "glory" and limelight and reassert itself in the national spotlight.  This is a make or break year for UCF simply b/c of what's at stake with Cincy being so good and so highly revered; UCF can take their place.  Will they though?  Coach Luke is a very good coach and he's been there for five years.

W - Boise St.

W- BCC

L- at Louisville

W- at Navy

L- at Cincy

W - Memphis

W- at Temple

W- Tulane

W- at SMU

W- UConn

W- USF

We should note that Cincy is no more revered than us. On College Game Day in 2018 we reduced them to shreds(yep, Luke was coaching). I get the impression you’ll always treat UCF like it’s 1990 or something. That’s what I mean about teams growing. We grow unlike teams mired in the past or USF, whose highlight as a program was being ranked #2 for one week a decade ago. Unlike us and Cincy, who both win conference championships and go to major bowls.

We slid last year under Heup (the SEC paying us to send him packing and delivering Gus to us is something we can’t thank them enough for). We are considered a peer of Cincy and have been since we both got in the American. They had a great year last year, as we did in ‘17. We’ll see if they repeat like we did in 2018. Good luck to them, they’re a great team and I’m proud to be in the same conference with them.

We’re predicted to be 2nd in the American this year (unsurprising with a new coach) and Cincy 1st. South Florida is at the bottom - they sure wish UCONN was still around.

 

 

 

[jrs2]

22 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

We should note that Cincy is no more revered than us. On College Game Day in 2018 we reduced them to shreds(yep, Luke was coaching). I get the impression you’ll always treat UCF like it’s 1990 or something. That’s what I mean about teams growing. We grow unlike teams mired in the past or USF, whose highlight as a program was being ranked #2 for one week a decade ago. Unlike us and Cincy, who both win conference championships and go to major bowls.

We slid last year under Heup (the SEC paying us to send him packing and delivering Gus to us is something we can’t thank them enough for). We are considered a peer of Cincy and have been since we both got in the American. They had a great year last year, as we did in ‘17. We’ll see if they repeat like we did in 2018. Good luck to them, they’re a great team and I’m proud to be in the same conference with them.

We’re predicted to be 2nd in the American this year (unsurprising with a new coach) and Cincy 1st. South Florida is at the bottom - they sure wish UCONN was still around.

Yeah, I was just going on  an ESPN thing where they were talking about this upcoming season and how they were like if Cincy runs the table...they're in.  Cincy has been good every year except year one with Luke.

Gus just has to come out of the gate firing on all cylinders.  He knows how to move the ball; I just don't recall what the knock on him was at Auburn.

23 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

Are you ready for a bigger, better Bounce House and Athletics Village?

UCF football stadium would grow in Athletics Village expansion
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/ucf-knights/os-sp-ucf-football-proposed-stadium-expansion-20210819-ejjq6cib2vag7jdb4har3bax4q-story.html

From The Sentinel 

 

they need to expand the stadium to over 60k.  the club seats in the end zone is good, it will make them $$$. coaches don't have to have their offices in there; use the space to make you money instead.

putting soccer stadium-like platforms that are standing room only is good.  UF has that under both the North and South end zones and those are my fav places to hang out in the shade on gameday.  If USF is talking about redoing the south end zone with that structure, then great.  If they are merely building the structure alongside the stadium then, meh.  At the least, they still get club seat money.

[jgardnerucf]

Best edit that post. Ahem.

[spenser1058]

More on what the stadium expansion is all about:

UCF AD Terry Mohajir: Proposed upgrades are paramount for where program is and needs to be
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/ucf-knights/os-sp-ucf-football-terry-mohajir-talks-football-campus-20210820-jxzszbomuvg6bfj7soihimzbmy-story.html

From The Sentinel 

Special for @dcluley98: Terry notes next up is a big expansion for soccer. He believes we have a huge upside to become a major college soccer power.

[aent]

5 hours ago, jrs2 said:

they need to expand the stadium to over 60k.  the club seats in the end zone is good, it will make them $$$. coaches don't have to have their offices in there; use the space to make you money instead.

 

From the presentation, the top floors would be entirely club seating. The lower level flat deck area would have a flex space club area in the front with coaches offices in the back facing the lazy river. The idea is no doubt to maximize $$$, while using the structure they build to also free up space for other areas of the expanding program. This is no doubt what they should have built on the east side of the stadium, instead of the nutrition building.

I think a big reason for the "expansion" on the student side is each of these renovations to create more premium seating has ultimately led to a reduction of seats in the section (although it increased the profitability of those sections). I think the capacity of the stadium is actually down like 3-4,000 since it opened, and the south side upgrades probably will take off another thousand seats. The stadium probably is in danger of falling below 40,000 seats after the new club is built, so the new sections on the north side probably are only going to bring it slightly above original capacity.